MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Thread Started on Jun 28, 2012, 1:33am »
So, in a few weeks the MW3 team is going to go over balance issues in the game (not just guns but possibly perks). Well bros, I say this is our time to shine. We should have a thread that we can spam @IWMarkRubin with and say "look here, we care too much, we have thought, and we... we have written."
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #2 on Jun 28, 2012, 2:30am »
My list would be far too extensive and consist of nerfing every full auto in the game...
but I imagine the MP7 and ACR will be nerfed, and the M16, PKP, and Desert Eagle[ammo] will be buffed if this does actually come to life. Id really like it if they also nerfed the PP90, all machine pistols, RF attachment, kick proficiency, and G36C[thru less random recoil] as well, though.
Balancing this game is impossible (for IW). They would have to change almost every weapon in the game.
Agreed ....
IMO, generally,.. (most important issues in yellow )
0. MP7: add some horizontal recoil !!!!! 1. Shotguns - back to secondary weapons. 2. Commando 3rd perk, but not as strong as it was in MW2, 75% would do. 3. Handguns less gunkick/recoil, more min damage. 4. LMGs – less idiotic gunkick 5. Ext Magz 8 not 7 for sniper rifles with 5 round magz. 6. Bring MW2: Raffica M93 back!!! 7. ACOG in Hybrid sights: less obstructive 8. Underbarrel shotgun: buff, it is used only to complete challenge. 9. M16: buff 10. MP5K: buff 11. UMP45: buff 12. PM-9: less recoil 13: Extreme Condition: buff 14: AK-47 less gunkick 15: Blast Shield: buff 16: Overkill: buff 17. Add second semi auto AR 18. Allow snipers to have “quickdraw” as 1 tier perk. 19. BRING BACK HARRIERS !!! 20. AS50: increase centerspeed. 21. CM901: increase RoF 22. L118A: buff to compete with MSR 23. Dragunov: buff 24. Remake of 4-6 most popular MW2 maps 25. Scorpion buff 26. G18 buff 27. ... 28. .. 29.
Etc etc …
When I think about MW3 almost everything is somehow “broken” …. Although I can have a lot of fun playing online.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #5 on Jun 28, 2012, 3:33am »
In no order
1.Rebalance the Dragunov \to actually make it OSOK all the way down to the chest w/out a silencer, and to the head and neck w/ with a silencer, as the gaming community wanted in the first place 2. Raise minimum damage to all pistols, and damage of Magnums and Deagle should be something like 50-33, and the other pistols should be around 40-20. Do what you want with the chest multipliers Keep the chest multiplier and have it for all pistols, for all I care. 3. Give the PM9 the same reload and draw times as the Uzi from previous games (.7 instead of 1.2 for raise time, and 2.4s for reload instead of 3.0s) 4. Give MP5 a slight buff to give it a reason to use over UMP45 5. Increase RoF of M16 and/or raise minimum damage from 25 to 30. 6. Buff PKP Pechang and MG36 to give more usage. Less recoil, gunkick and faster reload time(notably for the PKP), and maybe some feature to make it an AR hybrid or something. I don't know 7. Buff the AS50 to give it more use/nice alternative over the barret. Initially wanted it to have 90% movement speed, but people are gonna cry about beating the bolt actions, because its a semi auto. >_> So maybe decrease the recoil? 8. Give a slight buff to the L118A to give it a legit alternative use over the MSR? 9. Buff marksmen to see people's names through smoke grenades 10. Give CM901 slightly less recoil (or increase centerspeed) 11.offer akimbo attachment for model 1887, while increasing hipfire spread.. Or increase the base damage from 30 to 35.
