Usagi
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Post by Usagi on Mar 16, 2016 23:49:24 GMT -5
They're both MMFaux shooters with loot you grind for and PvP. That's pretty much it.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 17, 2016 4:22:58 GMT -5
They're both MMFaux shooters with loot you grind for and PvP. That's pretty much it. Most games tend to have some grind to them whether it's farming for gear, collecting stuff, or unlocks. I remember playing Black Ops and I never got all of the pro perks unlocked because I was late into the game's cycle. My last COD game was Ghosts so I don't know if it has changed.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 17, 2016 8:43:50 GMT -5
They're both MMFaux shooters with loot you grind for and PvP. That's pretty much it. Don't forget the bullet sponge enemies!
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 17, 2016 14:47:51 GMT -5
I'm very much on the fence about getting this. On one hand, it sounds and looks like something I'd enjoy quite a bit from what I've read and watched. On the other hand, it also sounds like the endgame is somewhat lacking and the Dark Zone isn't in a good state as nobody really goes rogue due to the big risk vs almost zero reward for doing so. I almost worry I'd be stepping into Y1 Destiny all over again, which while I enjoyed it at the time, I don't really fancy being a glorified beta tester again. I guess Incursions (similar to raids from what I can gather) are supposed to be released in a few weeks -- maybe I'll wait and see what that's all about and jump in then. Diablo III and Battlefield 4 are keeping me occupied for now, and who knows, maybe Destiny will finally get a content update in the next month or so. That'd put The Division on my back burner for quite a while anyway I'd imagine.
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tooros
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Post by tooros on Mar 17, 2016 14:48:59 GMT -5
I've seen a bunch of friends playing this. Maybe about ten or so? I've also read some stuff on this, I didn't realize this game had parallels to Destiny. If so, I'm definitely OUT on this one. It's a shooter with RPG type development. From what I've seen so far however, the RNJeezus is mitigated by the stores and the ability to craft stuff. Granted I'm not at max level yet, not by a long chalk, and I've seen that blueprints are random within each item class. I guess there's some RNG there. It's somewhere between destiny, gta and gears of war. It works. It's engrossing. I'm loving it. It is not a straight up shooter though.
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Mar 17, 2016 15:38:47 GMT -5
and who knows, maybe Destiny will finally get a content update in the next month or so. That'd put The Division on my back burner for quite a while anyway I'd imagine. MWAHAHAHAHHHAHHAAHAHAHAHHAHHAA. C'mon now, no help is coming anytime soon for Destiny. If it were they would have told you about it already. It's actually shocking how much money Bungie made for Ubisoft. Here's a video of a Ubisoft executive explaining it to Activision CEO Bobby Kotick:
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 17, 2016 17:20:48 GMT -5
and who knows, maybe Destiny will finally get a content update in the next month or so. That'd put The Division on my back burner for quite a while anyway I'd imagine. MWAHAHAHAHHHAHHAAHAHAHAHHAHHAA. C'mon now, no help is coming anytime soon for Destiny. If it were they would have told you about it already. It's actually shocking how much money Bungie made for Ubisoft. Here's a video of a Ubisoft executive explaining it to Activision CEO Bobby Kotick: Well, well, well. Somebody spoke too soon. Destiny update 2.2.0 releases on 4/12.
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Usagi
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Post by Usagi on Mar 17, 2016 18:03:10 GMT -5
I can't believe Destiny is still as popular as it is. So many people still play it everyday despite being as old as it is. The treadmill Bungie built was perfectly designed, that kind of player retention is something every developer has wet dreams about. The Destiny section of this board is the only part that's still alive.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 17, 2016 18:40:15 GMT -5
Well, well, well. Somebody spoke too soon. Destiny update 2.2.0 releases on 4/12. I doubt there's going to be much content. Most of it will be a re-grind due to the level cap increase and making existing content up to date no doubt. I can't believe Destiny is still as popular as it is. So many people still play it everyday despite being as old as it is. The treadmill Bungie built was perfectly designed, that kind of player retention is something every developer has wet dreams about. The Destiny section of this board is the only part that's still alive. Not sure if that's an ideal analogy. I play Destiny from time to time but I'm just helping people in my groups on the100 getting their swords. Most of my friend's list went from Destiny to The Division. The only way for Bungie to encourage me to put in a busy week in their game is if they bring back Mayhem Clash or Mayhem Control. There was a time when I did Vault of Glass, Crota's End, Nightfall and the Weekly Heroic on all three characters each week on top of the daily events and public events. Since the last few weeks I play about 2 hours top a week.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 17, 2016 20:37:53 GMT -5
Yeah, details are scarce so far on what the update includes, though they did mention a new strike and a new quest line. The teaser image shows guardians with a Taken style shader wearing Prison of Elders armor, so some updated old content is almost guaranteed.
