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Post by aidsaidsaids on Sept 17, 2012 10:46:07 GMT -5
Every raid party needs somebody for dps, and Zer0 has a good mix of skills for putting hurt on both groups of mobs (B0re, F0ll0wthr0gh) and bosses (Ambush, Tw0 Fang, possibly Critical Ascensi0n). The Death Mark debuff is going to be pretty ubiquitous endgame too, I bet.
The questionable stuff is all the melee only nogunz builds people are trying to make. You know there is going to be an army of ten year olds that try to backstab the new craw and get their doo-doo split.
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Post by didjeridu on Sept 17, 2012 15:56:21 GMT -5
Roland was my guy in BL1, but Axton is just so bland in comparison. He seems more focused on the turret (which I don't care about), and less about kicking ass. Lilith was my second favorite, and I like how Maya is more support oriented. Plus her ability reminds me of Stasis, but more fun. I'll avoid Zer0 on the grounds that it's way too popular. Salvador does not interest me in the slightest.
No comment on the DLC class unless I know what it does. From what I've read though, I won't care for it. I hate pet/minion/AI based classes.
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Post by rudybojangles on Sept 18, 2012 10:21:59 GMT -5
So... who has played some BL? Sorry for our friends overseas, but America and a few other select countries got the release earlier. I was able to play 4 or so hours last night, and I am really liking the game! I ended up going with the hype and picking Zer0... he is fine. Nothing special. The way I am specing him out is very much like Mordecai from the first game, as a critical hit monster. I haven't even seen any corrosive or slag weapons, which is really hurting my ability to deal damage to certain enemies, but once I get a hold of B0re, I think I will be able to deal with several of them. Haven't picked up one rocket launcher, and I unfortunately have only seen one sniper, though, it is a monster (still using it 5 levels later: a rarity for the beginning game). My brother is Salvadore, and he is doing pretty massive work with shotguns, which seem to be much much more powerful up close than BL1 shotguns. He is taking enemies down without percision as fast as my sniper crits. Probably tonight I will roll Maya with a new group of friends, spec more into support probably, or elemental damage, even though I am not finding too many elemental weapons in my current playthrough. Some of the weapon models which are possible to generate are fantastic. I had a repeater pistol with a 64-round Beta C-Mag magazine type mag which rested up and right on the top of my pistol at a 45 degree angle, and shark teeth on the front!
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Post by kirbyderby on Sept 18, 2012 11:21:15 GMT -5
Got a couple hours in before school today. I haven't found any awesome guns yet, but the combat overall feels much more fluid. The bandits climbing and dodging all over the place is taking some getting used to, but in a good way.
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Post by herezjonnie on Sept 18, 2012 11:27:49 GMT -5
Played for about an hour yesterday, duo with my friend. Went Salvador and he went Zer0. Still only about level 6, (Just killed BoomBewm) but the game very early gives you tons of enemies, and also gives you really nice guns early. So the two things I really enjoyed about the game are kicking in real early.
I also really love how the new gun chests are porta-potties.
The first part of BL1 (until Nine-Toes) was so terrible because all the guns sucked so much.
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Post by herezjonnie on Sept 18, 2012 11:29:23 GMT -5
The bandits climbing and dodging all over the place is taking some getting used to, but in a good way. This is really cool for most guns, but it makes shotguns much harder to use....
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on Sept 18, 2012 21:11:51 GMT -5
Just get 4 gunserkers dual wielding shotguns.
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Post by jackaltornmoons on Sept 19, 2012 22:35:12 GMT -5
Played for 18 hours straight duoing with a friend on Tuesday. If you're on Xbox, you can add me GT: JackalTornMoons if you want someone to BL2 with; playing with randoms is kinda lame.
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Sept 20, 2012 10:39:12 GMT -5
What level are you? I'm down to play later today/tomorrow, but I don't want to be that guy that makes the mobs harder and is too low of a level to help. I'm level 18 Zer0 speced for crit%.
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Post by jackaltornmoons on Sept 20, 2012 12:12:59 GMT -5
The character that I'm duoing with my buddy is a level 20 Commando, but I'd prefer to start a new/play a different character with other people if possible.
