Bungie's Destiny

[-3055-]

Never touched melee in CoD. Never touched melee in BL2. Ain't gon touch the melee in Destiny.
FUCK YO MAYLAY

[n1gh7]

Jun 15, 2014 22:26:34 GMT -5 -3055- said:

Never touched melee in CoD. Never touched melee in BL2. Ain't gon touch the melee in Destiny.
FUCK YO MAYLAY

That's how I feel about sliding/crouching.

[wings]

Jun 15, 2014 22:26:34 GMT -5 -3055- said:

Never touched melee in CoD. Never touched melee in BL2. Ain't gon touch the melee in Destiny.
FUCK YO MAYLAY

You're missing out then, at least for BL2. Krieg is hilarious as a melee build. But if you haven't got him then Zer0 is actually better, just he has a much steeper learning curve. Makes sense since Zer0 uses a fine weapon being his sword.

[Dumien]

UNLESS IT INVOLVES GIANT ROBOTS

[wittyscorpion]

Titan melee kills are brutally effective in Titanfall, so are pilot jump kicks and executions

[mannon]

Jump kicks are a little... too effective, but then if you don't just stand there and take it you can make yourself pretty hard to hit with one. Titan v titan melee is quite good, although my personal favorite is titan vs pilot melee.... I just love stuffing those wannabe rodeoers. hehehehehehehe I wish they would ragdoll and fly across the map instead of just bursting like water balloons. That would just make it even more enjoyable.

[wittyscorpion]

tooros: how do you like the weapons? Based on what I see:

1) Scout Rifle looks great;
2) Sniper Rifle looks fun;
3) Auto Rifle is surprisingly effective in capable hands;
4) Everybody seems to feel that Pulse Rifle (burst fire) is UP and needs buff;

Did not see anybody using Fusion Rifle, don't even know how it feels like.

[wittyscorpion]

PS exclusives are detailed: blog.us.playstation.com/2014/06/16/destinys-playstation-exclusive-content-detailed/

At launch, PS4 and PS3 owners will get exclusive access to a unique co-op Strike located on Mars, an exclusive competitive map, and a slew of exclusive guns, gear, and ships.

Note the word "at launch", so it is possible (and IMHO likely) that these are timed exclusives, and some time later they will become available on XBL. If not, then from my point of view the significant pieces are the strike mission, the MP map, and the two exotic weapons (one AR and one hand cannon). Nice bonus for PS players, but not a big factor in terms of choosing which console to buy.

[-3055-]

Jun 16, 2014 13:02:57 GMT -5 wittyscorpion said:

tooros: how do you like the weapons? Based on what I see:

1) Scout Rifle looks great;
2) Sniper Rifle looks fun;
3) Auto Rifle is surprisingly effective in capable hands;
4) Everybody seems to feel that Pulse Rifle (burst fire) is UP and needs buff;

Did not see anybody using Fusion Rifle, don't even know how it feels like.

I got to play it on the last day. I'm assuming you're asking about how they feel in competitive?

Here's what I noticed in Crucible (competitive)

Coming from a purely cod background, it feels very at home. Other than a slightly acceleration based look sensitivity, the aiming, the shooting, the recoil, it all feels fairly codish. One big distinction though: you better have good aim. With Auto Rifles (the most popular gun) you need more than 10 shots to kill, but with headshots it's somewhere around 5 or 6. I've never had a problem with going for headshots, but if you don't have good aim, don't expect to do well in Crucible.

Sniper rifles are fun, but maybe I'm just a bad sniper but I've noticed I'm always: 1) too far to kill anyone since sniper rifles are one shot kill only to the head and when enemies aren't engaged they always jump, double jump, and sprint everywhere, increasing target acquisition difficulty by a thousand times, or 2) too close to effectively use a sniper rifle. Their stock zoom is far as hell. It's only really useful to take people off turrets.

Scout rifles are terrible. A lot of them are 150 RPM and some of the better ones are 200 RPM. No.

Auto rifles are the most popular and obviously easiest to use. Get consistent headshots and these are the best.

Pulse rifles do roughly the same damage as auto rifles, so yeah. They kinda need a buff in Crucible.

Fusion rifles are pretty damn strong but the charge-up can get pretty annoying sometimes. Since DVK is a thing in this game.

Like always, shotguns can get frustrating but they're far from OP.

