Hello everyone, I just got back from a trip to Infinity Ward's new studio and got a chance to talk to most of the dev team there (and Treyarch as well). Believe it or not, the majority of them are aware of these forums and the work that goes on in decoding their games. Also, most of them hold these forums in rather high esteem compared to most of the other ones out there.
That being said, I'd like to propose one massive thread of feedback on how to make the next CoD game better than the previous ones. All of you are the brightest CoD gamers in the world and find things that even devs miss, so where better to ask for input than here?
Any ideas you've got, big, small, or technical, go ahead and drop them in here. It will be seen
I'd like to see whatever stealth perk is equivalent to ghost / cold blooded / whatever keeps me off the radar be in a set where I have to trade off something else very important to have it.
A new engine would be splendid as that would remove head glitching, FPS issues, some lag, and a dozen other things associated with the old Quake based engine.
Keep the guns fun. Balance is important but fun first of all
1. The XM25 was a masterpiece of a weapon. That is how you do grenade launchers. It had a nice high skill requirement that seperated those who just spammed the trigger and those who planned out distances, angles, sightlines, and calculated that all together to get some of the coolest skill kills CoD has ever had the honor of offering.
2. Don't be afraid of increasing the skill gap. Of course you want to let new players come in and feel like they have a shot. Nobody wants to get pubstomped on their first go-around. Right? Instead of adding deathstreaks and removing skill based tecniques (like soundwhoring), provide an outlet for the new player to learn. Take the MOBA route and allow the new players to play with other new players for longer (not just a trvial combat training for 5-10 levels), and also give them the option of playing with the big boys.
3. Keep the Riot Shield as it was from MW3. That was perfect.
4. Don't be afraid of parkour. Parkour has made for some of the most memorable maps. Don't be too quick to create those invisible walls.
5. Try to be up front with the stats. There is no need for the subterfuge with which CoDs have hidden true stats. Perhaps this is for the sale of strategy guides...but even those guides get things wrong. If you are up front with the stats within the UI of the game, you add a whole new level of sophistication with which players can discuss your game. I would think, if you want to head towards e-sports, that you would make this true information readily available as to better educate "mlg" players. It surprises me the level of misunderstanding some famous players have concerning the statistics of your game.
Balance has never been the goal. A balanced game is chess, checkers, etc. where everyone has the same thing. In this game, the goal is to achieve a perfect imbalance. Some guns/perks/whatever are better against other ones, shifting the metagame constantly to whatever is in favor by the majority of the community. I have a feeling that they understand this concept, and there isn't much we can do to help them with game balance.
The thing I most want to see is this series turned free to play. It won't happen, but I still wish it would. The next generation of consoles would be a great time to do so, as it ensures the game would last for what, 5 to 8 years? My hope has been that the microtransactions did well enough that it could convince Activision to make the jump to free to play. They can't be blind to how well League of Legends is doing. I just can't help but imagine how great it would be if we got a new CoD which was constantly being updated with new maps, game modes, and other free features along side new weapons, camos, or whatever additional features that could cost money/large time investments to unlock otherwise.
The best suggestion is to comment on what is and isn't fun. What isn't fun? Being killed by a sniper up close. Anytime you get hit by something that instantly kills you, you are going to feel cheated. It's even worse when it is a weapon designed for long range and you die in a close quarters situation to it. Oh sure, you can have fun using it, but you can also have fun shooting an infinite amount of grenades at domination points in Modern Warfare 2.
I'd like to see whatever stealth perk is equivalent to ghost / cold blooded / whatever keeps me off the radar be in a set where I have to trade off something else very important to have it.
Anything with a negative trade off instantly feels bad to use. Imagine if you could spawn with more ammo, but you moved slower. I guess I won't use that over the other 4 perks that don't have a negative associated with it. If the benefit is too strong to be balanced without a negative associated with it, nerf the advantage it gives until it works.
One topic I want to see addressed is the issue of explosives. Ignoring grenades, which I feel should be separate, the best way to handle it is similar to how CoD4 and WaW did. You have one slot for any explosive. No more secondary launchers, no more attachment grenade launchers, no more C4/Claymores/Betties in place of grenades. Put all of them into one slot. Everybody can choose one to fit their class. Nobody can have a grenade launcher, an RPG, and C4 anymore.
