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Post by Killerpuffball on Apr 6, 2012 13:17:18 GMT -5
I would rather face an entire team of OMA DC Commando tubes in MW2 than a Ghost team in BLOPS  . (No hyperbole) I'm serious, I was forced to run CS, Blackbird, & Dogs 24/7 because to other KS was even remotely useful. You must have never faced good OMA pr0-p1p3rs if you are saying something as bold as that. |
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Post by Megaqwerty on Apr 6, 2012 14:12:00 GMT -5
You must have never faced good OMA pr0-p1p3rs if you are saying something as bold as that. Agreed. A single OMADC can shut down the entire map in Dom: a team of them would make virtually any navigation impossible. I agree. CUAV and EMP had no counter before, Assassin giving you immunity is too much. CUAV/EMP immunity makes sense in the context that Assassin lost killstreak immunity. I agree that Assassin should not have CUAV/EMP immunity and HBS/PR immunity: that's the breaking point. Given the base effect of Assassin (i.e. UAV or non-lethal killstreak immunity) and the low power of CUAVs versus PRs, I'd rather Assassin keep CUAV immunity and give PR immunity to some other perk. Immunity immunity immunity. In balancing Assassin, we must answer the question: is the ultimate focus of the perk non-lethal killstreak immunity (ex. UAV, CUAV, AUAV, EMP, but not the recon drone) or is it automated detection immunity (ex. UAV, AUAV, PR, HBS). Because, given the other red perks or even all the other perks (remember, Specialist makes it very desirable to have all perks be of roughly equivalent utility), Assassin should not have both. (I favor the former for reasons previously stated, but also because it provides a nice contrast to Blind Eye, which provides lethal killstreak immunity. Like Assassin, which does not protect against all non-lethal killstreaks (i.e. recon drone), BE does not protect all lethal killstreaks, namely the IMS.) I just REALLY hate that every match of S&D starts with everyone throwing their nades and hoping for a lucky kill. I'd prefer they were to be used tactically ...but in merely throwing their grenades at the start of the match, those players forfeit the ability to use those same grenades later in the round more tactically and that's the tradeoff of that strategy. If one must limit grenades in some way, cmck's suggestion of placing a timer on grenades would be best, but I'd argue that even that is extremely unnecessary. |
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cmck
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Post by cmck on Apr 6, 2012 15:17:36 GMT -5
The only time I want the grenades to be duds is if I was playing Dome. Why does dome have such a bad starting spawn? Couldn't they spawn each team at A and C like normal to prevent this? What happened to symmetrical and fair dom spawns.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Apr 6, 2012 15:21:30 GMT -5
Both Dome and Village have such biased spawns that I'm sincerely concerned about the mental well being of whomever designed them.
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Post by UrbaneVirtuoso on Apr 6, 2012 15:42:53 GMT -5
Sure seems like it; I absolutely dread spawning on the A side in DOM Interchange and Bootleg, or even the C side on Arkaden.
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cmck
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Post by cmck on Apr 6, 2012 15:43:07 GMT -5
^ I agree they need mental help. Should we start spamming IW will therapist numbers now?
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LegitBeastin'
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Post by LegitBeastin' on Apr 6, 2012 15:52:09 GMT -5
Eh, I'll still take 18 days of MW2 shell shock over a BLOPS Ghost lobby making me fall asleep in my chair
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cmck
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Post by cmck on Apr 6, 2012 15:56:33 GMT -5
I'll take the ghost lobby. My dogs be hungery for some wookies.
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Post by 8bitasplode on Apr 7, 2012 15:35:57 GMT -5
MegaqwertyMy only worry about moving HBS and Radar immunity to other perks is that it would indirectly buff those devices. It would be like MW2 where nearly everyone was using ninja pro or Blops where nearly everyone is using hacker.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Apr 7, 2012 17:27:30 GMT -5
HBS and soundwhoring were incredibly powerful in MW2 hence Ninja, but Hacker was not ubiquitous outside of Search, where it still had to compete with Ninja.
Outside of Search, I predominantly used Hacker since I didn't use Flak Jacket and thus needed some counter to claymores.
Additionally, I'm concerned that in MW3, some of the other perks are underpowered and thus this would be a great way to buff them. Moving HBS immunity to DS wouldn't buff it immensely since the HBS has been nerfed in MW3, but it would make it much more competitive in its tier given the buffs that the other perks have received (ex. Steady Aim now has Lightweight's pro effect, Scrambler is now Stalker, etc.).
(And motion sensor immunity on Hacker makes sense since often times you'll see the motion sensor, but not be able to do anything about it, especially without revealing your position. This can be extended to MW3 since destroying PRs is such a pain in the ass.)