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Post by volgon on Sept 21, 2012 1:09:08 GMT -5
How is everyone progressing so far? I'm at level 39 atm, running a shotgun Zero with tanky Axton and support Maya friends. www.bl2db.com/skill-trees#zzVc9cVxaxq my current spec which will eventually become www.bl2db.com/skill-trees#zzVVVm0Vxaxq. I was originally playing a Shotshed spec with a mix of melee and shotgun combat (I really like Followthrough) but it wasn't terribly effective. You can pull off some hilariously high melee attacks (like 200k+) if you stack everything up but I found it pretty annoying to try and get behind enemies all the time. That, and True Vault Hunter mode really ratchets up the enemy health and damage values. Today I decided to try out Death Blossom since I figured I should at least give it one shot before dismissing it and holy hell, it's AMAZING. Super Badasses just MELT under the effects of 5 elements + Deathmark's 20% damage increase on top of a barrage of 1030x17 shotgun pellets. Once I get One Shot One Kill it's going to be even better since almost all of the shotguns I've used reload in 2-3 shots. I feel like explaining how I play him in case anyone needs some advice in general, so here we go: Weapons: Primary: Shotgun, preferably Jakobs (non-elemental) or Torgue (explosive). Not a fan of the elemental shotguns, I prefer to dump as much front load damage as possible with them so I can kill and move on. I value damage overall then accuracy, mag size is not that important since reloading gives you ridiculous damage increases anyway (and they're fast on top of it). Secondary: Sniper Rifle: I will usually pick up whatever I can get if it's a damage increase (Axton and Maya use them more than I do). Even with no points in SR specific skills you still get plenty of huge damage increases to make them more than viable. Tertiary/Quaternary: AR/SMG/Pistol, just something to cover your mid-range bases where shotguns aren't good and snipers are too cumbersome. It's a good idea to grab elemental weapons for these two slots in case you can't reliably apply them via Death Blossom (out of range for example): Corrosion would be very useful for all the bots you fight. Accessories: Shield: I like to use a shield with bonus health on top of it. Zero is quite fragile (even more so since you'll be in close range most of the time) so all the buffer you can get between living and Fight For Your Life is needed. Other shields to consider are the Roid ones (bonus melee damage when shield is down) if you are going melee or the Absorb shields which can give you ammo if they absorb enemy bullets (though I'm not sure what kind, if it's based on the type of weapon the enemy used or not). Relic: I use the Sheriff mod from some town where the quests involve Brick and a bank. It gives +shotgun damage and reload speed I believe. Class Mod: Right now I'm using one that gives me +skill points to Killer and Ambush along with reload speed and shield capacity. Ideally I could find a mod that gives bonuses to One Shot One Kill/Velocity. Grenades: Whatever you want really, I don't use grenades all that often (I have fire singularities equipped atm because black holes are cool). Skill TreeCunning- Fast Hands: Super useful, you'll want quick reloads since the shotguns spend ammo so quickly. The faster weapon swap is nice as well.
- Ambush: Free damage. I've heard it works when the mob is fighting your Deception hologram as well.
- Rising Shot: Very lackluster I've found. The damage bonus doesn't stay up long enough with shotguns (or any weapons, for that matter). Expect to only have 1-3 stacks at any one time.
- Death Mark: Very nice skill for only one point. Only apply it via Death Blossom (melee is a waste of a Deception) and you and your friends can enjoy an 8 second HUGE NUMBER BARRAGE
- Innervate: Better than the alternatives. It's fun to zip around with the bonus movement speed and the damage, while small, is damage nonetheless.
- Two Fang: A little misleading (it was for me at least). You do fire two shots, however you also consume ammo for the second shot. Also not always necessary since you can often one shot mobs. Makes shotguns ammo hogs even with maxed Shotgun SDU.
- Death Blossom: Makes this spec insanely worth it. 5 charges so you can spam them all onto one mob to melt his face off or spread them around to melt 5 slowly. Will also apply Death Mark and doesn't break stealth. I can EASILY kill mobs using this ability only and helps to deal with the low shotgun ammo.
Sniping- Headshot: Free damage and Optics for this spec isn't optimal. I don't care much for critical damage since it can be hard to guarantee crits with shotguns compared to other weapon types.
