Will
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Post by Will on Oct 8, 2015 16:38:34 GMT -5
I hope there are first-person-only servers. I much prefer first-person, but I don't like being put at a disadvantage.
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Post by GodMars on Oct 8, 2015 16:59:19 GMT -5
Played it a bit on the PS4, wasn't a fan of the controls at all. Doesn't feel right for consoles. Hoth was fun enough (unless you're playing Rebel Alliance), but it didn't interest me too much.
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Post by ChloeB42 (Alexcalibur42) on Oct 8, 2015 23:13:25 GMT -5
Tried the beta for a couple hours. It was fun, still not gonna buy the game. Shame there's no campaign, I might have picked it up on sale.
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bradman
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token old guy
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Post by bradman on Oct 8, 2015 23:19:01 GMT -5
Surprisingly "meh" for me. Feels like a casual pick up and play game with very little to keep you coming back.
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ookjawa
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Needs more shotgun.
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Post by ookjawa on Oct 9, 2015 7:56:44 GMT -5
They really, really nailed the atmosphere. I'm not sure if it'll have staying power after the "ZOMG I'M IN STAR WARSSSS" feeling wears off, but I'm definitely enjoying this beta so far.
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Post by GodMars on Oct 9, 2015 8:37:13 GMT -5
They really, really nailed the atmosphere. I'm not sure if it'll have staying power after the "ZOMG I'M IN STAR WARSSSS" feeling wears off, but I'm definitely enjoying this beta so far. It's great at making you want to play better SW games
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Post by bucket415 on Oct 9, 2015 11:32:46 GMT -5
Impossible for the rebels to win in WA. Maybe, maybe if there was only 1 AT-AT. The flying is very clumsy. Even BF3/4 jets handle better. Although, I didn't look for a stick adjustment for steering, only turned invert on, which is necessary for any real flying. I'll play some more. Hopefully they do some balance patches along the way.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 9, 2015 16:41:33 GMT -5
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banana
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Zoro > Law
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Post by banana on Oct 9, 2015 18:14:04 GMT -5
Symthic has stats up: symthic.com/games/battlefront/beta-weapon-charts.phpThe dh17 is the best on the non snowy map but sucks on the snowy because of it's minimum damage. The other 3 guns are the E11, A280, and DLT19. Even though the dlt has the worst close range ttk, it has the highest rof which helps because you tend to miss a lot of shots in this game. Also it's minimum damage is amazing
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Usagi
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Grin and Barrett
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Post by Usagi on Oct 10, 2015 0:14:55 GMT -5
Played a bit today, it was okay.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2015 21:41:19 GMT -5
Impossible for the rebels to win in WA. Maybe, maybe if there was only 1 AT-AT. Maybe DICE was too quick to assume a lot of Rogue Squadron vets would be playing.
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Post by GodMars on Oct 10, 2015 22:31:11 GMT -5
Impossible for the rebels to win in WA. Maybe, maybe if there was only 1 AT-AT. Maybe DICE was too quick to assume a lot of Rogue Squadron vets would be playing. I'm a hard core, all gold, Rogue Squadron player, and these controls suck.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2015 22:45:26 GMT -5
Maybe DICE was too quick to assume a lot of Rogue Squadron vets would be playing. I'm a hard core, all gold, Rogue Squadron player, and these controls suck. In that case maybe DICE assumed everyone who played the Rogue Squadron games all died off or became hermits in the last 13 years. EDIT: that, or they never got past the first mission in RS2: Rogue Leader. That trench wasn't meant for beginners.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 11, 2015 13:48:30 GMT -5
Played a few hours on Sunday morning. The game is fun to play, but does not have much depth. Appreciate the free play opportunity from the open beta, but definitely not a $60 purchase for me personally.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 11, 2015 14:58:28 GMT -5
FYI: Beta extended through Monday.
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bradman
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token old guy
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Post by bradman on Oct 11, 2015 17:04:50 GMT -5
Played a few hours on Sunday morning. The game is fun to play, but does not have much depth. Appreciate the free play opportunity from the open beta, but definitely not a $60 purchase for me personally. Sums up my thoughts, as well.