Heavy weapon ammo drops periodically and when it does, it's a gamechanger. LMGs are the best in Crucible and their bodyshots do the same damage as my auto rifles' headshots. And the headshots take out enemies in like 3 hits.

The Guardian HP and weapon damage (per class) are all the same in Crucible. All auto rifles do the same damage, all sniper rifles do the same damage. Certain things like mag count, reload, gun reticle, RoF, however, aren't standardized.

[wjang]

Jun 15, 2014 6:08:47 GMT -5 tooros said:

There are no shields.

if i remember correctly there was a thin white line above health bars that represented a shield. and melees are always a two hit ko if they had any shield left, implying no bleed through.

[-3055-]

Yeah, there are shields. Your total health is divided into 3 sections. The first two are shields and the last is actual health.

[wittyscorpion]

Jun 16, 2014 23:03:41 GMT -5 -3055- said:

Jun 16, 2014 13:02:57 GMT -5 wittyscorpion said:

tooros: how do you like the weapons? Based on what I see:

1) Scout Rifle looks great;
2) Sniper Rifle looks fun;
3) Auto Rifle is surprisingly effective in capable hands;
4) Everybody seems to feel that Pulse Rifle (burst fire) is UP and needs buff;

Did not see anybody using Fusion Rifle, don't even know how it feels like.

I got to play it on the last day. I'm assuming you're asking about how they feel in competitive?

Here's what I noticed in Crucible (competitive)

Coming from a purely cod background, it feels very at home. Other than a slightly acceleration based look sensitivity, the aiming, the shooting, the recoil, it all feels fairly codish. One big distinction though: you better have good aim. With Auto Rifles (the most popular gun) you need more than 10 shots to kill, but with headshots it's somewhere around 5 or 6. I've never had a problem with going for headshots, but if you don't have good aim, don't expect to do well in Crucible.

Sniper rifles are fun, but maybe I'm just a bad sniper but I've noticed I'm always: 1) too far to kill anyone since sniper rifles are one shot kill only to the head and when enemies aren't engaged they always jump, double jump, and sprint everywhere, increasing target acquisition difficulty by a thousand times, or 2) too close to effectively use a sniper rifle. Their stock zoom is far as hell. It's only really useful to take people off turrets.

Scout rifles are terrible. A lot of them are 150 RPM and some of the better ones are 200 RPM. No.

Auto rifles are the most popular and obviously easiest to use. Get consistent headshots and these are the best.

Pulse rifles do roughly the same damage as auto rifles, so yeah. They kinda need a buff in Crucible.

Fusion rifles are pretty gosh darn golly gee whiz strong but the charge-up can get pretty annoying sometimes. Since DVK is a thing in this game.

Like always, shotguns can get frustrating but they're far from OP.

Heavy weapon ammo drops periodically and when it does, it's a gamechanger. LMGs are the best in Crucible and their bodyshots do the same damage as my auto rifles' headshots. And the headshots take out enemies in like 3 hits.

The Guardian HP and weapon damage (per class) are all the same in Crucible. All auto rifles do the same damage, all sniper rifles do the same damage. Certain things like mag count, reload, gun reticle, RoF, however, aren't standardized.

Great, thanks for the detailed impressions.

Regarding Scout Rifle, I guess it totally depends on what crowd are doing the assessment. I heard from Halo players that Scout Rifle is definitely the way to go.

The pleasant surprise is that the CoD Players feel right at home when playing Destiny. I was concerned that although Destiny is designed to be more accessible than Halo, most CoD players would still feel foreign when playing it. Looks like this is no longer a concern.

Really look forward to playing beta now

[tooros]

The 100% health bar I thought was divided into 4 section? - Each section 25% Below 25% 'health' is a two stage refill - up to 25% - pause - up to 100%

***EDIT. WRONG!***
I found this eventually 1920 image - it is 3 sections (but I swear the middle section is larger in game.


I certainly didn't notice an additional shield bar??!

Anyway - however you sub divide it - it drops and fully regenerates. It's not like Halo in my opinion, the quicker TTK affects the way it works a lot.
It's not like an overlay bar where you health is lower than your shields. Everything always refills to 100%.

From my observation with the guns I found - Not all rifles are the same within class - there's a 450 + 900 rpm full auto for example, the 900 rpm is stupid.

