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Post by individual on Apr 24, 2010 12:29:50 GMT -5
ADVANTAGE:
-40-round clip, more than any other SMG -2nd quickest reload -Best TTK at long range of any SMG by far -Average movement speed -Lowest spread added per shot than any other SMG (even taking into account its high ROF and varied recovery time) -Lowest amp of any SMG, moderate kick (amp seems to matter much more than kick)
ONLY DISADVANTAGE: -Second worst TTK at close range
But since it's got the highest ROF, its disadvantage isn't all that bad. Being an SMG, it's TTK is already decent to begin with, better than the AEK, M16, and F2000 w/o magnum, or identical to the AEK and M16 w/ magnum
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Post by ZeroKelvin^ on Apr 24, 2010 13:01:23 GMT -5
you are forgetting a key factor for the engineer class that most of time needs the extra explosives perk so you can't have the red dot sight:
The AK74 has the better ironsight.
Also the UMP has the least STK at all ranges.
Now, I would say if you take everything into account it boils down to the individual playstyle and the situation, wheter the AK74, the PP2000 or the UMP is the best SMG.
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Post by knoxthis on Apr 24, 2010 13:36:36 GMT -5
for some reason i like the pp2000 irons more so than the ak74's
and this is on a 19" sdtv mind you
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Post by individual on Apr 24, 2010 18:01:57 GMT -5
you are forgetting a key factor for the engineer class that most of time needs the extra explosives perk so you can't have the red dot sight: The AK74 has the better ironsight. I agree, but for me, it's not "most" of the time. Just whenever I need to lay mines or I feel like going crazy with CGs. Whenever I do that, I might switch to the AK74, which was originally my favorite SMG. Also the UMP has the least STK at all ranges. I don't see the relevance of STK, because less shots simply means that accuracy is less important (so you can spray more). If the shots are assumed to be accurate, STK is irrelevant. If the shots are inaccurate, because of STK, you might get lucky -- might, not guaranteed since the shot spread is somewhat random. Now, I would say if you take everything into account it boils down to the individual playstyle and the situation, wheter the AK74, the PP2000 or the UMP is the best SMG. I don't see any use for the UMP because of its low TTK both close up and far-away. I could see using the XM8C in CQ situations, but in long range it's too shaky... The Uzi isn't too different from the PP2000 excep. The SCAR-L and 9A91 are garbage (pre-patch, anyway, they buffed the 9A91 I see). I just see the UMP as either a SCAR-L that's slightly more accurate or a 9A91 with a bigger clip. Since I never liked the first two SMGs anyway, I never liked the UMP either.
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Post by Protolisk on Apr 24, 2010 19:40:43 GMT -5
need start a guide as to what weapons are good for what. Start with SMGs SCAR-L vs 9A91 AK74 vs XM8C PP2000 vs UZI UMP vs
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Post by turdferguson on Apr 24, 2010 23:21:17 GMT -5
I don't see the relevance of STK, because less shots simply means that accuracy is less important On the contrary, less shots to kill=better kills with more accurate busts. TTK is not an important statistic in this game at long ranges, because you will NOT land 7 shots in a row in this game firing fully automatic. The 9A-91, SCAR-L, and UMP are all similar and useful depending on you play-style. On the other hand, in close range, they are not great, and the 74U and XM8 and even some assault rifles will beat them at close range with magnum. Now, I would say if you take everything into account it boils down to the individual playstyle and the situation, wheter the AK74, the PP2000 or the UMP is the best SMG. Yes. It really depends; it comes down to preference, and you cannot form a good case against any gun's being useless. There are legitimate uses for all of the SMG's, even based on opinion. My favorites are the SMG's with low STK at long range, and everyone will have their favorites.
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Post by Protolisk on May 14, 2010 8:01:40 GMT -5
Playing the Engineer class alot I noticed a few things
PP2000 - very good, seems to have low damage large magazine high rpm high accuracy
9A91 - magazine is small
SCAR-L - lower long range damage than 9A91 Medium ammo capacity
UMP - good balance not great at anything
Haven't tried the 74u and XM8C too much
Uzi seems a little useless compared to PP2000
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Post by tplazarno on May 14, 2010 15:15:51 GMT -5
The PP2000 is only good of you are very accurate, and run with ammo instead of a sight. I love the irons, so this isn't a problem, but it is kind of annoying how fast you can burn through 3 clips. I rarely get too many kills with the pp2000 because it takes 7 or so shots to kill.