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Mar 17, 2016 22:14:14 GMT -5
I mean it's great that they vaguely announced some content that will keep us engaged for like a week, I especially like the announcement of reveal dates... I mean there was such an overload already in this announcement anything more specific might have caused me to faint. The Division is setting records and a not-insignificant part of that is bored Destiny players with wads of cash they wanted to throw at Bungie. And I actually far prefer Destiny to The Division so far. Though I'll finally start the end game content tonight/tomorrow so maybe it will still grow on me. But mostly I just think "ehh, it's ok". Kind of clunky. Not that satisfying to play. I like Rainbow 6 a lot better, and am a bit concerned at the amount of cash these newfound lootgrind shooters are bringing in by comparison.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 18, 2016 4:55:02 GMT -5
I mean it's great that they vaguely announced some content that will keep us engaged for like a week, I especially like the announcement of reveal dates... I mean there was such an overload already in this announcement anything more specific might have caused me to faint. The Division is setting records and a not-insignificant part of that is bored Destiny players with wads of cash they wanted to throw at Bungie. And I actually far prefer Destiny to The Division so far. Though I'll finally start the end game content tonight/tomorrow so maybe it will still grow on me. But mostly I just think "ehh, it's ok". Kind of clunky. Not that satisfying to play. I like Rainbow 6 a lot better, and am a bit concerned at the amount of cash these newfound lootgrind shooters are bringing in by comparison. I think the grindy elements in games are just a sign of the times. I've seen people on Reddit claim it's a necessity for developers because everyone would stop playing. I got all the gear I wanted in Borderlands 2 and I carried on playing because I found it fun, and I've known players clock up a lot of hours played with COD4 and MW2. There is a difference between hours played and hours enjoyed. Obviously, if you don't like the game that much you shouldn't play. Unfortunately, there will be players persisting to min/max or try forever getting an item (I stopped bothering trying for First Curse when SBMM cranked up) and Bungie seems oblivious to try and make existing 'grinders' happy. Players will eventually leave, so Bungie might as well have them leave happy. The Division might be more appealing to players with a Borderlands background more than Destiny since many Destiny players might have picked it up because of their Halo days. I probably fall in that category partly because of Borderlands and it's a third person shooter and my favourite shooter is Gears of War. The Division can feel pretty clunky, it's not as bad as Rainbow Six Vegas but it's less smooth than Gears of War 3. Not sure if this is a typical feature for third person shooters or I don't feel it often as others because I've played a fair amount of third person shooters. I guess a way round it is to have a combination of both, which Ghost Recon Future Soldier uses.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 18, 2016 7:54:38 GMT -5
On the one hand player retention for Destiny probably is pretty damn high compared to the usual FPS. It is after all a glorified single player game with drop in drop out co-op and slightly tacked on, but mostly workable multiplayer. I feel like Halo, (after the first one at least) had almost as much focus on the multiplayer as the single player, because that was what kept people playing it the longest. (CoD on the other hand feels like it has more focus on MP than SP.)
The flip side of it is Destiny has actually shed tons of players in the last six months or so just because there's been nothing new for them to do. In fact they basically cut their own throats on that one. They streamlined a lot of the grind when they retooled everything for Taken King, but then they failed to keep adding new content like they did in year one and only doled out little piddly things. The fact that they'd stop charging for DLC sounded great at first because all the DLC was overpriced, but then they just didn't give us any.