« Last Edit: Jun 28, 2012, 3:39am by arcanine2009 »
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #6 on Jun 28, 2012, 4:45am »
1. Reduce hip spread for M16 - effectively make it have free steady aim, then it competes with the Type 95 'shotgun'. 2. Increase hip spread or decrease mag size on MP7. 3. Give all shotguns the movement glitch of the USAS. 4. Increase minimum damage of all shotguns (minus striker) to improve close range consistency. 5. swap the ranges between PP90 and PM9. 6. Overkill should allow users to travel at the speed of the faster weapon, not the slower weapon. That should be the simplest bit of coding ever and would make Overkill have a purpose. Would also act as a slight buff to shotguns and PM9 etc. 7. Agree: Dragonov chest modifiers, as above. 8. Agree: ACOG on Hybrid sight is useless, either needs to be less obstructive or should raise as fast as normal Acog sight. 9. Underbarrel shotgun: either needs to fire fast like a four shot striker (would not be OP as would often need all four to kill one opponent without damage or range) or it needs more pellets/power for consistency. 10. MP5K: give it super fast reload, effectively make it the SMG to use with Extreme Conditioning or Blind Eye. It's not that bad a gun, there is just no reason to use it currently. 11. UMP45: 5 shot kill at long range, increase the usefulness of where it already has a slight strength. 12. Bring back Cancel on Tactical Insertions. Sick of people camp killing. 13. In objective modes final scoreboard should show how many Captures, Defuses etc as it did in BLOPS. Who cares how many 'assists' you got in capture the flag? Maybe that guy who only got 5 kills was actually the guy who won the game! 14. Get rid of the permanent display of the flag carrier in Capture the Flag. Should only show up with UAV up. It's not like it's hard to get UAV's now... 15. Reduce raise time of all hand guns (quick drop currently has virtually no advantage over using an MP with SoH). Increase all handgun's long range damage and reduce their recoil. And give them some more bloody ammo! 16. Nerf the ACR a little, just to make the other AR's compete: perhaps a slightly longer ADS raise similar to FAD's slightly shorter one. 17. Increase FAD's 4 hit kill range, to create at least one distance where it is the best AR, however short that distance is. 18. Move Assassin's immunity to Marksman over to Blind Eye. Assassin is too powerful/ubiquitous. 19. Concentration should give at least 50% reduction in flinch perhaps more (was 80% in BLOPS and in no way OP, though you sacrificed more to have it). 20. Combine the deathstreaks of Juiced and Revenge. Currently no one uses either of them. Now you know where the enemy who killed you is and you can get there fast, so he can kill you again. After all, you just died 4 times in a row, it's not like you're the best player...
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #7 on Jun 28, 2012, 5:08am »
Should clarify on point 6:
"6. Overkill should allow users to travel at the speed of the faster weapon, not the slower weapon."
I mean the faster weapon when it's in use, I'm not suggesting LMG's should be running around at shotgun speed just because you have a shotgun on your back. Though considering that you have given up assassin, quick draw and hardline for the privelege and shotguns are little if any better than akimbo MP's, even that probably wouldn't be OP.
Also movement related though: LMG's and snipers with Speed proficiency should travel at that speed even when their secondary is out
Also movement related though: LMG's and snipers with Speed proficiency should travel at that speed even when their secondary is out
This. It annoys me to no end that I suddenly walk slower with my secondaries out. I'll take this opportunity to point out that this also happens with the Riot Shield too.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #11 on Jun 28, 2012, 1:05pm »
What are some of the changes people would like to see in the killstreak categories?
-I personally think that EMP should last 30 seconds. -Assault juggernaut should require less points to earn, or its weapons should allow it to continue the streak until the users final assault killstreak is unlocked. The Juggernaut M60 should also be brought in line with the regular M60 damage values. -Recon Juggernaut could use some slight tweeks. I would be content with Juggernauts recieving an additional 50% protection against akimbo FMG9s and MP9s. Rockets should do 999 direct impact damage.