Scout Rifles = DMR = Fun if you can hit the target - definitely the most powerful but also the hardest to use. I Can see me resorting for full auto for the real PVP.
Pulse Rifles seemed weaker and the recoil too high to be really effective - they need something.
Fusion rifles are charge and burst but, the one I had, kicked up so much that barely 2 or 3 of the burst would hit unless in shotgun range - where you should be using a shotgun - which are (pretty much) straight out of Halo.
Snipers are great, fast firing - 2nd shot instantly available if the 1st isn't a headshot.

I think there's much more to the weapons than immediately meets the eye - there are manufacturers, with different traits, and elemental damage. It's too early to draw much but, of the guns I found, the above it what I thought.

I'm glad it wasn't just me that felt the similarity with CoD guns was much more than any previous Halo game.

Everything has ADS too.

[wittyscorpion]

Talking about ADS, how does hip fire behave? In Halo hip fire is also hitscan so the only reason for ADS is to get a better zoom. I assume that has been changed in Destiny?

[wittyscorpion]

Alpha tech analysis: www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-destiny-alpha-tech-analysis

TL;DR: Bungie's attention to detail and incredibly polished combat results in something decidedly special. Few developers manage to pull off world-building quite like Bungie and it's fantastic to see the technology fully pulling its weight in delivering a unique vision.

On related news: Bungie said that the graphics in their most recent dev build is already significantly better than the one in Alpha.

For bros who are still torn between PS4 and XONE: I suggest that you wait until XONE beta starts before deciding to go with XONE. Nothing on XONE has been shown yet, so it is possible that XONE version is significantly inferior to PS4 one. If you have a keen eye for graphic details and Destiny is the main factor in your next gen purchase decision making, you may want to wait until Destiny on XONE is shown to the public.

[tooros]

Jun 17, 2014 9:38:03 GMT -5 wittyscorpion said:

Talking about ADS, how does hip fire behave? In Halo hip fire is also hitscan so the only reason for ADS is to get a better zoom. I assume that has been changed in Destiny?

I know speculation is the enemy of this board so I hesitate a little but:

I'm pretty sure there is a hip fire penalty. Not as bad as CoD but still significant.
I also think there's a more severe random effect if firing a sniper from the hip.
There is an increase in size of the crosshairs while jumping.
I KNOW no-one in the crucible was successfully halo-hopping around and doing any good.
It must be because of this big accuracy kick-in-the-balls jump penalty.

You can see it here @3:46


Personally - I like that - I hate the boing boing boing thing that pervades Halo.

[wittyscorpion]

Penalize "halo jumping" in combat is another design detail to make the game more appealing to CoD players.

There has been a long history of trash talking between Halo crowd and CoD crowd, especially when it comes to debate of gun skills. I am very intrigued to see which side is going to have the upper hand in Destiny, where we finally have a game that both sides can play together (or against each other) on.

[-3055-]

I remember I tried playing the PvP like halo... jumpshots and melees for days, son. But neither of that work. It's all gunplay.

For PvE scout rifles are fairly decent. I'd say the sniper rifles are better but they're a completely different weapon slot so not a fair comparison.
Pulse rifles hold their own in PvE.
Fusion rifles are painfully slow. They don't really have that high of a damage output in PvE to justify the charge.

From watching this and playing cod I'd say halo needs more gunskill. 3 shots on an enemy for a kill is an absolute joke compared to Destiny.

[-3055-]

Oh also how is the minimap on halo like? This one is just like a circle divided into 8 slices, and whenever an enemy is near the corresponding slice (north, east, south, west, or the diagonals) lights up. Unless you're crouched and not moving you will always show up when you close in on an enemy. There's no surprise attack in Destiny unless you corner camp a flag.

[n1gh7]

Mini map sounds like Halo's which is good. Theres a lot of strategy to gain from having a motion based mini map. I'm kinda sad that they moved off from Halo's model of hip fire being the primary method of shooting and firing effectively with "ADS" only giving zoom. Forcing players to use ADS to shoot effectively slows down the game. From that perspective it's good that the lowered the ttks from halo. Another thing that ADS does is it makes the game more random, which is bad for competitive multiplayer. The randomness from recoil while ADS is not something I'm a fan of and it lowers the gunskill required by players in that players are only able to fight in a 2D plane. But I guess I'll have to get used to Halo's old model being gone.

