VoG Raid discussion (may contain spoilers)

[GodMars]

Sept 22, 2014 14:56:36 GMT -5 hebbnh said:

Dumien, what level would you recommend a group be to realistically attempt to clear the raid on normal without a ton of difficulty/frustration (outside of getting the communication and mechanics down)? I'm wondering if it would make sense to try to get a group together to at least clear the "raising the spire" stage of the raid to get some cheap rewards from the first chest before the reset tomorrow, then maybe give it a real shot at completion next week. My brother and I are both at 25 right now. I could be 26 if I upgraded but I've been hoarding my shards for the time being. Anybody else thinking about giving it a go soon?

PS4 clan is already at and working on Atheon.

[hebbnh]

Sept 22, 2014 15:18:52 GMT -5 GodMars said:

Sept 22, 2014 14:56:36 GMT -5 hebbnh said:

Dumien, what level would you recommend a group be to realistically attempt to clear the raid on normal without a ton of difficulty/frustration (outside of getting the communication and mechanics down)? I'm wondering if it would make sense to try to get a group together to at least clear the "raising the spire" stage of the raid to get some cheap rewards from the first chest before the reset tomorrow, then maybe give it a real shot at completion next week. My brother and I are both at 25 right now. I could be 26 if I upgraded but I've been hoarding my shards for the time being. Anybody else thinking about giving it a go soon?

PS4 clan is already at and working on Atheon.

Nice!  What level(s) are you at, and how has it gone for you so far?  Hopefully us XBros can get there soon.

[Dumien]

Sept 22, 2014 14:56:36 GMT -5 hebbnh said:

Dumien, what level would you recommend a group be to realistically attempt to clear the raid on normal without a ton of difficulty/frustration (outside of getting the communication and mechanics down)? I'm wondering if it would make sense to try to get a group together to at least clear the "raising the spire" stage of the raid to get some cheap rewards from the first chest before the reset tomorrow, then maybe give it a real shot at completion next week. My brother and I are both at 25 right now. I could be 26 if I upgraded but I've been hoarding my shards for the time being. Anybody else thinking about giving it a go soon?

At least three 28s at least with three 27s at the minimum. You will be facing level 29s near Atheon and I've seen 26s be dead weight.

The reason I mention the "at least three" is because during the final room (including the atheon fight) there will be level 29 enemies that the 26s will just be dead weight against. Many of these rooms require three teams of two (and in the Atheon fight...two teams of three). On each team you should have at least one player capable of putting down any enemy they come across with minimum time investment.

If any of you are a low level sunsinger you could put them on relic duty for the relic parts as the fireborn ability will make them be slightly more resiliant to mitigate the level disadvantage.

At the first part you are talking about...you might be able to get away with doing it supe early... Your greatest problem will be the between round minions that Templar sends out (armored harpies) and the infinitely respawning sniper hobgoblins. If you can't survive one hit from them you should just quit and come back when you have the right gear.

[hebbnh]

Sept 22, 2014 15:36:13 GMT -5 Dumien said:

Sept 22, 2014 14:56:36 GMT -5 hebbnh said:

Dumien, what level would you recommend a group be to realistically attempt to clear the raid on normal without a ton of difficulty/frustration (outside of getting the communication and mechanics down)? I'm wondering if it would make sense to try to get a group together to at least clear the "raising the spire" stage of the raid to get some cheap rewards from the first chest before the reset tomorrow, then maybe give it a real shot at completion next week. My brother and I are both at 25 right now. I could be 26 if I upgraded but I've been hoarding my shards for the time being. Anybody else thinking about giving it a go soon?

At least three 28s at least with three 27s at the minimum. You will be facing level 29s near Atheon and I've seen 26s be dead weight.

The reason I mention the "at least three" is because during the final room (including the atheon fight) there will be level 29 enemies that the 26s will just be dead weight against. Many of these rooms require three teams of two (and in the Atheon fight...two teams of three). On each team you should have at least one player capable of putting down any enemy they come across with minimum time investment.

If any of you are a low level sunsinger you could put them on relic duty for the relic parts as the fireborn ability will make them be slightly more resiliant to mitigate the level disadvantage.

At the first part you are talking about...you might be able to get away with doing it supe early... Your greatest problem will be the between round minions that Templar sends out (armored harpies) and the infinitely respawning sniper hobgoblins. If you can't survive one hit from them you should just quit and come back when you have the right gear.

Do you think a group of 25-26s (or maybe lower than that even, not sure who all we'd be able to get tonight since it's short notice) would have a good chance of clearing just the opening "spire" section?  I don't have any illusions about even attempting the Templar or anything else that's actually within the VoG yet, but raising the spire and getting to that first loot chest looked like it might be doable.  I don't recall seeing any enemies in that section above 26 in the vids I've watched.  Any XBros want to make an attempt at this tonight before the weekly reset?