Explosives: RPG Grenade Launcher (standalone, attaches to gun if compatible and does not count as an attachment) C4 Claymores Betties Javelin Stinger XM-25 Crossbow Whatever
And fixing the class issue with explosives also helps the second problem with them. Flak Jacket is an evil. Having anything be a perfect counter with no counter play is bad. Trophy system? Great, you can strategically place it. Enemies can shoot it to destroy it. Flak Jacket? You just become unkillable by explosions. A perk to make it harder for you to die by them is fine. One that makes it impossible to do so it not. It goes to the argument that hard counters are a bad thing. Anything that makes you 100% immune to something is bad. Why? Because the thing you are immune to has to be inherently overpowered to justify having a perfect counter. Nerf the overpowered thing instead of allowing it to thrive with a hard counter.
I could probably dig up a post I made forever ago if you would like to see these thoughts presented better.
One last thing I would like to note is that Treyarch did very well with Black Ops 2. The focus on competitive is a massive step in the right direction. League play needs to be focused on more, and the decision to include some skill in the matchmaking for normal games has been needed for a long time.
Oh, and there is no reason that they cannot have dedicated servers other than Activision wants to save money.
Last Edit: Apr 21, 2013 17:00:38 GMT -5 by Aphoristic
Also I disagree with flak jacket being a completely bad idea. Tactical things like trophy systems are nice but people don't exactly have the time to react to explosions. This is doubly so for gametypes with small objectives like demo or dom.
I liked MW2's blast shield concept, it was just not strong enough for what it costed the player.
If I am skilled enough to get a grenade on top of you, you should not just be able to live because a perk says so. The counter play to grenades is knowing when and where they will be thrown and reacting accordingly. Having a passive ability to completely ignore them removes this completely.
And Blast Shield would have been good if it didn't have the whole vision obscuring thing.
Post by thegentleman on Apr 10, 2013 17:03:19 GMT -5
Regarding the idea of killstreaks or scorestreaks:We've had this mechanic out there for some time. I basically see it as untenable to the evolution of CoD, and I'll make a case for that.
First, the series has been catering to be more newcomer friendly. I think that's a good move from a business sense. We've also been seeing more rewards that encourage playing the objective. Again, a good benefit: match incentives with desired in-game objectives.
The issue is that over the last several games, we've been seeing a push away from K/D and more towards W/L or SPM. I think in general, that's a good move for objective types, which is really one of the keys to keeping the game fresh. We've all done free for all and TDM. As veteran players continue to stay in the franchise, they'll stick around for novel modes that combine a familiar style of gameplay. In BO1, I pretty much only played TDM. In MW3, I liked Domination, and in BO2, I play a variety of objective modes and like how Kill Confirmed gives me a better incentive for picking up tags.
The problem is that the main "carrot on a stick" (that is, hitting an awesome killstreak) is still tied to not dying, and I see that as a problem.
For most people, getting these streaks is a statistical anomaly, and it requires someone to adopt an all-too-familiar playstyle. The guy dying on B flag and working his ass off to get it won't be rewarded for putting himself in the line of fire as will the silenced SMG user picking off people on their way to B flag.
Keeping the series fresh has in many cases come down to coming up with really cool streaks. Currently, I think the killstreak rewards have shot up to a level that's insane. Look at the Swarm: 19 kills in a row without hardline? BOII Dogs / a MW3 Osprey are 17 kills in a row? First, that's well out of reach of most people, and even for the upper 10% of players to earn them, it requires a playstyle that's individual-oriented and cautious to the point of paranoia.
Also, consider this: when the requirement of earning these streaks reaches into the stratosphere, it places scrutiny and blame on other areas. Someone's going to be way more pissed off at the lag and netcode if they perceive it to be the reason why they died "one away from their swarm." In my case, small (but perceptible) differences in the degree of lag comp from one game to another may cause me to quit out if it feels like I'm working against it, because trying to earn those rewards under non-ideal conditions feels like beating your head against a wall.
In additional support of this last point, people didn't react to such animosity to the Stealth Bomber as being part of the support package in MW3 because they died once a game to it, it was because that death usually set them back and reset their streak.
