Holy shit if only. I already have a spreadsheet up with currently my suggested changes. If we can reach consensus on some more ideas, I'd be willing to update with the changes the community agrees upon.
I will say that Google Docs is kind of limited compared to Excel, I can do a lot more with an Excel sheet.
It really wasn't that much of an issue. It was definitely outclassed by sitrep and ninja. I mean you could make a knifing class out of it but thats about it.
Post by moabmauler on Jul 22, 2012 13:33:09 GMT -5
I personally miss OMA. It was useful for switching to another perk when the time was suitable, like going hardline when you were two kill away from a streak. All they needed to do to fix it was make it not refill your Skill Cannons. Also, I miss DC pro which made your killstreaks more powerful. We need some killstreak enhancing perks.
Anyway about shawtguns, just do brick's suggestions. I agree with him completely.
Last Edit: Jul 22, 2012 13:33:53 GMT -5 by moabmauler
This sounds like it would only work well, and I mean well if and only if anti lag is coded properly. Try pitching the idea to someone at treyarc who listens and see what they have to say about it. I do not trust IW with something like this.
Its way to late for black ops 2 but IW's next title might be possible. I am going to bring it up with mark next time and see how far along in development they are with the next game.
Its way to late for black ops 2 but IW's next title might be possible. I am going to bring it up with mark next time and see how far along in development they are with the next game.
Getting in touch with developers mid-way through production would be so awesome for Den and his bros here, but very unlikely. I get why they don't have an open, public beta because it would reveal too much before release - but surely allowing some COD veterans and Den's bros access early would be really beneficial to the game. I dunno; I'm just thinking out loud
Just because someone is good at the game or just because they frequently post on this site doesn't mean they have the knowledge to help with beta. After all, we're just normal people, and we would surely leak the info out to all of our friends. Granted, we're probably better than the average person, but our best hope is to find a reasonable solution to whatever problem there is and ask for change. We're not consultants, we're just avid players.
Yeah, I guess you're right. My mind is just filling with all these crazy ideas of meeting developers, gaining early access, trying to get things right before release, etc. - but it's probably better that not everything's perfect on release date
It's a type of beta that the devs can work on. Instead of spending lots of money & time on further perfection, they just wait and see what the people cry about most. After all, we're their customers.
Its a lazy but effective system, but they won't admit to it to preserve name, obviously.
Its way to late for black ops 2 but IW's next title might be possible. I am going to bring it up with mark next time and see how far along in development they are with the next game.
Getting in touch with developers mid-way through production would be so awesome for Den and his bros here, but very unlikely. I get why they don't have an open, public beta because it would reveal too much before release - but surely allowing some COD veterans and Den's bros access early would be really beneficial to the game. I dunno; I'm just thinking out loud
Public betas would be really good. That would stop any serious balance issues like the spas and ksg at launch.
Getting in touch with developers mid-way through production would be so awesome for Den and his bros here, but very unlikely. I get why they don't have an open, public beta because it would reveal too much before release - but surely allowing some COD veterans and Den's bros access early would be really beneficial to the game. I dunno; I'm just thinking out loud
Public betas would be really good. That would stop any serious balance issues like the spas and ksg at launch.
The internal beta testing could of been what messed up shotguns. I've said this before, but I think the emags glitch is what made them think shotguns were fine. They test them, put damage and emags on them, and they worked great and thought they had them balanced. But what they didn't know was that the emags glitch along with damage was causing them to be effective. Then they later find out about it and fix it simply because it was defined as a bug. The once they removed the emags glitch, you end up with shotguns that were weaker then they were really supposed to be. If the emags glitch did not exist, they very likely would of made shotgun stats more powerful.
If they had a public beta we could of avoided this whole mess.
Last Edit: Jul 25, 2012 12:52:46 GMT -5 by moabmauler
i would take steady aim out of the game and make the steady aim values the default values for shotguns. i would make the range proficiency available as early as kick is for assault rifles. i would make damage available as early as rapid fire is for smgs. thats all i think is needed really. the striker with extended mags and damage can dominate. the usas with range can dominate. the spas/ksg/model with damage are playable.
Give bare shotguns their range & damage values with the proficiencies of the same name. A lot more balanced imho. Watchu bros think?
Range, no. The range on the shotguns is already more than sufficient.
Damage would at the very least leave the pellets to kill at max damage range unchanged when using the Damage proficiency for the USAS and Striker, while making the AA-12 a 4 pellet kill and the KSG, SPAS, and Model 2 pellet kills. Here's the question - what percentage of the time do you think that your close range hitmarkers with the manual actions had 2 pellets hit versus 1 pellet?