Joined: Jan 2012 Gender: Male Posts: 444 Location: Phoenix,Arizona
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #12 on Jun 28, 2012, 1:13pm »
Giving the l118a quickdraw by default would make it overpowered compared to the other sniper rifles because it could now be used with assassin. Just give it 1.1 biceps multiplier
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #13 on Jun 28, 2012, 1:22pm »
The Type 95 wants to have its close range damage switched with the M16, making them both balanced. with the current damage, the MPs still are unbalanced, as the MP9 is basically a MP7 that is worse at close range.
That said i'd balance the game by this:
MagSize
DMG
RoF
Range
Recoil (U/L/R/D)
Other Notes
MP5
30 (45)
49-25
800
750-1000
70/70/80/30 (1700)
1.1 neck multiplier and less sway
UMP
32 (48)
42-33
650
750-1000
65/65/65/20 (1600)
PP90M1
36 (54)
35-17
1000
350-1000
65/65/60/45 (1650)
P90
50 (75)
35-17
850
450-1000
60/60/70/30 (1700)
PM-9
20 (30)
42-28
937.5
1500-2000
44/44/44/22 (1129)
AR hipspread and optics do not add recoil in any case
MP7
40 (60)
42-20
850
500-750
10/80/10/20 (1600)
for comparison, the PM-9 has very similar stats to the W@W fg-42, the mp7 has had a recoil increase, but still only has vertical recoil, the UMP has been made to be much longer ranged, and the P90 now is not totally better than the MP5, as the MP5 gets a larger 2hk area.
MagSize
DMG
RoF
Range
Recoil (U/L/R/D)
Other Notes
M4
30 (45)
42-20
800
800-1200
40/50/40/20 (1300)
M16
30 (45)
55-33
800
1000-2000
60/45/45/30 (1475)
SCAR L
30 (45)
35-20
750
1200-1800
40/25/50/10 (1100)
Headshot bonus of 1.5
CM901
20 (30)
49-33
665
1000-2000
40/40/40/20 (1100)
G36C
30 (45)
40-25
769
900-1600
75/35/35/35 (1600)
Type 95
30(45)
42-25
1100
1200-1800
50/40/40/30 (1200)
ACR
30(45)
35-25
705
800-1200
40/32/32/24 (1200)
AK 47
30(45)
49-33
689
1200-1800
60/60/60/30 (1200)
Mk14
20(40)
60-35
667
1000-1800
70/50/50/20 (1400)
has AR plus hipfire (think saw gripped)
FAD
40(60)
30-24
1000
800-1200
30/30/30/30 (1350)
1.7 HS
the FAD now has omni directional recoil, the CM901 is 20 rounds (forgot who thought of the idea, credit to them though), the ACR is weaker, but lower recoil, the AK is much the same, but has a range buff, the burst fire rifles have had their close range damage switched, and the M4 has a slightly higher fire rate
MagSize
DMG
RoF
Range
Recoil (U/L/R/D)
Other Notes
L86
50 (75)
38-38
800
50/50/50/30 (1700)
has 85% movement speed
MG36
100 (150)
40
769
20/70/70/20 (1500)
PKP
100 (150)
49-45
700
700-1100
60/75/75/10 (1700)
1.1 upper chest
MK46
100 (150)
40
857
50/60/80/30 (1700)
M60
100 (150)
60-35
550
900-1600
100/20/20/20 (1600)
The M60 is now a vertical recoil machine with better range, the PKP can 2 hit kill to the chest within a short distance, the L86 is an AR/LMG crossover, and the MG36 has purely horizontal recoil
MagSize
DMG
RoF
Range
Recoil (U/L/R/D)
Other Notes
SPAS 12
8 (12)
17x10
65
-1500
1 hipspread
KSG12
12 (18)
35-20*10
110
350-700
4 hipspread
Model 1887
8
60-35*8
67
400-700
6 hipspread
Striker
12 (18)
25-15*7
300
400-800
50/100/100/30 (700)
Has 5 hipspread
USAS 12
6 (9)
25-15*10
183
400-700
has 5 hipspread
AA-12
12(18)
20-10*8
400
300-500
100/20/20/30 (700)
has 7 hipspread
the recoil is meaningless, except on the AA-12, where it has vertical recoil, and the striker where it has side to side. Credit to den for the spas idea, and the KSG is a rehashed Stakeout with some buffs, the Model was buffed significantly, as was the AA-12, with the Striker and USAS receiving mild buffs. also ideally, damage would make it so that the shotguns shoot a slug with the slow pumps firing L118 bullets, the KSG firing a Barrett, the USAS firing a silenced barrett, the Striker firing a Silenced AS50, and the AA 12 firing a RSASS bullet. Also the 1887 hipspread would remain at 6
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #15 on Jun 28, 2012, 2:07pm »
This was painful to read.