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Post by dshunter on Apr 8, 2012 9:30:13 GMT -5
Never had a true problem with Ghost (It felt like people were simply too reliant on their UAVs in Black Ops), although in hindsight, splitting it up into Blind Eye + Assassin was a good idea. blues27xx hit the nail on the head - Both Ghost and Assassin counter way too much stuff at once. Assassin Pro alone shuts down 4 different streak rewards (UAV, Counter-UAV, Advanced UAV, and EMP), an entire perk (Marksman Base), two attachments (Heartbeat Sensor and Thermal Scope), and one piece of tactical equipment (Portable Radar). It's crazy.
Assassin Base should only block UAV, the pro version should block Counter-UAV and have one or two 'lesser' effects. No nullifying Advanced UAV or EMPs.
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asasa
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Post by asasa on Apr 8, 2012 11:05:00 GMT -5
You must have never faced good OMA pr0-p1p3rs if you are saying something as bold as that. Agreed. A single OMADC can shut down the entire map in Dom: a team of them would make virtually any navigation impossible. CUAV/EMP immunity makes sense in the context that Assassin lost killstreak immunity. I agree that Assassin should not have CUAV/EMP immunity and HBS/PR immunity: that's the breaking point. Given the base effect of Assassin (i.e. UAV or non-lethal killstreak immunity) and the low power of CUAVs versus PRs, I'd rather Assassin keep CUAV immunity and give PR immunity to some other perk. Immunity immunity immunity. In balancing Assassin, we must answer the question: is the ultimate focus of the perk non-lethal killstreak immunity (ex. UAV, CUAV, AUAV, EMP, but not the recon drone) or is it automated detection immunity (ex. UAV, AUAV, PR, HBS). Because, given the other red perks or even all the other perks (remember, Specialist makes it very desirable to have all perks be of roughly equivalent utility), Assassin should not have both. (I favor the former for reasons previously stated, but also because it provides a nice contrast to Blind Eye, which provides lethal killstreak immunity. Like Assassin, which does not protect against all non-lethal killstreaks (i.e. recon drone), BE does not protect all lethal killstreaks, namely the IMS.) I just REALLY hate that every match of S&D starts with everyone throwing their nades and hoping for a lucky kill. I'd prefer they were to be used tactically ...but in merely throwing their grenades at the start of the match, those players forfeit the ability to use those same grenades later in the round more tactically and that's the tradeoff of that strategy. If one must limit grenades in some way, cmck's suggestion of placing a timer on grenades would be best, but I'd argue that even that is extremely unnecessary. the odds of getting a spawnkill versus a kill from tactical usage... Random nade all the way.disable map routes, delay enemIes, and get BS kills |
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banana
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Post by banana on Apr 8, 2012 14:47:20 GMT -5
Bring back double tap and put it in the same tier as assasin will be the best way to balance it but thats an idea for BO2 because it'll be impossible to put it mw3
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Post by Marvel4 on Apr 8, 2012 14:55:02 GMT -5
Rapid Fire is already OP enough...
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Post by UrbaneVirtuoso on Apr 8, 2012 15:05:40 GMT -5
At least it makes the underused SMGs more viable, like the P90 and UMP45. :p
I actually like the idea, since with Rapid Fire as an attachment you're not sacrificing much when combined with Assassin. >_>
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PassiveVengance
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Post by PassiveVengance on Apr 9, 2012 10:07:08 GMT -5
I agree with the Double Tap logic, it would work perfectly there and actually keep "attachments" as visually useful attachments as opposed to a random weapon buff you can't see on a weapon lying on the ground
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Post by Megaqwerty on Apr 9, 2012 13:15:00 GMT -5
Rapid fire can be justified as tweaking firearm internals. Many guns do intentionally limit their rate of fire to reduce recoil. Alternatively, rapid fire, if kept as an attachment in Blops 2, should add flame decals to the gun so others know that you got it.
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Post by brokenbladez on Apr 9, 2012 22:20:22 GMT -5
Rapid fire can be justified as tweaking firearm internals. Many guns do intentionally limit their rate of fire to reduce recoil. Alternatively, rapid fire, if kept as an attachment in Blops 2, should add flame decals to the gun so others know that you got it. Agreed. Also, they should add a spoiler, and 20's on the side of the gun. Plus, every time you reload you hear a blow off valve. |
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Post by 8bitasplode on Apr 11, 2012 17:36:23 GMT -5
rapid fire should actually increase recoil stats instead of just indirectly increasing it through RoF increase.
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asasa
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Post by asasa on Apr 12, 2012 0:40:25 GMT -5
Zero proof of it but I think it did on MW2 SMGs.
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