[wittyscorpion]

Forbes.com feels the need to have a negative review, so they asked a PC player who never liked FPS on console to do the job: www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2014/06/15/the-number-one-problem-with-destiny/

His main complaints:

1) Graphics does not look spectacular (alpha build on console from a PC gamer's view? This is like a compliment);
2) Game play on console feels clunkier (of course, if keyboard and mouse are his preferred "weapon" of choice);
3) Peter Dinklage voice acting is disappointing (which I found pretty cool, so it is basically a very subjective personal preference);

Don't want to sound like a fanboy here (at least not too much), but if this is the best a negative review can do, then I can only feel more excited about the game

[mannon]

I don't know about other Halo's but in Halo: Reach zoom was definitely more than just visual. Your cone of fire shrinks as you zoom in as well. In other words the bloom reticle doesn't appear to be relative, but actually represents the 2D area on screen where shots will fall. Zooming in does not change the reticle bloom on screen and shots fired still seem to fall within it, the net effect being that zooming in reduces the bloom cone by the same factor as the FOV reduction, making you far more accurate.

This is easily tested with various weapons, DMR is what I used most for testing this.
denkirson.proboards.com/thread/2680/accuracy-zooming

[n1gh7]

Yeah I should clarify, the zoom in Halos didn't change the size of the reticle relative to the screen, but in destiny, the ADS will probably have a low or 0 spread in addition to the zoom. The big difference between halo and destiny is how large the hip fire spread is.

[-3055-]

Jun 17, 2014 12:04:02 GMT -5 wittyscorpion said:

Forbes.com feels the need to have a negative review, so they asked a PC player who never liked FPS on console to do the job: www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2014/06/15/the-number-one-problem-with-destiny/

His main complaints:

1) Graphics does not look spectacular (alpha build on console from a PC gamer's view? This is like a compliment);
2) Game play on console feels clunkier (of course, if keyboard and mouse are his preferred "weapon" of choice);
3) Peter Dinklage voice acting is disappointing (which I found pretty cool, so it is basically a very subjective personal preference);

Don't want to sound like a fanboy here (at least not too much), but if this is the best a negative review can do, then I can only feel more excited about the game

1. Graphics look spectacular. I'm not a pc guy so obviously I don't have much to compare to but it's far better than any other PS4 game I've played.
2. I'd say everything is pretty smooth. Nothing feels too out of place to be honest.
3. His voice acting is VERY disappointing. He doesn't understand that you still need to act for voice acting. There are times where I feel like they hired a complete amateur because his expressions sound so unbearably fake.

[wings]

Jun 17, 2014 10:39:12 GMT -5 wittyscorpion said:

Penalize "halo jumping" in combat is another design detail to make the game more appealing to CoD players.

There has been a long history of trash talking between Halo crowd and CoD crowd, especially when it comes to debate of gun skills. I am very intrigued to see which side is going to have the upper hand in Destiny, where we finally have a game that both sides can play together (or against each other) on.

Wonder how I'd fare since I do not conside myself a member of the COD crowd, since it is not my most played shooter (Gears is). I have seen a few debates between those two bunch of fanboys and I swear both games have the strongest amount of aim assist out of all the different series out there.

[-3055-]

Oh yeah, aim assist.

Aim assist while ADS in Destiny is much higher in CoD. Aim assist while hipfiring in Destiny is lower than CoD. In this aspect it feels a lot like Borderlands.

[wings]

I guess this is one way to reward accuracy. On another site I visit COD players were moaning about Chrome Lined in Ghosts, an attachment that rewards accuracy. Only in COD...

[wittyscorpion]

Another article complaining about voice acting, so it must be vey bad:

www.polygon.com/2014/6/17/5817950/destiny-dinklage-moon-wizard

There are still plenty of time to even do the voice from the scratch, the question is whether they are willing. We also have no idea how much recording has been done, if they are smart they would have left the bulk of the work until the late stage. After all, sound is usually the last piece to get in.

We can only wait and see.

[-3055-]

Yeah. I mean I don't even care that much about dialogue or story or voice acting or whatever as long as the gameplay is good but it's just so bad it kinda... forces you to focus on it.

Pretty much my only complaint, though. And even if they don't re-record, eh. Whatever. Still a great game.

[n1gh7]

I thought his voice being kinda flat was a stylistic choice, him being an AI and all. Not all AIs have to be Cortana.