There's also the problem that when players earn the big "assault style" streaks, about half of the other team quits out. That's probably a sign that they're too powerful, if only because of the additional instability they cause through host migrations, dashboarding, and the like.
A few possibilities, then:
Remove the emphasis away from killstreaks as crazy death-dealing monstrosities and toward more "equipment" like streaks that would work well in certain situations.
Tie the "penalty" of dying with a setback to one's streak in a more elegant manner and catered to specific game modes. If you're playing TDM and die, your progress towards a streak is set back by 7. In domination, progress towards a streak is set back by 4 for each death. Tweak as needed.
Introduce different sets of killstreaks for different game modes. This would additionally allow new modes to be created that offer an experience fundamentally different and enticing from other play modes.
Quite frankly I'm flattered that they give a doo-doo about this forum.
The PC port of BO2 was great, do that again. Especially the part about matchmaking and dedicated servers combined. Foxtrotting brilliant. A few things that need to be fixed are:
1) Let us access the options menu in the pre-game lobby. 2) Let us use the Hybrid Sight. Pretty please? 3) That thing Goalie mentioned about being able to remove all the NEW notifications with just a button press. 4) The Dragonfire controls were doo-doo. Crouch and Jump worked perfectly for the Recon Drone in MW3. 5) The CaC menu was ridiculous. C for camos, O to change reticle, TAB for knife ARRRRRRGH! 6) This is a pretty bold one and I realize that the devs probably don't have control over this, but I think it's worth proposing so here goes. Reduce the price of the DLC on PC or just make it free. The PC playerbase is hurting for players so bad to the point where some game modes are unplayable and the DLC fractures the playerbase even more. A reduction in the price will bring a lot of players to PC and it will also improve consumer's opinions of you. A gesture of goodwill can go a long way amongst a mass of pissed off gamers that hate big AAA publishers.
BO2 did pretty well with weapon balance but MW2 had the best balance by far. Take notes from it. Buff the shotguns to MW2 level and give LMGs infinite range again. Making SMGs a 6HK at max range was an excellent decision. Keep that.
A little personal thing, each weapon class should have the same number of guns. I'm sick and tired of seeing 9 assault rifle, 7 SMGs, and then only 4 guns for the other weapon classes. That's garbage.
Also fix the netcode, but there's only so much that can be done about that. I really hope that the rumors of a new engine are true.
EDIT: Also, Legit brought up an interesting thought the other day. What if Commando was in the same tier as SP, Jugg, and CB? Food for thought.
I didn't read all the elaborate responses so far, so forgive me if I repeat part of another post.
In my opinion, the pick-10-system was a great idea and it would be fantastic if an improved version were in the next game. It's not fair, nor very well balanced, that a primary weapons is as valuable as an attachment for a secondary as an example. In addition to that, the secondaries as well as the lethal and tactical equipments had to be buffed (in some cases arguably to much) to make the players even consider still using them. By changing the cost for items in each category of the create-a-class system, both those problems could be resolved. Within a category, differences in the cost is probably a bad idea and it would be almost impossible to balance, but please adjust at least the cost of items in different categories according to their actual value.
Believe it or not, the majority of them are aware of these forums and the work that goes on in decoding their games.
YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU'VE DONE!
I have no input because it would be a little hypocritical of me. all I want is something new. BO2 removed more content than it added and 95% of the CaC options are mere elements of options from previous games.
"the cameras don't sync to the body" is false and can easily be proven via a 3rd person camera. Marvel and I were planning to test comparisons from BO2 from CoD4 but havent got around to it. It actually didn't happen in cod4. Latency does exist locally for whatever reason but it is obviously more significant in bo2 for whatever reason.
Having a person with 50ms delay and a person with 250ms delay will cause the latencies to STACK on a listen server, as the information needs to travel through the host and then to the other players, so that information would take at the very least 300ms, not 200ms. You described a P2P network which isn't used in CoD
Lag is tied to FPS, but network rates are capped at 30 times/sec (client to host) and 20 (host to client).
