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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 13:18:38 GMT -5
I took about 15 minutes and made this today at lunch. I don't know if the numbers have already been changed in the last few hours, either way, ....it might be of help in trying to sort out BO2's killstreaks (scorestreaks). Especially in regards to chaining things. It sure appears like it will be easier to chain up low streaks now, with the new point system on objectives....but on the other hand, Air support streaks aren't scoring as high anymore (1/4 of a kill now, versus 1pt per kill before) So it appears like it will be harder to chain up higher streaks. The chart below is an attempt to try and put things into perspective. If a person ran a 5-9-12 Chain before in MW3....one can kind of cross reference to BO2's streaks. Like how many more kills are you going to need now for something similar. For example....BO2's Lodestar .....it's comparable to MW3's Reaper. But all things equal, one needs SIX more kills to make this happen now. (middle column in blue) That's a crazy premium compared to before. Is the Lodestar six times more powerful? On the other hand...BO's walking robot thing, it has a zero premium compared to MW3's assault drone. All things equal, this one is going to be much easier to get. What's up with that? Hopefully this helps, in keeping things organized in one's head. Print off and use on Tuesday. If not, please ignore.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Nov 9, 2012 13:21:27 GMT -5
It is interesting, although I'd recommend you make the image posted a clickable link to the original image. This is slightly blurry.
Also, my impression was that the VTOL was effectively an Osprey Gunner minus the care packages.
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 13:24:26 GMT -5
It is interesting, although I'd recommend you make the image posted a clickable link to the original image. This is slightly blurry. Also, my impression was that the VTOL was effectively an Osprey Gunner minus the care packages. I don't know. I read it's sort of similar to Blops CG. Which then, it's kind of, sort of comparable to the MW3 AC or/and Pavelow. Give or take a little. Either way...it has a pretty hefty premium to get. Four more kills than MW3's AC/Pavelow, with less stacking to get there. This might be kind of a wasted scorestreak to aim for. the pic is slightly blurry, as i just put it up as a jpeg pic.
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Post by rubixx on Nov 9, 2012 13:30:06 GMT -5
VTOL is like BO1 Gunship except you hit LB/L2 to advance to set positions above the map. It has rockets and a mini gun just like the gunship did.
Stealth Chopper is well worth the premium over attack chopper. It really racks up kills and it is literally almost dead silent. AGR is much better than the assault drone even if they have the same amount of power due to the fact that you it is autonomous and you have the option to control it. Same as sentry gun. Lodestar missiles shoot much faster to the ground than the reaper did. Swarm and Dogs are in a league of their own.
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 13:37:54 GMT -5
VTOL is like BO1 Gunship except you hit LB/L2 to advance to set positions above the map. It has rockets and a mini gun just like the gunship did. Thanks. It certainly seems like chaining streaks, like how done in MW3....is sort of done? It's back to being more like BlackOps, even though there is stacking?
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 13:43:41 GMT -5
I should have put this up on the Chart...From BlackOps, the old killstreaks.
In BO1, Gunship and Dogs were at 11. Now? It's 16 and 17. This is real kick in the balls. An extra premium of six and seven kills? That's asking a lot. Yes, there is stacking, but at 1/4pt per kill, one's low hanging score streaks aren't going to rack up enough points/kills to make up the difference it seems. Even if your Scorestreaks get you eight kills (which is a lot to hope for), that only works up to moving your counter the equivalent of two kills. You still need to find a way to get a lot more kills.
Put it this way. It was hard to get to 11 kills in a row before. Now? Even with stacking giving one or two equivalent kills, you effectively still need to pull off a 14 or 15 killstreak. That's a mile wide chasm there. HUGE difference between 11 and 14/15. That might be the difference between one out of every 3games, to one out of every 15 games.
I'm going to guess Treyarch is literally trying to sledghammer punish killwhoring, and literally force people to play the objective to make up that difference.
Unless I am missing something, dogs and gunships are going to be A LOT less in BO2, than BO1.