I think that Bungie has mostly given up on Destiny at this point and are content to just keep a small staff working on it while the rest of them focus on Destiny 2. They could put more resources into it and develop loads more content, but I don't think they have a budget unless there's a revenue stream for it. The micropayments stuff probably just isn't providing as much revenue as they hoped. Oh well...
At this point I wonder if it's even worth me getting back into it at any point. Maybe if I see Taken King fall below $20, but I'm now doubting it will. Plus I AM getting No Man's Sky and expect it will take a lot of my free time after the June release so... *shrug* The Division also looks cool, but I probably would only pick it up on the cheap unless my brother got into it with me. I'm gonna have to look into it some more, though.
It does make me think, though... I mean with these games being compared so much to Borderlands maybe Gearbox should get in on this action and make a persistant world MMO-like Borderlands game? They could definitely scoop up a lot of players that are currently playing Destiny and The Division without all that much effort. And honestly they wouldn't have to necessarily change the game all that much from the previous ones, just look at Destiny's design. Basically just clean up the co-op and make it more freeform. You do lose a little something if you take away the characters to make them into more generic classes, but you could offset that with a massive amount of customizability. And really I always felt like the NPC's gave the game more of it's character than the playable characters. For me the only thing that really shone through about the PC's was their look and the little things they'd say when they leveled up or got kills, ect. You could still have that if they were classes instead, and even let players pick voices or attitudes as well as their look, perhaps. Anyway, it's a thought.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 18, 2016 11:25:43 GMT -5
I mean it's great that they vaguely announced some content that will keep us engaged for like a week, I especially like the announcement of reveal dates... I mean there was such an overload already in this announcement anything more specific might have caused me to faint. The Division is setting records and a not-insignificant part of that is bored Destiny players with wads of cash they wanted to throw at Bungie. And I actually far prefer Destiny to The Division so far. Though I'll finally start the end game content tonight/tomorrow so maybe it will still grow on me. But mostly I just think "ehh, it's ok". Kind of clunky. Not that satisfying to play. I like Rainbow 6 a lot better, and am a bit concerned at the amount of cash these newfound lootgrind shooters are bringing in by comparison. Eh, I'm sure it'll keep me busy longer than a week, probably a month at least with my more limited playtime these days. We'll see what they unveil next Wednesday though. Perhaps by May or June The Division will be in a little bit better place with the extra content drops and updates and I'll give it a shot then -- doesn't seem like I'm missing too much for now. At this point I wonder if it's even worth me getting back into it at any point. Maybe if I see Taken King fall below $20, but I'm now doubting it will. X360 and PS3 copies are $20 on Groupon, so there may be hope yet.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 18, 2016 12:36:19 GMT -5
Yeah, but that same $20 on Steam could get me any number of full games I'd like to play rather than just an expansion to a game I'm mostly done with. I want TK for less... maybe $10. If it gets close to that I'll think about it. If not I may just hold out.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 18, 2016 16:12:38 GMT -5
Problem with doing that is that there will be fewer people playing the content so it's not that a bargain that people might think. I remember the fuss over the pricing when TTK came out because day one players thought year 2 Guardians had a stupidly great deal compared to the cost shelled out by year 1 Guardians. But it turned out to be false because Vault of Glass, Crota's End and Prison of Elders are 99% irrelevant.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 18, 2016 16:54:13 GMT -5
I think year one players like myself were more annoyed that we were being ripped off than that new players were getting off light, though they were definitely getting a far better deal, even if the year one content got made obsolete. $60 is still at lot less than $120. If they wanted to offer new players the chance to jump in with all the content for $60, that probably would have been fine with me if TK weren't priced at $40 to existing players... twice the price of the already over priced DLC content...
Bungie also never really impressed me with any of the DLC or their support of the game. It was marginally enough support and content to keep us playing in year one and apparently petered off near completely in year two. What happened to all that money they were making, because it sure as hell isn't being reinvested into the game? Naw... It feels like the publisher is calling all the shots here and not cutting checks for any development not tied to a nicely overpriced payout from the players.