[Dumien]

Sept 22, 2014 15:18:52 GMT -5 GodMars said:

Sept 22, 2014 14:56:36 GMT -5 hebbnh said:

Dumien, what level would you recommend a group be to realistically attempt to clear the raid on normal without a ton of difficulty/frustration (outside of getting the communication and mechanics down)? I'm wondering if it would make sense to try to get a group together to at least clear the "raising the spire" stage of the raid to get some cheap rewards from the first chest before the reset tomorrow, then maybe give it a real shot at completion next week. My brother and I are both at 25 right now. I could be 26 if I upgraded but I've been hoarding my shards for the time being. Anybody else thinking about giving it a go soon?

PS4 clan is already at and working on Atheon.

Best of Luck. Don't get angry. You got this. Jump those harpies!

[Dumien]

Sept 22, 2014 15:52:53 GMT -5 hebbnh said:

Sept 22, 2014 15:36:13 GMT -5 Dumien said:

At least three 28s at least with three 27s at the minimum. You will be facing level 29s near Atheon and I've seen 26s be dead weight.

The reason I mention the "at least three" is because during the final room (including the atheon fight) there will be level 29 enemies that the 26s will just be dead weight against. Many of these rooms require three teams of two (and in the Atheon fight...two teams of three). On each team you should have at least one player capable of putting down any enemy they come across with minimum time investment.

If any of you are a low level sunsinger you could put them on relic duty for the relic parts as the fireborn ability will make them be slightly more resiliant to mitigate the level disadvantage.

At the first part you are talking about...you might be able to get away with doing it supe early... Your greatest problem will be the between round minions that Templar sends out (armored harpies) and the infinitely respawning sniper hobgoblins. If you can't survive one hit from them you should just quit and come back when you have the right gear.

Do you think a group of 25-26s (or maybe lower than that even, not sure who all we'd be able to get tonight since it's short notice) would have a good chance of clearing just the opening "spire" section?  I don't have any illusions about even attempting the Templar or anything else that's actually within the VoG yet, but raising the spire and getting to that first loot chest looked like it might be doable.  I don't recall seeing any enemies in that section above 26 in the vids I've watched.  Any XBros want to make an attempt at this tonight before the weekly reset?

Yes. That part is doable. Just focusfire the Praetorians. You might even be able to eek out a complete trip to the Gorgon's maze (and the two chests that await).

[Dumien]

Also, you should friend me. I need more Denbros to play with.

[GodMars]

Sept 22, 2014 15:56:08 GMT -5 Dumien said:

Sept 22, 2014 15:18:52 GMT -5 GodMars said:

PS4 clan is already at and working on Atheon.

Best of Luck. Don't get angry. You got this. Jump those harpies!

They've been at it for around five hours now. I bowed our after two. And I believe they're trying to gun down the harpies, not jump over them.

[mannon]

I like how when people talk about the raid it sounds like some eccentric game of D&D to me since I actually know almost nothing about the specifics... yet. ;3 Makes me feel like there's still a whole new world yet to open up to me in this game... which is pretty much true considering I haven't even been past the Moon yet. heh (I'm not the type to plow through the story missions as fast as possible.)

[Dumien]

Eh. Gunning them down/supering them is a good plan, but standing in places where the harpies can't reach and jumping over them is pretty effective as well. The people going into the portal and collecting the relic have the hardest job since they have to kill oracles, communicate location, fight minotaurs, AND dodge harpies. The people outside just have to turn on the portals and dodge harpies. Clearing them out is somewhat important, but staying alive is the only win condition you need to worry about until the buff comes up. Jumping them to make them preemptively suicide is one of the best ways you can accomplish both tasks.

[Dumien]

Sept 22, 2014 16:31:52 GMT -5 mannon said:

I like how when people talk about the raid it sounds like some eccentric game of D&D to me since I actually know almost nothing about the specifics... yet. ;3 Makes me feel like there's still a whole new world yet to open up to me in this game... which is pretty much true considering I haven't even been past the Moon yet. heh (I'm not the type to plow through the story missions as fast as possible.)

It is a whole new game...look at the way the devlopers introduce new elements of gameplay.

The devs introduce you to a new mechanic early on (insta death via negation/marks). Then they show you how to survive (cleansed by light). Then they introduct new methods of insta death (marked by oracle). Then they introduce you to a new method of cleanising (the relic). Then they introduce stealth gameplay via new enemy type (gorgons). Then they introduce portals. Then they introduce darkness. Then they reintroduce oracles. Then they introduce a way to get rid of darkness (surprise its the relic again). Then you fight the boss. Then they introduce new enemy AI just to confuse you (splody harpies). Then they introduce the buff "Time's Vengeance." Then you figure out what the buff does.