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Post by rubixx on Nov 9, 2012 14:18:39 GMT -5
I just played a game of nuketown and got UAV +CUAV. Assists from both of those got me to my Lightning Strike (150 pts) without any other kills. So chaining is still plausible. It will depend on how well your team is playing but it definitely rewards team play.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 9, 2012 14:20:28 GMT -5
This guy is awesome...and he only has 11 posts...
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Post by rubixx on Nov 9, 2012 14:27:30 GMT -5
Haha I've been on this forum for about 2 years but I only made an account now b/c I had a bunch of info and it was killing me watching you guys speculate about stuff that I already had answers to
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 14:37:55 GMT -5
Haha I've been on this forum for about 2 years but I only made an account now b/c I had a bunch of info and it was killing me watching you guys speculate about stuff that I already had answers to A charitable attitude. We appreciate it. I wonder if you remember how many points you get for VSAT assists?
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 14:37:59 GMT -5
I just played a game of nuketown and got UAV +CUAV. Assists from both of those got me to my Lightning Strike (150 pts) without any other kills. So chaining is still plausible. It will depend on how well your team is playing but it definitely rewards team play. Ok. So you went from 350, to 600, ...then to 750 with no kills. The last 150pt 'gap' was closed solely from the first two. I have to ask..... much are UAV assists? 25pts? And how do C-UAV;s score points?
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 14:40:56 GMT -5
I was under the impression that CUAV gave you assists just like a UAV does.
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 14:42:54 GMT -5
I was under the impression that CUAV gave you assists just like a UAV does. oh? So while you have it up, you get say 10, 25, etc..pts for every kill your teammate gets?
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 14:44:23 GMT -5
I was under the impression that CUAV gave you assists just like a UAV does. oh? So while you have it up, you get say 10, 25, etc..pts for every kill your teammate gets? Yes.
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 14:58:51 GMT -5
oh? So while you have it up, you get say 10, 25, etc..pts for every kill your teammate gets? Yes. Ok., i misread the chart before. Got it now. UAV and CUAV...assists get you 10pts. The above makes sense now. A typical Dom GW game has about 275 kills in a game over about 9 minutes (winning side). 31 kills per minute. If a UAV is thirty seconds, that means one should in theory get around 15 assists over that time. Around 150 pts per UAV. Results may vary. If one is playing 6v6 Dom, it's around 240 kills, about 25 kills per minute. So figure around 110 to 120 pts per UAV. His numbers make sense now. He got the 150pt bump from the UAV and CUAV. 120 plus say 60 from the other....180pts. bingo. Pretty much, UAV/C-UAV's are worth about 1 to 1 1/2 kills now.
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Post by rubixx on Nov 9, 2012 15:03:03 GMT -5
There you have it. Later tonight Ill go back through all the gamemodes and recheck the scoring b/c I just download the latest title update (dont ask how;)) and the kill while capturing a dom flag changed from 225 down to 200.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 9, 2012 15:11:02 GMT -5
Shooting down those little buggers is going to be imperative now. Remember in MW3 we ended up accepting that a UAV was going to be up all the time because of support.
We now need to get into a completely new mindset about this stuff.
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 15:19:21 GMT -5
I'm going to run ghost and leave them alone still. Developing my killstreak is more important than impeding theirs. I'm not going to look into the sky and get killed to save someone that should have run ghost in the first place.
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 15:20:14 GMT -5
The more I see this....Treyarch REALLY re-worked everything in this game, especially the aspects in regards to playing to win. At least on paper, it's pure genius... as I start to figure out the mechanics. They don't seem like that much of a change, but when you chart it out, break it down, small changes here and there can make HUGE gameplay changes.
if someone goes into a Dom game, tries to Killwhore...they are going to get frustrated heavily. As it is, for example....they'll need to do almost 50% more work to get the 'Attack Dogs' streak (11 kills to 16 kills) and if they aren't working objectives, doing team stuff, ...they'll be getting 75% LESS stacking than they did in MW3 (1pt per kill dropping to 1/4pt per kill). Killwhoring just got reamed right in the azz. High streaks, if you solely KDwhore, .....are going to plummet tremendously. KDwhoring off a flag for them, ...might as well dumb down your goals now.