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Post by volgon on Oct 11, 2015 20:00:22 GMT -5
While I agree that the game as we currently know it (IE only beta) lacks depth, I'm curious what people think the game is missing? Personally, I get a similar feeling playing Battlefront as when I played Titanfall: the beta class variety is really poor. Specifically, the weapons and the Walker Assault game mode. Presumably all the WA maps are going to be huge like Hoth, which means there's little reason to use any other guns but the ones that have the highest RPM or highest minimum damage. You can see this now where nearly everyone who isn't new/using the default faction weapons are using the DLT19. The 600RPM + low spread + near flat damage model means it's perfect for Hoth where a lot of the time you're shooting at enemies far away. The only place you can optimally use a different weapon is in Phase 2 while fighting in the bunker, where you can make use out of the higher maximum damage of the other 3 weapons.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 11, 2015 21:25:33 GMT -5
While I agree that the game as we currently know it (IE only beta) lacks depth, I'm curious what people think the game is missing? Personally, I get a similar feeling playing Battlefront as when I played Titanfall: the beta class variety is really poor. Specifically, the weapons and the Walker Assault game mode. Presumably all the WA maps are going to be huge like Hoth, which means there's little reason to use any other guns but the ones that have the highest RPM or highest minimum damage. You can see this now where nearly everyone who isn't new/using the default faction weapons are using the DLT19. The 600RPM + low spread + near flat damage model means it's perfect for Hoth where a lot of the time you're shooting at enemies far away. The only place you can optimally use a different weapon is in Phase 2 while fighting in the bunker, where you can make use out of the higher maximum damage of the other 3 weapons. Personally, the lack of depths mainly due to the following: the gun fight is way too simplified: no need to ADS, no need to reload, just point and shoot. If I win, I don't feel very accomplished, if I lose, I don't think the guy who killed me did anything spectacular. Titanfall beta on the other hand, left me longing for more because of the incredible depths the beta only gave a glimpse on: 1) the wall run itself is so challenging, and yet fun and rewarding, that I would be content to just that all day; 2) the Titan fights have high skill ceiling as well, and also very fun. In other words, the depths exist in the form of both challenging and fun. After playing the beta, I know for sure that it is a game that I will be playing for a long time. Not to mention the dedicated server backed MP experience is buttery smooth. Every time I lost a gun fight, I can almost always contribute to myself making a mistake, or just simply out gunned. I can say the same about Halo 5 beta and BLOPS 3 beta, both of which I played the heck out of all the time I can put into the beta, and at the end just want more. Battlefront? No itch to repeat the experience I had in the beta.
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Post by ChloeB42 (Alexcalibur42) on Oct 11, 2015 22:24:01 GMT -5
This game is for casuals, like more casual than CoD, that's kinda the point. They're trying to appeal to the Star Wars demographic more than the Shooter demographic.
What the game is missing is a campaign. They tack on a shitty generic campaign for BoringField 4, but pass on making an epic Star Wars campaign?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2015 1:31:15 GMT -5
I'd say the lack of a campaign is the least of anyone's worries at the moment.
Battlefront aesthetically is flawless and authentic to a tee; I'll give DICE that. Like Alex said, the gameplay itself lacks depth, but the game itself is trying to sell to anyone who's into Star Wars. That's where my problem kicks in. Battlefront looks like a game meant to be sold more than played, and that unsettles me. There's been this ongoing trend of modern/futuristic military shooters running in with huge marketing budgets and gimmicky features. They're filled with high-quality graphics and handfuls of glitches on launch. They come in hot and expensive, and people get bored of it in a month when the next plaything FPS comes along. People figure out the meta and the power curve, and the game stops being interesting or complex for the most hardened veterans of the genre. So long as this practice remains profitable and people want this; maybe it's not my place to condemn it.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 12, 2015 12:25:26 GMT -5
Companies who are making a shooter game, and have any hope of getting shooter fans to buy into it, need to understand what Bungie refers to as the half-minute-combat loop: One of the most famous quotes in shooter game design, this has been quoted and discussed by designers and fans for years until this day. If a game does not have this (which Battlefront is lacking rather painfully), no amount of awesome "environment, graphics, audio" etc can give the game lasting appeal, for players like me at least. Destiny has countless flaws in Year 1, many of them are truly BS designs. Despite of that, the game still has a large fan base loyal to the game, because it inherited the core loop from Halo. Titanfall built that beautifully with a minimalistic design. 6 months of extensive play through 10 regens (equivalent to prestige in CoD), and at the end I still appreciate the core loops just as the first day when I played it. Halo 5 beta and BLOPS 3 beta are having similar effects, I am excited for the awesomeness coming up.