- Killer: Don't care much for this skill either. I mainly use it since I get +3 or +4 points from my Class Mod. Reloads are already brisk with only Fast Hands and critical damage isn't always going to come into play. I'll be trying out Precision eventually to see if it makes much of a difference in shotgun spread
- One Shot One Kill: I don't have this yet but I've used it before and it's sooo good. Low magazine count means you'll be reloading often and having that 60% damage bonus is oh so sweet. Hoping to be able to pick up a class mod that has bonuses to this ability (though I think those come with Sniper Rifle mods and shield reduction, not sure if it's worth using)
- Velocity: Nice to have especially if using Torgue shotguns since explosive rounds travel slower. Free damage otherwise.
I think that's about it, if anyone has any questions feel free to ask.
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Sept 21, 2012 17:52:43 GMT -5
this game is badass
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Post by jackaltornmoons on Sept 22, 2012 12:39:11 GMT -5
My experiences as a level 24 Axton duoing with a Zer0:
We had played all of Borderlands and its DLC together with me playing Roland and him playing Mordecai, so we figured the transition to playing Axton and Zer0 would be a smooth one. He would use Snipers, Rocket Launchers, and pistols again, and I would use Assault Rifles and Shotguns just like last game.
There are two factors that have made me adjust my playstyle. Firstly, the team health and ammo regen class mods have been given from Mordecai and Roland to Maya and Salvador, respectively, which is not something we were expecting. Secondly, I have yet to find an AR (or SMG for that matter) that is worth writing home about. We have found spectacular Sniper Rifles, Rocket Launchers, and Shotguns (thank goodness) but the decent automatic weapons have been woefully absent. Any decent AR that we've found has either had a tiny magazine size combined with chewing through multiple bullets at a time and an extremely long reload speed, or they've been of the explosive variety where the bullets fire too slowly to be used effectively at the medium-long ranges that I'm accustomed to. This combined with the lack of team ammo regen has led me to currently change off my focus on Metal Storm and Fire Rate to focus more on making the Shotgun more effective.
Here are some thoughts on Axton so far.
The Longbow turret is significantly more useful than the Shield Turret. The shield on the shield turret doesn't keep enemies out of the circle, and it only takes a few hits before dissipating. Using the longbow to throw the turret behind the enemies to turn them around is much more effective and the longbow also gives the turret an extra +110% health!
I'm currently planning on going down the left tree and dabbling in the middle tree just to gain Metal Storm and Longbow, but we'll see how everything goes. I may get a decent AR one of these days that'll make me want to max out my personal damage and go for the nuke.
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on Sept 23, 2012 20:02:32 GMT -5
BL2 gave me aids
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Post by volgon on Sept 23, 2012 20:46:24 GMT -5
At least the shotguns don't suck in this game
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Den
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Post by Den on Sept 23, 2012 21:01:21 GMT -5
buff the bushwack
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Post by volgon on Sept 23, 2012 21:58:02 GMT -5
My Bushwack lasted quite a while until I got a shotgun with more than double the damage and more pellets off normal Terramorphus. Torgue and Jakobs ftmfw
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Post by volgon on Sept 24, 2012 18:18:18 GMT -5
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Sept 30, 2012 11:02:33 GMT -5
this might be the first game in a long time to not have assault rifles as the best class of weapons
they're pretty crappy actually it's sort of refreshing
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sh58
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Post by sh58 on Oct 1, 2012 9:46:28 GMT -5
i'm loving BL2 but have a few gripes with it. it seems a little too easy for my tastes, maybe that changes in true vault hunter mode. it would be cool if the main missions start off a decent amount of levels higher than you so they are really challenging, and also giving you an incentive to do sidequests. i love doing sidequests and they are really good in BL2 but you do a few and suddenly all the avaliable missions are 'trivial' which is annoying. also i don't like how they have done the elemental effects. they aren't extreme enough and not internally balanced. shock weapons are pretty lame, i guess they would be ok but hardly any enemies have shields, so fire and corrosive just dominate them. shock damage also lasts only 2 seconds, whilst fire lasts 5 seconds and corrosive 8 seconds! i guess vault hunter mode changes things positively as the effects are more extreme so more strategy is involved as fire weapons do .4 damage vs armour instead of .75 and hopefully more enemies will actually have shields so the 2.5x bonus for shock weapons will actually be useful. i guess slag is great for 1 character to use in a party, but is a little lame for solo play as its a hassle to switch weapons all the time. www.bl2wiki.com/Elemental_Effectsalso i would like the weapons to be dropped a little less frequently for 3 main reasons. 1) it would be more exciting when you find new weapons 2)there would be more incentive to buy weapons from gun shops as you don't come across as many (i have almost never bought a weapon from a shop) 3)you get more time with each gun as it seems especially near the end of the game you are constantly finding new weapons and switching out your inventory
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Post by jackaltornmoons on Oct 1, 2012 10:25:04 GMT -5
It is kind of annoying how quickly quests become trivial. When you pick them up they should at least be set to your current level, but I guess that a quest system that is more dynamic like that would be more difficult to implement, particularly in multiplayer.