Yes, getting the most you can for resources spent is a great way to generate revenue and profits. But why so stingy? There's more money to be made by treating players better and making them feel like they are getting a deal. If people feel good about their purchases they'll keep buying more and more stuff. And it's not like development resources are scarce. There are tons of talented people in the industry who would love to develop content for Destiny. Hell the fans would do it for free given half the chance! But naw... They'll keep the teams small as they can, trickle out as little content as they can get away with, and charge an arm and a leg for it.
We should all thank them for having the privilege of playing their game, whatever the asking price is...
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Mar 18, 2016 19:43:16 GMT -5
Sorry bro, they probably make more money off of dudes buying dance emotes for $10 than they do from the "I'll wait till TTK is $10 crowd". And no they're not going to fucking crowdsource new maps and missions. C'mon man.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 19, 2016 6:47:01 GMT -5
I think year one players like myself were more annoyed that we were being ripped off than that new players were getting off light, though they were definitely getting a far better deal, even if the year one content got made obsolete. $60 is still at lot less than $120. If they wanted to offer new players the chance to jump in with all the content for $60, that probably would have been fine with me if TK weren't priced at $40 to existing players... twice the price of the already over priced DLC content... The pricing was 'justified' because they knew it will sell. How often do gamers vote with their wallets? Not many and that is a great shame because Activision released The Taken King when The Witcher 3 was also released, and the upcoming spring update is being released on the same day as Dark Souls 3. That is two perfect opportunities to show Activision you're happy to go elsewhere. Obviously the Destiny playerbase's interests are vast, but there will be a significant amount of RPG-minded players playing Destiny. I still think year 2 Guardians have it worse though. Just browsing LFG, the100 and r/fireteams and legacy content listings are scarce. There's no in-game LFG or matchmaking for old raids so year 2 Guardians aren't going to receive the full experience of what year 1 Guardians experience. And that is just for the raids (yes I'll include PoE as a raid). Nightfalls in year 1 rewarded max light gear making them relevant to raiders. Now they're often a small chance of Strange Coins now that the Weekly Heroic strikes do not guarantee them any more. Even if you run this content as a year 2 Guardian, it will feel different because of the increased light level caps affecting your abilities. Bungie also never really impressed me with any of the DLC or their support of the game. It was marginally enough support and content to keep us playing in year one and apparently petered off near completely in year two. What happened to all that money they were making, because it sure as hell isn't being reinvested into the game? Naw... It feels like the publisher is calling all the shots here and not cutting checks for any development not tied to a nicely overpriced payout from the players. Yes, getting the most you can for resources spent is a great way to generate revenue and profits. But why so stingy? There's more money to be made by treating players better and making them feel like they are getting a deal. If people feel good about their purchases they'll keep buying more and more stuff. And it's not like development resources are scarce. There are tons of talented people in the industry who would love to develop content for Destiny. Hell the fans would do it for free given half the chance! But naw... They'll keep the teams small as they can, trickle out as little content as they can get away with, and charge an arm and a leg for it. Bungie entered a partnership with Activision by leaving Microsoft making Bungie at least culpable into the consequences of such an agreement. Activision milks COD by releasing it each year that differs little with each instalment so why would Destiny be any different? Also, the competition for a loot-based shooter with some PvP element to it was non-existent as far as I know until The Division came along. Gearbox perhaps missed a trick by devoting solely on Battleborn instead of making Borderlands 3 a shared world shooter, although Borderlands 3 might have been too soon and Borderlands 1 & 2 were not available on current gen immediately either. That said, I don't know how much Activision is the 'bad cop' here. Bungie are no angels, they fired two of their symbolic employees from my understanding. Are Bungie also increasing the cost to gamers for making a brand new game engine and scrapping the story line because it was considered too 'sophisticated'? For example, Rasputin was always the bloody Exo you see in one of the grimoire cards but people like myself who said this close to launch got shot down. We should all thank them for having the privilege of playing their game, whatever the asking price is... Luke Smith probably thinks that. Also, this is from the same developer that decided that keeping a safe distance from bosses is not engaging, so they add modifiers to year 2 Nightfalls that encourage this behaviour having already encouraged this behaviour in year 1 with Lightswitch and co. Then you get some Destiny players dislike ascended Black Hammers stun-locking Urrox in Prison of Elders for being 'overpowered' so how do you think they kill the Warpriest in King's Fall? Yep, exactly that.