Lag compensation is pretty much accurate as hell in cod since the
Information actually the same for everyone and generated as such, the only thing that differs between clients is the player themselves, because of input prediction
the host DOES NOT "average" connections. The host generates the world as the information comes in, exactly as it comes in. the only reason it differs is because of the travel time of information. It only really appears smooth because of interpolation (which really shouldn't have been neglected).
you may want to have read this. I've gotten some nice responses and seen it sourced on a lot of sites, been recieved pretty well (except on gamefaqs).
I've seen your thread on that. Read it quite extensively. It feels bad and dirty, but I made a video that was not 100% technically correct for two reasons: 1. I wanted to show the complexity of the issue. 2. I wanted to try to explain parts of it in a way that people could understand.
I hope the the gods of science and technicality will forgive me one day.
As much as I think everyone will disagree with me, I think footstep sound in Black Ops 2 is perfect. It's enough to give truly attentive players a slight advantage but not enough to allow people to just lie prone in wait when they hear someone coming. I like the idea that I can run any 3rd tier perk I want and not be at a significant disadvantage whenever someone on the other team has a headset. I would not like to see a return to MW3's Sit-Rep Pro. I've said this before, but when everyone can hear everyone, movement is discouraged.
Post by Brick2urface on Apr 10, 2013 19:57:26 GMT -5
1. Map selector for multiplayer searching.
2. Numbered team mate arrows on the minimap so you know who is who on it. Match those numbers to numbers listed along side the gamer tags in the score board screen.
3. Unranked playlists in which no stats are recorded.
4. A better selection of map sizes. More large maps like mw2 would be nice. With as little unnecessary ground clutter as possible. Getting caught on a some random garbage in the middle of nowhere is not good.
5. Infinite sprint. It increases the pace of the game without the need for small maps.
6. Make it so you can run through team mates. That thing at the beginning of the game where everyone starts to sprint at once and you just und up sprinting into the backs of your teammates and you just glitch and jump around the screen gives me cancer.
7. Access to global weapon stats. K/d, kills with, times killed by, and accuracy for all weapons globally.
8. Make sure to keep a way for us to messure distances in game. Its very helpful.
9. I would like to see pick 10 return but with no limitations or requirements like wildcards. As many attachments as I want (as long as it makes sense, no grenade launcher+undermount shotgun or anything like that.) And as many perks from a single tier as I want.
10. Specialist needs to make a return. It was my single favorite feature from mw3.
11. Please for the love of all things holy and the sake of all of our sanity give the shotguns some descent performance compared to the other weapons in game. We really don't need another mw3 spam teh 4ums for shotgun buffs episode. Please take from what we learned from that. That said do not go the blops 2 route with shotguns. That high spread low range crap is a really poor existance for shotguns. Small spreads, descent power at range, and high reliability up close please.
Epicness (the openness, height difference, massive drops etc. such as Quarry),
Full of hidden spots such the hanging platform that acted as a secret ladder on highrise to get to the roof, and the smaller ones like jumping up onto the boxes on Scrapyard, the the little turret bunker on Rundown, etc. The little stuff counts. Even teddy bears, and stuff like the tactical loitering set on Quarry high on the rocks.
And please stop making every building have at least 3 gosh darn golly gee whiz entry points. The MW2 buildings were fine. They have to be power positions, a lot of the buildings in Black Ops 2 are pretty much useless because they're too open and have too many entry points.
Oh yeah, the ONLY way to balance Stealth perks perfectly is a combination of the MW2/COD4 routes - make the stealth perk CB from MW2 (complete invisibility to all killstreaks), but also have SP, Jugg, and Danger Close. I think that would be great.
And making tubes useless was not the way to go. I think MW2 had it fine, just keep the spawntube timer, and maybe tone it down a tiny bit, but not much.
EDIT 3: MW2 shotguns as primaries. Not hard to understand, SPAS would be balanced if all you can have with it is a pistol.
Please bring back the Desert Eagle.
Kill pick 10. Kill it with fire. It circumvents the traditional varied power of perk tiers.
And make perks powerful again. Bring back pro perks. None of this watered down castrated garbage we have in Black Ops 2. Make the attachments like fast mags, quickdraw, etc. perks again. They didn't need to be attachments.