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Post by bucket415 on Oct 12, 2015 14:36:54 GMT -5
The game is just meh to me. I filled out all of their surveys saying much of the same. I was hoping for a better than BF4 version of the game + STAR WARS!!!. Its just okay, can't say I'd consider buying it at this point. I understand its a BETA but its really a demo, being less than 30 days from launch, the discs are being printed now. For me to consider: They'd need a huge revamp to the flight controls, player & vehicle health changes, spawn improvement, etc. This is like a check back in January to see if they patched it into a fun and playable game.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2015 15:03:03 GMT -5
I've heard about the 30-second rule. I could have sworn it was Blizzard's idea, but after looking into it that's not the case. Either way, I'd argue that many of these FPSes have nailed down the 30-second rule very well. They're FPSes; this element of execution in aiming and rapidly formulating strategies on the fly is more than enough to keep players hyped and addicted for a long time. Titanfall's loop was stellar. Run around, mow down minions, get a Titan, stomp around, and run out. That's fun, and if that was all RE needed to keep the playerbase playing it would have lasted much longer. Yet it didn't.
Releasing 3 new maps and a weapon doesn't work anymore to keep a player base going. At least it's not going to work for very long. When it comes to player base retention there are several things developers can do to keep players invested in their game for longer.
Implementing a worthwhile Ranking System can make a game last for years. Telling people they're good at a game and that they can keep going for a chance to get a better rank can generate a lot of playtime. Fueling an eSports scene for continuous relevance throws even more incentives on top of that, and it's why CS:GO has dominating as an eSport for years where CS:S flopped.
Of course, not every game is meant to be an eSport. Any other means of getting a player to invest in a game with time/money works just as well. Cosmetics, time, social hubs, content, doodads in general. It's why World of Warcraft is taking so long to dissipate. People literally have spent thousands of hours and dollars playing that game. Leaving it would feel like a waste.
I'm not saying all FPS should follow these suggestions, but maybe over time things could settle down in the genre if the market wants to. Developers could start making games last longer by sitting down with concepts and thoroughly refining them. Playerbases might stick around longer. The FPS genre can turn stagnant again because there are one or a few amazing games in the genre, but only because they overshadow many other games in a similar niche.
I guess Destiny is a guinea pig for this idea of sitting down with a concept and adding to it over time. To that end I can see this game eventually building up into becoming WoW's successor in a sense. People love it because of what it can be. Or maybe this is just a phase. Stuff like Titanfall, Battlefront, and Evolve are just spitfired concepts to be refined later in a sequel. Who knows?
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tiesieman
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mental lagger
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 12, 2015 15:05:01 GMT -5
I don't think the shooting mechanics are (that) lacking at all
There's (rather) projectiles and there's a headshot reward mechanic. The lack of stance penalties (or buffs, depends on how you look at it) actually is sort of refreshing and it does sort of reward good aim through the slow projectiles and high movement speeds. Not to mention the audiovisual design of the shooting is pretty good so IDK what you people are on. cod mechanics probably have equal or less depth lol
The drop zone gamemode leaves gives you very little room to do tactical decision making. Open map design on a small map(especially since you the verticality is easily abused with the jetpack) with a straightfowrard objective with zero penalty to death means you just shoot the people. And that's fine, I had fun for a few rounds because the "base combat loop" is basically a TPS battlefield with zero spread and high movement
Walker Assault on the other hand actually gives you some more tools, but the issue there is that on an individual level your performance and decision making aren't really rewarded. Outside of the pretty poor balance between the two sides, I think there's several reasons for that; map design, the randomness of powersups, the sort of balance triangles between the different units (depending on your loadout, you can't even touch the vehicle units really). Funnily enough, I think Battlefront does a better job of trying to force teamwork than the latest Battlefields do. There's actual dynamics between air support and ground forces (barring the godawful air controls) and you can't really win without good air support. The balance of some of the stuff is off, but the dynamics are there. When I play battlefield now I just run between points and shoot things that are pointed out to me through the 3d spotting. It's why I find the idea of forcing this sort of "cog in the machine" mentality kinda appealing even if its not executed well
Also, Titanfall was really, really boring
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 12, 2015 15:47:51 GMT -5
Well, whether you guys like Titanfall or not is your personal preference. The game itself has a very loyal fan base who have played it for longer time than many of the CoD installments, so the depth is there, just not to your enjoyment.
I heard many negative things about Titanfall, but "boring" was not one of them. But we can have the debate some other day in the Titanfall subforum.
Convince me with what elements can keep you playing Battlefront for 6+ months like what Titanfall did for me, other than the fighting is happening in Star Wars universe, I will keep an open mind. Three hours played, 1 survival game, 6 or so Drop zone games, and 3 Walker Assault games, and I did not see anything that can keep me playing more, other than maybe flying which I did not try.
I am usually a sucker for free beta and like to play them extensively, not this time. To me the game is more like an extension to the movies than a play-focused game.
BTW, I never said the 30-second loop is all it is needed to have a good game. I am saying without it the game can't.