Those guys who cap flags? Shoot down stuff? They will win out. Especially groups. They are getting almost a 50% to 100% bonus for their efforts, from before in MW3. And now even getting points for assists with the UAV. KD whore, he won't be getting squat there.
Plus no nuke.
I'm very impressed by Treyarch. They truly did back up what they said they were going to do. props to them.
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Post by rubixx on Nov 9, 2012 15:20:55 GMT -5
do you get assist points if a teammate kills a ghost player while the uav is up? I would assume so, but it is too difficult for me to test. I'll look into it later tonight.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 9, 2012 15:26:16 GMT -5
I'm going to run ghost and leave them alone still. Developing my killstreak is more important than impeding theirs. I'm not going to look into the sky and get killed to save someone that should have run ghost in the first place. I wonder how much shooting one down will contribute... Anyways... I only have one assassin class at the end of MW3. I actually feel confident with people knowing exactly where I am. It's weird. If I want to be invisible I just run blind eye and shoot the UAVs down with boosted gun damage. But yeah...I don't think I will be running too many classes with ghost. That motion thing seems a bit unreliable...We will see.
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 15:41:41 GMT -5
I have Assassin, Sitrep, and Recon on every class but one (my lololol QS shame killcam class). I'm not a believer in letting my opponents initiate contact, ever. Information is such a big deal in CoD that I feel obligated to run Ghost, gimped or no.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 9, 2012 15:47:27 GMT -5
Yeah I have a guy in my clan who only believes in those three perks lol...he also runs a stinger on 6 out of 10 of his classes...idk.
You know what? I blame FFA for my lack of stealth. Stealth in FFA means people don't know where you are. If people don't know where you are...you aren't going to win FFA because no one runs in your direction. I started playing more of that...I started using stealth perks less in other gamemodes...
I remember I used to run assassin on almost everything.
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 15:49:17 GMT -5
I run Assassin even in FFA. I want to find them, not have them find me. I spam UAVs in FFA to great effect, and I'm not the only one I'm sure
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 9, 2012 15:51:00 GMT -5
I run Assassin even in FFA. I want to find them, not have them find me. I spam UAVs in FFA to great effect, and I'm not the only one I'm sure Yep most people do I am sure as well. I run specialist into speed perks (or high end assault). Thems be my M.O.A.B. huntin' grounds. When I play something that other people rely on me for...I'm all about the objective...not the MOAB. Its kinda like... "me time."
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 9, 2012 15:52:28 GMT -5
Yeah, I never deliberately go for MOABs. Just wins.
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Post by iw5000 on Nov 9, 2012 16:10:57 GMT -5
I never give a sh1t about UAV's ...as I play GW and play grouped up. Even if I had Assassin on, it won't do me any good.... as anyone with two eyes, will see me blowing up half the map with my L86, spraying like a mother-fvcker lol. If you need a UAV to find me, you are a retard lol. I want people to come to me, as most games, I'm fighting off my damm teammates to try and find kills. For that matter, i wish they made like a 'Billboard' perk...a big sign that directed opponents right at me, all game.
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Post by citrus on Nov 10, 2012 17:47:16 GMT -5
The lodestar can fire at least 7 more missiles than the Reaper. According to the wiki, they're also faster (but more difficult to control) with a greater blast radius.
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Post by rubixx on Nov 10, 2012 18:05:16 GMT -5
Yeah lodestar is much more powerful than reaper IMO. I feel that is actually easier to control than the reaper because you don't have as much of a delay for the missile to reach the ground. If someone is in the open you will get them 90% of the time. How many missiles does the reaper have b/c can get off 21 rockets max with the lodestar. It seems like it only has a timer.
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Post by citrus on Nov 10, 2012 22:22:08 GMT -5
Reaper has 12 missiles.
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