Post by Brick2urface on Jul 25, 2012 13:38:09 GMT -5
Cash
While that would be nice the steady ability itself should not be removed because it is needed on other weapons than shotguns as well. I would be fine if they moved up the proficiencies a little. But they would need to do more than that. They need to do something to improve the consistency of the pumps. Those hitmarkers need to end man.
While that would be nice the steady ability itself should not be removed because it is needed on other weapons than shotguns as well. I would be fine if they moved up the proficiencies a little. But they would need to do more than that. They need to do something to improve the consistency of the pumps. Those hitmarkers need to end man.
i suppose people CAN use steady aim on other weapons, but it would be an awful decision. even hipfiring only with a pp90m1 doesnt need steady aim... why youd waste it on an AR, Sniper Rifle, or LMG is beyond me... i dont think people would miss it... my main point was that shotguns in this game REQUIRE steady aim. with other perks like, eh hem, sit rep, that are so powerful, its a nerf to tie an entire class of weapons to a perk. even sniper rifles arent as tied to quickdraw as shotties are to steady aim. my hope was that by eliminating steady aim, it would be a 'free' perk to shotties rather than a handcuff.
also, i completely agree with your thoughts on the inconsistency of the pumps. give them an extra pellet, require one less pellet to kill, or introduce your 'cone' concept, i dont really care what happens, so long as it works. but as far as im concerned, if a part of your body (not just arms or legs) is in my reticle, and we're within double knife distance, you should die 100% of the time. the way it is now, i can have my reticle squarely on someone and still get a hitmarker...
Post by Brick2urface on Jul 25, 2012 14:00:14 GMT -5
Thats where the spread tightening while ads comes in. That will make steady not as needed as it is now.
An extra pellet won't do enough. One less pellet will do a much better job. The cone will have to come in another title. Its far too late for it to be in mw3 and may even be too late for black ops 2. The 2 pellet kill would be the best solution for mw3.
Don't take away my steady aim. I need that crutch for faster stopping on my smgs. Besides the MP7 none of the smgs can benefit from marksman, none really need stalker given they already have 80% move speed while ads to begin with, and sit rep and DS are dependent on both yours and your opponents equipment on top of being non combat perks for the most part. All thats left that can help you in a firefight is steady aim.
Public betas would be really good. That would stop any serious balance issues like the spas and ksg at launch.
The internal beta testing could of been what messed up shotguns. I've said this before, but I think the emags glitch is what made them think shotguns were fine. They test them, put damage and emags on them, and they worked great and thought they had them balanced. But what they didn't know was that the emags glitch along with damage was causing them to be effective. Then they later find out about it and fix it simply because it was defined as a bug. The once they removed the emags glitch, you end up with shotguns that were weaker then they were really supposed to be. If the emags glitch did not exist, they very likely would of made shotgun stats more powerful.
If they had a public beta we could of avoided this whole mess.
The glitch (assuming that it was unintentional and they did not know about it) may have been a factor, but what about lag? Is there any lag in their testing environment? I simply can't use the KSG when I have a 3 bar connection, but 4 bars and we're usually good to go.
Well it should be private match. The game is balanced upon a lag free environment. Bolt Actions and Manual shotguns get terrible on laggy games (when I was playing with you that other day there was shots that were simply ignored by the server, for example. Then I got the ACR and got two ez kills)
Last Edit: Jul 25, 2012 17:12:02 GMT -5 by mmacola
The internal beta testing could of been what messed up shotguns. I've said this before, but I think the emags glitch is what made them think shotguns were fine. They test them, put damage and emags on them, and they worked great and thought they had them balanced. But what they didn't know was that the emags glitch along with damage was causing them to be effective. Then they later find out about it and fix it simply because it was defined as a bug. The once they removed the emags glitch, you end up with shotguns that were weaker then they were really supposed to be. If the emags glitch did not exist, they very likely would of made shotgun stats more powerful.
If they had a public beta we could of avoided this whole mess.
The glitch (assuming that it was unintentional and they did not know about it) may have been a factor, but what about lag? Is there any lag in their testing environment? I simply can't use the KSG when I have a 3 bar connection, but 4 bars and we're usually good to go.
Give bare shotguns their range & damage values with the proficiencies of the same name. A lot more balanced imho. Watchu bros think?
Adding extra Range is a bad idea (well, maybe except for the AA-12), but the damage part COULD work. You could test that using DAMAGE and Hollow Points.
Last Edit: Jul 25, 2012 18:17:23 GMT -5 by Amirror
The glitch (assuming that it was unintentional and they did not know about it) may have been a factor, but what about lag? Is there any lag in their testing environment? I simply can't use the KSG when I have a 3 bar connection, but 4 bars and we're usually good to go.
Any possible test for the AA-12, Model 1887, and KSG-12?