The AK74 is a good all around gun. It doesn't stand out too much, but it is generally good. It is a very good gun to use if you don't want too much of a challenge with the smgs.
The Scar-L is great, even though people seem to write off the first 2 smgs as terrible. If you haven't unlocked the UMP yet (like me), the scar is a great alternative. 5 STK up close, and it just has some more recoil. Also, I love the scar irons.
XM8 has a good ttk, but it is way too inaccurate at range and the recoil seems kind of random. Good for up close, bad for anything semi-far away.
The 9A91 has a magazine that is way too small for it's damage/firerate, I don't think the 1 STK at range difference is going to make it much better, either.
The uzi is just like the pp2k but slower and with a smaller magazine I don't use it much.
The ump sounds nice, but I don't have it yet.
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Post by turdferguson on May 14, 2010 23:45:36 GMT -5
The 9A91 has a magazine that is way too small for it's damage/firerate. To the contrary, the 9A-91 is a fully automatic varient of the AN-94, at least damage-wise. It is like a silenced G3. I think the silencer makes up for the damage.
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Post by tplazarno on May 16, 2010 11:46:21 GMT -5
The 9A91 has a magazine that is way too small for it's damage/firerate. To the contrary, the 9A-91 is a fully automatic varient of the AN-94, at least damage-wise. It is like a silenced G3. I think the silencer makes up for the damage. Wow, I've never thought of it that way. I have thought about the silenced G3 comparison, but for some reason I just can't use it too efficiently. Kind of like how for some reason I can't use the VSS efficiently. I think it is the silencer and the fact that I can't tell how many shots I have fired at a time, but I don't know.
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Post by turdferguson on May 17, 2010 0:57:42 GMT -5
Wow, I've never thought of it that way. I have thought about the silenced G3 comparison, but for some reason I just can't use it too efficiently. Kind of like how for some reason I can't use the VSS efficiently. I think it is the silencer and the fact that I can't tell how many shots I have fired at a time, but I don't know. I have VSS problems too, and I know what you are talking about. But the 9A-91 is at the moment my new favorite gun, and you will probably like it better as you use it more. (Just like the G3) don't use it on full auto, and pretend that it is limited to bursts (like the AN-94).
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Post by Flubadoo on Jun 9, 2010 9:38:46 GMT -5
you are forgetting a key factor for the engineer class that most of time needs the extra explosives perk so you can't have the red dot sight: The AK74 has the better ironsight. Also the UMP has the least STK at all ranges. Now, I would say if you take everything into account it boils down to the individual playstyle and the situation, wheter the AK74, the PP2000 or the UMP is the best SMG. Against UMP: Missing a shot with the ump will cause a huge increase in TTK since it has a slow ROF. However, with the PP2000, its not the case. Missing one or three shots wont affect the TTK nearly as much as the ump because of its MASSIVE ROF Against PP2000: The best ttk at distance is very obsolete to this smg since it has the fastest fire rate of any gun in the game (ther than mg3). This results in the AMP increasing incredibly fast even though its not that high. Also, high ROFs should be for CBQ, not sniping.
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Post by vulgotha on Jun 10, 2010 1:42:30 GMT -5
I find that the two most useful burst fire SMGs (med\long range) are in fact the AK-74u, and (but especially) the XM8c.
It has less noticeable kick when you fire in 2-3shot bursts at range. Very very accurate.
As for the VSS, it's my favorite weapon. you need to tap the trigger, not pull. Go for 2 rounds quick bursts and you'll start to see its glory.
Basically its a silenced scoped assault rifle. It doesn't lend itself to extreme distances like the Barret or any of the other snipers.. But it is quite efficient at cutting down infantry like a lawn mower through grass at any distance under that.
In particular medium range and CQC.
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