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 12, 2015 16:24:45 GMT -5
I think what I mean is the issue is not the lack of an interesting gameplay loop (it sorta is, but compared to many other big shooter franchises I don't think there's a big as a gap as you claim) but the lack of what I'll call a reward loop Not just a direct one like CoD does with kill/scorestreaks, because even going on killstreaks in the CoD2 era was gratifying as Foxtrot (being a top fragger, making a cool play, the intimacy of the matches since they're like 8 v 8 at most)
In current walker assault, doing good is hardly rewarded (or rather; you can feel unrewarded) because it's set up to do so. I'll translate it to a direct scenario: taking out 4 guys before dying defending an uplink station feels meaningless when the uplink is overrun immediately after. Top fragging as a rebel is meaningless since there's bound to be a guy in an AT-ST demolishing people because by design, that thing is supposed to be a valuable asset ánd to make you feel badass. Alot of the times, the minute to minute gameplay fails to reward you or give you a means to improving. Run to objectives, shoot things, repeat.
Winning is an arbitrary condition that boils down to: if rebel team has competent pilots (and the other players have conscious brain activity), rebel wins. Otherwise, imperials are guaranteed a win
The game is sort of in a limbo between wanting to be a team shooter, creating a hierarchy of units and just making you feel like a badass fighting in the Star Wars universe and it just doesn't work. While I agree there's a very uninteresting skill curve for the mechanics, I think the main issue is there's a complete lack of meta-gaming. It boils down to shoot the thing as Star Wars guy; the videogame
im godawful at converging my thoughts holy shit
re: Titanfall probably had the same problem for me, but it's quite some time ago for me. There was very little to that game other than being CoD with verticality (and Titans, which were so well-liked a non Titan mode had to be implemented) except without the playerbase. I think I played like 20 games of that game before it died on PC
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2015 16:50:59 GMT -5
Well, I agree with tiesieman up until "Titanfall was really, really boring". Like I said, Titanfall has a solid gameplay loop, but there wasn't much beyond that point.
Generally speaking intellectual property from other mediums seldom fare well in the world of gaming and vice versa. It's very rare when one of these gets turned into a game with anything mechanically new behind it. If Battlefront lasts for more than a month I'd be surprised.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 12, 2015 17:22:17 GMT -5
Titanfall is released on minimalistic design, it missed several features that can keep player playing (except for the hardcore fans like the group I was playing with, which we played almost every night for months), for good reasons, because Respawn is a startup and they simply don't have the time for bells and whistles before they can prove that they have the ability to deliver. Still a huge commercial success for a company of their size nonetheless:
1) Proper campaign; 2) Ranking system; 3) Coop game mode;
They did add 2) and 3) later, but by then only the die-hard players were still playing the game, the tried-and-left players have moved on are not gonna come back just for these.
One reservoir of the game's replayability is the clever design of regen system, that each level has faster and faster XP earning rate, but with harder and harder challenges to complete. But again, that mainly appeals to die-hard fans, not the more casual ones.
And yes: PC did suffer from a much lower population than XONE.
If there are ever to be a Titanfall 2, we (as in the players who love Titanfall 1) are optimistic that it is going to be a huge hit.
A little off topic here, but I guess it is OK at this point as we have pretty much exhausted the evaluations on Battlefront beta.
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tiesieman
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Post by tiesieman on Oct 12, 2015 18:00:11 GMT -5
It's not that I didn't like Titanfall, I had some fun with it initially, but there was just other shooters to play and Titanfall did not do much to keep you playing if you were given proper alternatives. It grew old veeeeery quickly. (was there another competitive shooter to play aside from CoD on consoles that timeframe? I dont think the battlefield games count as those were close to trash)
All this stuff about mechanical depth and vertical gameplay makes me even sadder about how Tribes Ascend went down. Check some vids from that game; straightforward yet deep mechanics with a really stable learning curve, proper teamplay and space tribesmen shooting people with electrodisks out of the air Genuinely fun game with lots of potential that was completely mishandled, and died as of result. ripe
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 12, 2015 18:04:39 GMT -5
Regardless whatever evil things that ATVI has done, one thing they always did near perfectly is marketing. They sure know how to sell the product...
Not having a beta for Advance Warfare turns out to be a good business decision (would have expected that since game is made by a new unproven company), because otherwise the game would have not sold as well. With that deeply putting doubts into the franchise fans on BLOPS3, they offered a beta for the very first time in the franchise history on a much better made game, which appears to be doing the trick they wanted and turning around the negative vibes from Ghosts and AW.
In comparison, Battlefront beta probably did the opposite, turning away gamers who would have bought the game if not having played the beta. Still the right thing to do though, and I hope this trend of offering beta continues and evebtually becomes a norm.
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