What is it with people buffing the full autos to stupid levels, and then nerfing the T95/MK14? Neither are OP.
No fully auto gun in this game is bad. They are for the most part stupidly powerful and easy to use. The only hard to use full auto [PM9] can just be used as a shotgun and is no harder to use than any other SMG.
Arcanine/quickbuck, I like your ideas though. And MMA, thats a surprisingly viable solution to overkill.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #17 on Jun 28, 2012, 2:45pm »
This isn't a big deal compared to other things that need fixing, but the strafe run could use a little help. Make it so that a launcher can only take down one heli at a time instead of being able to get three in one shot. That thing is better for the enemy than you right now.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #18 on Jun 28, 2012, 2:46pm »
Here are some ideas:
-Give the AS50 and the L118A a bicep multiplier of 1.1x. -Give the Dragunov 98 base damage. -Switch the T95 and M16's max damage. -Change the SPAS 12's damage to 40-14. -Change the KSG's damage to 36-15. -Change the USAS 12's damage to 33-7. -Give the AA 12 three spare mages, decrease hip spread to 7, increase damage to 20-10 -Remove gunkick from the PM9 and what arcanine said about. -Do something to make the PKP and MG36 better. Like get rid of the gunkick on the PKP. -Nerf the Foxtrotting hell out of the FMG9 akimbo. Make it like treyarc akimbo weapons, something like 8-12 hipsread and 25-17 damage -Give the Deagle, .44 magnun, and MP412 something like 50-35 damage. The other handguns, give them 40-20 damage. They will still be clones, but they will be better clones. -Nerf the ACR to 40-29, you know for Touch Football.
Time for the probably controversial ones. I will admit, my bias for shotguns should be obvious:
-Buff the Model by increasing its damage to 49-33 and giving it 12 pellets at the cost of decreased max range to 10 meters. Basically, I want to turn this into a manual action akimbo rangers, but with only one shotgun. -Once again give the Striker 9 pellets at the cost of having its damage changed to 25-5. Maybe increase its hipspread to 6.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #22 on Jun 28, 2012, 4:06pm »
MP9 doesn't need any nerf, don't know why so many are asking. That thing is only good at range when silenced, and then, you will lose lots of range. Fair enough.
T95 should be 42-24 damage. M16 925 rpm, 1500cs, 1500-2000 range (CoD4ish, although this is optional), 45-30 damage.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #23 on Jun 28, 2012, 4:11pm »
Hello, I'm new here. Before I do this, I'm going to attempt to guess what's easier/ harder for IW to do. 1. Changing weapons multipliers is always going to be easier than changing base damage. 2. IW will likely not add perks, or weapons. 3. I don't know how easy it is to change range so it's likely that Also, I'll try to point out stuff I have a bias for/against.
Main Problems:
Assault Rifles
ACR superior to other assault rifles. Solution: Increase side-side recoil and lower min damage to 25.
Type 95 arguably overpowered. Solution: lower fire rate, increase recoil. Alternately, make it a 2 round burst.