EDIT 4: Commando balanced Ninja. Sitrep was fine, I actually liked it personally. Steady Aim was fair there too. MW3 aced green perks. Red perks would be perfect with Juggernaut. Blue perks would be perfect with One Man Army balanced.
In fact, I thought MW2 was perfect, except for the One Man Army tubes. I have so many hours in that game it's not even funny. I probably have 600-700+ hours. No other game has come even close.
Actually, IW, if you were to patch OMA refilling tubes, even years late, the community would laud you guys as heroes and most likely garner more interest in your next game, having finally listened to the community and made MW2 perfect.
Last Edit: Apr 10, 2013 20:12:43 GMT -5 by KenDirson
Post by Pegasus Actual on Apr 10, 2013 21:04:15 GMT -5
Bigger maps. Bigger than MW2 even. Somewhere between that and COD: UO. Specialist needs to return. SitRep Pro and Dead Silence balance from MW3 after they patched them to cancel out need to return.
Most importantly just try to design a fun balanced game, and don't pander to the 12 year old vote Nuketown/Dome/Hijacked every single time, spam spam spam, need to be able to get a kill 2 seconds after spawning crowd.
Post by Pegasus Actual on Apr 10, 2013 21:31:57 GMT -5
I saw a lot more Stalker than I did Sitrep.
Actually just dump Dead Silence, Ghost, Cold-blooded, all that stealth crap. And get rid of the minimap except when UAV is up. And give each faction its own set of guns so you can tell friendly fire from enemy fire by sound.
CHALLENGES →Make weapons have challenges somewhat possible to them. Getting multikills with the MW3 grenade launcher was not fun. Getting multikills with the XM-25 was not fun. Getting shotgun headshots was not fun either (no multiplier? That takes us to the next topic)
SHOTGUNS →Need to be weapons of skill. Make them very good at cqc and usable at the end of their range. You don't need MW2 SPAS-12 damage to do that, only small spreads. Take the BO2 R870 for example, and you can see why people hate it so much: It has a spread so big at close range that even if you don't aim it at all, there is still a high chance of a panic kill. Making the spread smaller and increasing just a little bit the sprint out time would easily fix that.
→Headshot multipliers small enough to need more than a single pellet hitting to have an effect., and more than two to semi autos.
→ADSing should be equal or better than steady aim on shotguns. If it took me 0.25 seconds to finally ads on a guy vs the instant hipfire shot, it should be better.
SNIPER RIFLES →Can do fine without quick scoping, if the maps suit them.
LMGs →Need high damage, high recoil (no gunkick please) and no damage dropoff, with the exception of the high rof and low recoil, like MW3 L86 with the gosh darn golly gee whiz thermal sight. That one could use a 4hk at about 1000 units
SMGs →Should be balanced like slightly weaker AR's with more bullets and better mobility, however less damage and less accuracy.
Secondaries →Launchers shouldn't have to ADS before shooting, but they should have a big spread when hipfiring. Also a stand alone grenade launcher shouldn't take as much time to ADS as the snipers ffs →If pistols don't kills in two shots at close range, they definitely don't need 6 at long. →Revolvers shouldn't take the whole mag to kill at long range →MPs need to be considerably worse than SMGs →No akimbo
Miscellaneous →No stalker/range/kick perks/proficiencies, make those attachments. Focus should be a perk. Melee and Breath should be scrapped. →Infinite sprint or a 3x multiplier instead of 2x. →Stability could be combined with Marksman. →Being able to hold breath with ACOG snipers and no increased breath perk, make it big by default (10 seconds is nice) →Don't have a single perk negating every means of detection in the game, because then it becomes the best perk in its tier. →No sound changing perks. If you want to sound whore you are as good as everyone else doing it, and if you don't want to be listen simply crouch walk. →Having a weak counter-explosive perk sucked, even more because of the weak explosives. Make both strong. →Power positions (think MW2 Derail center facility, the rooftops on the gas station and that warehouse second and third floor) instead of a single line of sight in the whole map. →No portable radar or whatever. →Scavenger replenish everything, however tacticals, lethals and launchers ammo only replenish every two packs. And unlike Scavenger from BO2, all enemies killed drop scavenger packs, not only from your kills & kills from teammates who also have it.