Fantastic stuff.

Most of the fun is the fact so many skillsets are needed (real life). Administration. Puzzle Solving. Exploration. We in the area before the Templar boss for about 10 minutes just brainstorming and coming up with plans. For Atheon we sat in orbit for a while doing the same thing.

[mannon]

And just think, we're getting at least two more Raids in the expansions!

[Dumien]

Oh and lots of people get stuck at the parkour parts...teehee.

I'm hungry for more expansions. I severely underestimated Bungie's potential to bust out a great raiding experience.

[GodMars]

They're getting him down to around 40%

[wittyscorpion]

They need to make Raid a spectator event. I am not talking about broadcasting veteran's speed run attempts which I am sure there are already plenty of on Twitch and YouTube, I mean watching rookie teams getting creamed, ideally with developer commentary (a politically correct way of saying laugh their ass off )

Think of it more: it would be like watching a reality TV show like Amazing Race

hebbnh: Bungie explicitly stated "< level 26" in Raid = suicide (which they put it in a nicer way). Based on what Dumien said above, they are certainly not kidding

[wings]

Is the gear actually worth it though?

[Dumien]

Yup... as all high level borderlands2 players know...1 level is a HUGE difference. 30 is gonna be so important. One player already got there.

As far as gear goes... there is a void damage primary called Atheon's epilouge. I got a fire damage auto-scout rifle that gets more stable as it fires. The reticle doesn't move as I crit enemies and melt wizards. Top notch reward right there.

Also I should mention I strategically deleted my level 25 hunter...I wonder if anyone can guess why.

[iw5000]

I got to level 20 last night. Yay me.

I am now trying to figure out what to do next.

I pretty much gave up on the Crucible this past week (my thoughts are in another post). I just hammered down a lot of bounties and did a few Strike missions? I am still not sure what the difference is between a planet based end-story strike mission, and the strike missions on that separate planet/playlist. I guess it's like this?

- Planet Strikes (end of story on the planet)
- Strike Playlist (on a separate playlistm new strikes appear each week)
- Super duper Strikes, like the Vault of Glass? these are for high level studs?

Regardless, I got to 20. I am slowly getting into the game, and with not doing Crucible, having more fun.

[hebbnh]

That's basically it. Planet strikes are just story missions, no point in running them again that I can see unless it's to complete a bounty and you just want to blow through it quickly. The Strike playlists reward you with gear, vanguard marks, and vanguard reputation. Most of the gear I've seen is better than what I came across by playing through the story. Some of this gear will have light, which allows you to increase your level, and thus take on higher level strikes in the playlist, which will earn you more gear/marks/rep. Then there are Heroic and Nightfall "super duper strikes" which ramp up the difficulty even more, but of course also bring even greater rewards. Then there's the Vault of Glass, which is a whole other beast altogether, and is very unlike anything else in the game to that point with it's complexity and mechanics. I haven't taken a crack at it yet, but it demands knowing exactly what you're supposed to be doing and being able to execute almost flawlessly. Even tiny mistakes there can be the difference between taking down a boss or having your whole team wipe.

[wittyscorpion]

Sept 23, 2014 10:02:12 GMT -5 iw5000 said:

I got to level 20 last night. Yay me.

I am now trying to figure out what to do next.

I pretty much gave up on the Crucible this past week (my thoughts are in another post). I just hammered down a lot of bounties and did a few Strike missions? I am still not sure what the difference is between a planet based end-story strike mission, and the strike missions on that separate planet/playlist. I guess it's like this?

- Planet Strikes (end of story on the planet)
- Strike Playlist (on a separate playlistm new strikes appear each week)
- Super duper Strikes, like the Vault of Glass? these are for high level studs?

Regardless, I got to 20. I am slowly getting into the game, and with not doing Crucible, having more fun.

Excellent! I was a little worried that you won't like the game so much to the point of not completing the story mission.

There are many things you can do at this juncture:

1) Start a new character and go through the story missions again, and this time you can pay closer attention to the story; (e.g.: see whether this conspiracy theory can pan out: denkirson.proboards.com/thread/7314/destiny-conspiracy-theory-beneath-spoiler );

2) Continue your level 20 character into higher levels. See this thread for more info: denkirson.proboards.com/thread/7311/destiny-leveling-discussion . My OP is trying to outline what to do but it is not very complete. Let me know in that thread what's unclear and what needs to be added;

3) Go back to Crucible. You should now be better equipped to play that: denkirson.proboards.com/thread/7320/equipping-pvp, denkirson.proboards.com/thread/7301/5-matches-pvp ;

4) Play whatever you want with whatever character you feel like playing. Exploration is always a stress free way to have fun;

[iw5000]

To let you know Witty, I completely jumped around the story missions and did most out of order. For example. I have only done one story mission on Venus, but yet have two or three story missions done on Mars, playing with other people. Doing bounties, some stories and a strike or two. I don't even have Mars opened up yet (on my screen), but I think I have completed all the story parts.