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tooros
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Post by tooros on Mar 20, 2016 16:18:38 GMT -5
Getting to Lvl 30. As the side missions, encounters etc yield low exp. how close to 30 will the story missions get you? Is clearing all the extras mandatory to hit cap or not? I've been loving just wandering, seeing what's around, smokin' what comes my way but I'm trying not to get too far ahead of my compadres. We're late to the party, I'm Lvl 13 and a little in front. I'm spending a bit of time solo in the dark zone - which is tense fun. What's the end game like? Still fun or a grind fest?
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 20, 2016 18:17:20 GMT -5
Is it just me or is the HUD stuff a bit overboard with this game? Watching videos it seems like the game throws tons of HUD stuff up on the screen at all times and some of it doesn't even look informational, just lots of flashy effects...
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Mar 21, 2016 5:00:44 GMT -5
Is it just me or is the HUD stuff a bit overboard with this game? Watching videos it seems like the game throws tons of HUD stuff up on the screen at all times and some of it doesn't even look informational, just lots of flashy effects... Haven't had that experience with it at all. The HUD and UI are strengths, imho.
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Mar 21, 2016 5:10:10 GMT -5
Getting to Lvl 30. As the side missions, encounters etc yield low exp. how close to 30 will the story missions get you? Is clearing all the extras mandatory to hit cap or not? I've been loving just wandering, seeing what's around, smokin' what comes my way but I'm trying not to get too far ahead of my compadres. We're late to the party, I'm Lvl 13 and a little in front. I'm spending a bit of time solo in the dark zone - which is tense fun. What's the end game like? Still fun or a grind fest? I'm only at 18, but I think end game is grindy,min/maxing,and lots of crafting. Some folks likey, some don't. Story missions plus side missions and encounters will get you to 30. I'm going slow myself,rolling with PUGs, and having a blast.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 21, 2016 9:11:07 GMT -5
There just seems to almost constantly be some flashy HUD stuff going on, and while I can see that a lot of it is informative showing you loot, enemies, health bars, damage indicators, and such.... some of it seems to be pointless wireframe skeletons, a bunch or random dots exploding from your character, or suddenly enemies have like 10 small red boxes superimposed over them for no good reason, ect...
It's already bordering on information overload. There's a reason that they only put so much information into the HUD of actual fighter jets rather than trying to cram in all the information available to the computer. Too many things vying for your attention is distracting, and causes you to take more time deciding what is important and what isn't.
I haven't played it yet, so maybe it's easier when you are but from just watching the videos it feels like the HUD stuff is so much that it gets distracting, and it gets in the way of enjoying the graphics as well. I'm not saying I hate it, just that I'm concerned and I'm wondering what the hell all that shit is?
Is a lot of that crap just some sort of visual feedback from activating various abilities or something? That would kinda make sense, if they were using this digital HUD in place of glowy energy type graphics that you'd normally see in fantasy or sci-fi games. In which case it's meant more as some kind of feedback and graphical flair to go along with the abilities. But I can't really tell, without having played it. It just feels like every 5 seconds there's some completely unnecessary HUD visual element screaming at my eyeballs.
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Mar 21, 2016 11:31:43 GMT -5
Whatever it takes to talk yourself out of playing, I suppose.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 21, 2016 11:54:42 GMT -5
nah I'm still tempted. Right now it's the price keeping me from playing it more than anything.
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Mar 21, 2016 15:10:17 GMT -5
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 21, 2016 20:50:45 GMT -5
Good read.
Maybe people should just pick up the new EA Sports UFC 2 game!!! Problem solved!
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Mar 22, 2016 5:01:26 GMT -5
Time to work on upgrading my rear naked chokehold.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 22, 2016 8:57:00 GMT -5
Saw the patch notes, bought the game (plus it was the last day for the Amazon Prime 20% discount). Doesn't sound like the Destiny update is going to amount to much, so this should occupy me when THebb and I aren't blowing crap up in Battlefield.
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