CM901 needs a buff Solution: Keep the low fire rate, lower recoil to very low levels. (Bias for)
M16 needs a buff Solution: I would say raise min damage to 35, making it a 3 hit kill at all ranges. (Bias for)
Submachine guns
MP7's recoil making it too useful at all ranges. Solution: lower fire rate, raise recoil to keep plot the same.
PM9 needs a buff. Solution: raise range, lower hipfire radius a bit.
PP90M1 could do with a slight nerf. Solution: lower range.
MP5 needs a buff. Solution: unsure.
Shotguns
(Unsure, but I do know that we'd prefer MW2 power level shotguns.)
Striker is frigging annoying. (Bias against)
Light Machine Guns
Group consensus seems to want to buff the MG36 and the PKP, which I agree with and I have rarely seen. Furthermore the L86 also gets nerf cries, to which I say dealwithit.jpg
Sniper Rifles
Dragunov needs to be buffed again. Solution: Add damage for chest and neck
L118 needs to gain a buff, hopefully one that gives it a niche compared to the MSR. Solution: Unknown
Handguns
Desert Eagle could use a buff. Solution: One hit kill headshot up close, so a 2.1-2.5x head multiplier would do nicely.
Machine Pistols
MP9 is a little too strong. Solution: Increase raise/drop times significantly.
FMG9 akimbos are less of a problem these days.
Launchers
M320 is never used. Solution: increase radius beyond normal skill cannons
Javelin needs to be rebuffed. (Bias for) Solution: Leave it as it was before it was nerfed, only allow it to lock onto Juggernauts like it does with Assault Drones.
Perks
Tier 1
Blind Eye needs one more thing going for it. Solution: Add Marksman immunity from Assassin
Extreme Conditioning could be buffed. Solution: Running time could be set to infinite for the pro variant. Justification:It always feels like a step backward from MW2 where we had marathon. Furthermore, it's unrealistic for hardened special forces people to only be able to run like the fat kid in middle school track.
Scavenger could be buffed. (Bias for) Solution: Allow it to replenish tactical grenades. Pro replenishes lethal grenades and secondary launchers, but not skill cannons. Justification: Explosives are nerfed enough in this game, and their limited aspect is another slap in the face. Scavenger is rarely used as is.
Tier 2
Blast Shield Pro is a little weak. Solution: Move Dead Silence Pro's anti-Recon aspect to this.
Overkill is a little weak. Solution: See other posts in thread. They have pretty good ideas.
Assassin... needs a nerf. This may be a long part of this post, and its nerfs will affect other perks. Solution: If I could, I'd get rid of Assassin altogether. That's not an option. So...
Remove immunity to Advanced UAV, Portable Radar, and Counter UAVs. Move Marksman negation to Blind Eye Pro. Alternately, keep Counter UAV immunity and remove EMP immunity.
Tier 3
Working to get Sitrep Pro is a pain. Otherwise fine. Solution: the challenge relies entirely upon the enemy. Unsure how to improve though.
Killstreaks
Assault
Strafe Run could be moved around a bit. Solution: make it a 7 or 8 killstreak.
Assault Drone's gun needs a buff. Solution: I've shot people up to 5 times before killing them with this thing. It's a MK46, make it act like one.
Support
Recon Drone is impossible to shoot down. Solution: remove one or both flares.
Stealth Bomber should probably be moved around a bit. Solution: Perhaps moved to Assault as an 8 killstreak or kept in support as a 16 killstreak. Specialist
Nothing comes to mind.
Deathstreaks
Final Stand needs a nerf (Bias against) Solution: Add explosive shock when you go down with this. This doesn't allow one to instantly kill the one that put them down.
Don't know anything about hollow points.
Dead man's hand is kinda funny if you ask me (Bias for, but not too much) Solution: The recent nerf is enough.
Re: MW3 Weapon Balance Pass Thread « Reply #29 on Jun 28, 2012, 4:58pm »
I'm checking the stats, and the only difference between the two games' pistols is min damage. I'm fine with buffing that, but I really don't think that's an issue.
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