So to be blunt, at this point I don't even know what the story is about. I have no fvcking clue what is going on. But that's ok. That's honestly not ruining any part of the game for me. No big deal. I've played all the Halo games and I feel like I know the jist of things, I can fill in the pieces. Peter Kinkledge is basically Halo's Cortana. The planet ball (ie, Halo ring) brought happiness to earth , but darkness followed. The Darkness also spews forth bad guys just like Halo. Lizards that like to wear plate mail armor. Yeah. That. Destiny though also includes D&D stuff like wizard bad guys too. Got it. Just like Halo, the bad guys fight each other and pray to some God. Got it. And just like Halo, Cortana/Kinkledge awakens my super character who goes off to kill the bad guys, to save humanity before it's to late (or at least until the sequel comes out) There is also a deep mystery there to be found,.... but much like Halo, by the time I get to it, I will be hopelessly lost anyways in a convoluted plot. So I STFU, and just kill lots of sh1t and have fun!

That's basically it?

I'm good with it.

I'm enjoying the leveling stuff, and looting. That is turning out to be fun. Still confused as Foxtrot, which is hard for my obsessive compulsive need to understand all things, but I am dealing. I am also enjoying the big boss battles, playing with friends. That's some fun epic stuff there. Crucible? Again, that's stupid allowing higher level people to have more abilities. Dumb and more dumb (so I just don't play it). All in all, it's growing on me.

[iw5000]

My highlight yesterday was this. I was trying to complete a bounty getting six patrol missions on the Moon. I was near a beacon by the big humongous crater. I jumped off my bike, killed a lizard, and then fell into this big azz deep ditch that had glowing lights at the bottom. I was steaming mad, as I was also doing a "get 9,000 XP without dying" bounty. But lo and behold, after falling 30 meters, I didn't die. I landed on a rock. A rock that was right next to a pirate treasure chest. Wow. Talk about a hidden find!!!! I think I might be only person who knows about this. I opened it and there was a graviton shotgun in there.

Props to me.

[wittyscorpion]

Sept 23, 2014 14:24:37 GMT -5 iw5000 said:

My highlight yesterday was this. I was trying to complete a bounty getting six patrol missions on the Moon. I was near a beacon by the big humongous crater. I jumped off my bike, killed a lizard, and then fell into this big azz deep ditch that had glowing lights at the bottom. I was steaming mad, as I was also doing a "get 9,000 XP without dying" bounty. But lo and behold, after falling 30 meters, I didn't die. I landed on a rock. A rock that was right next to a pirate treasure chest. Wow. Talk about a hidden find!!!! I think I might be only person who knows about this. I opened it and there was a graviton shotgun in there.

Props to me.

Nice. So I should jump into anything I can jump into just in case that there is a bottom. Just make sure that I don't do it when I have an active "complete xxx without dying" bounty on

[iw5000]

Seriously, I almost sh1t my pants as I was plummeting into the ditch, as the 5,000xp was going to get me to level 18. I was at 8,500 or so. I would have had to start all over.

Again, I am pretty sure I am on the only one in the destiny world who has found this (and if not, please don't say anything. Let me have this one bit of glory)

[mannon]

I'm just eager to go jump in your... (wait let's not phrase it like that...) THAT hole and get that chest myself. I wonder if it's a golden chest or one that respawns.

[wittyscorpion]

At least 2 teams have been confirmed for beating the VoG on hard, including the Prime Guard team that beat VoG normal as world's first (they came in as close second for the race on hard).

The speed run race of clearing hard in fastest time is now on…

[iw5000]

Sept 23, 2014 15:40:44 GMT -5 mannon said:

I'm just eager to go jump in your... (wait let's not phrase it like that...) THAT hole and get that chest myself. I wonder if it's a golden chest or one that respawns.

It is one that respawns, i just went back last night to look. It wasn't there. The chest had moved to inside the big crater dug into the moon, that sits nearby.

[iw5000]

Sept 24, 2014 2:26:59 GMT -5 wittyscorpion said:

At least 2 teams have been confirmed for beating the VoG on hard, including the Prime Guard team that beat VoG normal as world's first (they came in as close second for the race on hard).

The speed run race of clearing hard in fastest time is now on…

Is there another level above Hard?

What are the levels? Easy? Hard? ...?

[mannon]

As far as I know there is only normal and hard.

[Dumien]

believe me. Hard is HARD. You don't need anything with a higher difficulty.