Last Edit: Apr 10, 2013 22:15:20 GMT -5 by mmacola
SitRep Pro and Dead Silence balance from MW3 after they patched them to cancel out need to return.
oh god no. sitrep in mw3 had the biggest tier monopoly ever. [/quote
I didn't mind how sitrep and dead silence were balanced. I suppose dead silence could make it so sitrep users hear them at some arbitrary % lower that 100% normal volume and 50% normal volume. But I hate the lack of audio cues in blops 2.
Post by Disgruntled Jigglypuff on Apr 10, 2013 22:07:57 GMT -5
Well, here goes something!
First thing is first, please do not be afraid of making shotguns powerful. You've heard it a million times and you'll hear it a million more, but the power that they had back in MW2 was pretty close to perfect. Just make them consistent.
If they were to watch these two videos demonstrating shotgun hitmarkers I would be flattered:
No I'm not trying to promote my channel. This is just what happens when you use shotguns.
Next, I believe that they should focus first on creating balanced weapons in each class. Then worry about how many guns there are. For example, lets just say that each weapon category has just three weapons. Each class would have the heavy hitter, then the high-RoF low damage weapon, and the one in the middle. I'd rather have 15 balanced weapons than 72 unbalanced weapons.
On the topic of weapons, something silly I'd like is a weapon category designated the novelty class. Basically, you would have the worst assault ruffle, SMG, LMG ,Sniper Rifle and shotgun in here. Hell put the riot shield in here too. These weapons would intentionally be bad and they would be there as "challenge" weapons. Just don't make them Executioner dual wield bad. Make sure that they are still usable.
Next, I personally believe that the basic idea of support streaks was not bad at all. However, the problem lies in the fact that there were offensive streaks in the support class. Support streaks should focus on you know, support not outright assault. The booby trap care package was actually quite fun though. Also, I really liked the idea of the specialist streaks. I felt that there were no real issues with it. Maybe the specialist bonus could be awarded at a slightly higher cost though.
Other ideas: - No hunter killer - Variable Zoom by default gets an A-OK from me, but I understand if people disagree. * Speaking of variable zoom, it would be pretty cool if semi auto ARs had the option to equip one. - No damage drop off on LMGs. - Make Ghost or it's equivalent hide you from UAV at all times. Or, instead just get rid of ghost and UAV all together. Replace them both with the Orbital VSAT, but that might slow down gameplay. - No attachment restrictions like no dual wiled and laser sight together. - Give all SRs an iron sight by default, but make sure that they each ADS slower than semi-auto ARs, especially the semi-auto SRs. - I believe brick said this, but an unraked playlist would be great. - Bring back riot shield planting.
I'll post more ideas as they come. Sorry if I copied your idea without giving credit.
What about global access to stats? I don't mean all of those complicated probaddie stats, but more simple ones like damage, range, movement speed, ads speed, silencer range reduction etc. I'm sick of these stat bars that are almost always inaccurate and cause more deception and falsehoods than they need be. Although I know finding stats is kind of what has fueled this forum, I think it will be more beneficial than harmful.
yeah, different ammo types would be a really cool thing. and more unique weapons would also be cool, the thing I disliked the most in MW3 was stuff like the 44 magnum and MP412 being pretty similar to each other, maybe one of them could've had a slower reload but more damage or something like that.
another thing I'd like to see is shotgun pellets not disappearing, I think that as long as their damage drops off to something low enough it will all be good for the weight measurements. I just really hate firing 8 shells with an auto shotgun and some guy is just out of my 15 meter range and he doesn't even get damaged. I think Gotham City Impostors had a system like that, or at least the range seemed very long on them.
I also like the support package idea, but maybe implemented a bit differently where each time you die, you lose 1 point to the streak or something. I don't know, more rewards that help the team might just be a better thing altogether. it is probably my favorite thing from MW3 though, I really enjoyed it
I would love to see BO2s unlock system return, but without the level gates. So you get an unlock token each level, and then buy whatever you want. Certain things like attachments and pro perks should still be linked to challenges/weapon level to retain some feeling of progress. Camos and pro perk challenges should only have to be completed once; they should be immediately available to the player once the gun/perk has been purchased next prestige.