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Oct 1, 2012 14:58:43 GMT -5
I just recently finished TVHM with Zer0, and I really enjoyed it. I think the difficulty was pretty spot on, though you can't go anywhere online without wading through a sea of salt over how hard it is. I think the design philosophy of making the enemies actually capable of doing damage late game is a pretty big departure from most RPGs, particularly recent popular ones (Skyrim). There are lots of Dark Souls comparisons being made, and I think it's appropriate. Both games are hard until you actually start paying attention to enemy behavior.
As far as quests go, after you finish the main story for the second time all the quests you haven't taken scale to 50. So do the rewards.
Elemental damage does seem a lot more balanced in TVHM, since nobody resists Shock and Fire/Corrosion are basically useless against resisting enemies. There are enemies durable enough to make Slag worth it, as well, though usually applied via action skill (Death Bl0ss0m, Double Up, Scorn/Ruin, or Gunzerking with a Slag weapon in the off hand)
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 2, 2012 4:47:19 GMT -5
I think elementals are spot-on
Corrosives rip through anything robot or armoured, and is decent against anything else but shields.
Fire is great for flesh and staggers enemies, but is terrible for anything else. It's the best elemant in the beginning for sure, but it gets more situational in the later game
Shock is great for shields, and can stun anything that isn't shielded. Pretty good
Slag is nearly broken in co-op play, that's how good it is. It's decent in solo (like tripleaids said)
Explosives are pretty much explosives, there's not much to them other than a splash radius (though I think they have a small bonus multiplier against armour)
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sh58
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Post by sh58 on Oct 2, 2012 8:35:34 GMT -5
i'm starting to take back my earlier comments a bit now after getting a little further, nice difficulty spike i just had, really looking forward to TVH mode now with the better elemental tables.
also just realised that the red writing on the special weapons means some kind of special effect you have to discover, i didn't realise that and had been a bit gungho chucking out weapons
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 2, 2012 12:02:59 GMT -5
Difficulty is a bit weird, for a few levels you're an almightly badass and shortly after it seems the only way to win a fight is to cheese your way through it
I guess stuff that like that is bound with both levels and multiplayer factoring in balance
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Oct 2, 2012 13:22:02 GMT -5
Equipment makes a big difference, as well. Right when you find a sweet gun the game gets easier, but as you level up a couple times without upgrading it gets slowly harder until you do.
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Post by beavernator on Oct 2, 2012 17:36:04 GMT -5
Wait, did they get rid of the tech pool system on elemental weapons in BL2? That would be very nice of them if they did.
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 3, 2012 11:00:46 GMT -5
Didnt play borderlands 1 so no clue what it is but
Elemental weapons work pretty straightforward now; every shot has a chance to do elemental damage that's listed as a stat
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Post by beavernator on Oct 3, 2012 14:58:32 GMT -5
I read it up on the Borderlands wiki. On top of elemental effect chance and elemental effect damage each weapon had a tech pool. Rarer weapons have larger tech pools, more powerful elemental effects depleted the tech pool faster, and all tech pools unconditionally recharged at the same fixed rate. But those rules didn't apply to Legendary and Pearlescent weapons, nuh uh. They would pretty much go off whenever they want for as long as they want, and because of that the more common elemental weapons were relatively obsolete. Because white-purple elemental weapons seem viable this time around in BL2 it's likely that the devs ditched the tech pool system altogether.
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 7, 2012 9:08:18 GMT -5
lots of legendary weapons seem like kind of a letdown this time round. A purple with the right parts can be just as good if not better than half of the legendaries
then again, it's not it really matters. If you have a Bee shield, every weapon you have is godly. Not sad to see that getting nerfed
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