Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Mar 10, 2015 18:00:48 GMT -5
I feel that Destiny's #1 claim to gaming history is the FPS raiding experience. They proved it can be an enjoyable experience.
The number one criticism about the game from critics upon release was the 20-28 grinding experience between the endgame content and the initial 1-20 leveling experience. That is a fair critique of a common MMO issue. The fact of the matter is...the critics that took the time to get to the end game experience actually lauded it. Some critics even went as far as saying it was an experience worth grinding for.
I certainly feel it is worth grinding for. I'm pretty sure many of you guys feel the same way. I knew people on my friends list who only played CoD games and were never interested in the MMO or RPG experience. Some of these guys are now avid Destiny players that truly enjoy the raiding experience.
Now... the raids are still glitchy as hell. Swords get dropped. Templars bubbles sometimes glitch out. Crota does silly cheaty things. Sometimes the relic doesn't work. Sometimes totems just kill everyone. Crota raid might be a bit too short. Things in general? Not perfect.
But that is ok.
Destiny set a precedent for other companies. Bungie proved that the FPS raiding experience is something that bro brah FPS gamers and hardcore MMO fans can all enjoy. Six people can sit in a lobby together for 5+ hours (over the course of a few days even) and try to figure out strategies for an ultra difficult strategic challenge that just so happens to require skill in shooters. Destiny just passed the 17 million player mark (and still growing) thanks, in no small part, to a weekly sustained experience. Now...I'm not sure if Bungie will iron out ALL of the kinks...they might...but that isn't the point of this thread.
I'm really excited for what other developers will do based off of the success seen here. Imagine a Borderlands with Destiny style raids. I can't wait to see the future.
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 10, 2015 18:11:14 GMT -5
Nice post.
I do have to ask this though. Where are you getting the 17 million from? Checking VGChartz, they show a combined 10.01 million in sales, for all four console platforms...as of Feb 21, 2015. Yes, i know VG isn't some dead perfect predictor service, but they do tend to be pretty close. Seven million is a huge difference. Something seems off.
I have googled around looking, and for the most part, Activision has remained quiet on sales. Only VGChartz is talking and they show 10 million. That also matches up very strongly with the initial sales that were reported, that projected out to around 10-11 million for the entire 12 months. Ten tracks correctly. Looking for anything new, the best i could find is a registered users by the end of last November (3 months in) and that gave the appearance of around 8 million in sales. Destiny didn't sell that well over the holidays, to push it much higher.
So where is the 17 million coming from?
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wittyscorpion
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Post by wittyscorpion on Mar 10, 2015 19:33:26 GMT -5
It is an officially number provided by Bungie or ActiVision (can't remember which). The discrepancy is probably due to the result of some players having multiple Destiny accounts on a single game copy?
For example: I have 2 Destiny accounts on my XONE for one digital copy, one is my main account, the other was created when my wife tried the game for 1 hour (and decided she will not have time for this).
Both XONE and PS4 support game sharing like this.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Mar 10, 2015 20:07:04 GMT -5
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 10, 2015 23:39:02 GMT -5
Ok. But that's not 17 million sold. It's just registered users. That's just more Activisiion game playing to avoid disclosing real factual data.
I would say actual games sold, is closer to 10 million.
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 10, 2015 23:40:04 GMT -5
And yes, I have two accounts too.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 11, 2015 7:58:41 GMT -5
Does VGChartz capture digital downloads, or does it only count physical copies sold by retailers? Not that I think there's 7 million people who downloaded the game going unaccounted for, but a million or two might be reasonable.
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Post by GodMars on Mar 11, 2015 8:22:59 GMT -5
Does VGChartz capture digital downloads, or does it only count physical copies sold by retailers? Not that I think there's 7 million people who downloaded the game going unaccounted for, but a million or two might be reasonable. VGChartz does not include digital downloads.
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tooros
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Post by tooros on Mar 11, 2015 9:47:16 GMT -5
Imagine a Borderlands with Destiny style raids. I can't wait to see the future. I'm moist with anticipation. (Seriously) I can't remember exactly when it happened but, co-op blasting took over from competitive MP a while ago for me (it probably was BL2 that did it but Gears and Halo were always great as well.) Maybe it's my age!
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 11, 2015 10:10:18 GMT -5
Dumien wasn't talking about units sold. He was talking about players. Some of that certainly will be dup accounts. Some of that will legitimately be multiple players playing on the same copy sold.
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wittyscorpion
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Post by wittyscorpion on Mar 11, 2015 11:04:42 GMT -5
Does VGChartz capture digital downloads, or does it only count physical copies sold by retailers? Not that I think there's 7 million people who downloaded the game going unaccounted for, but a million or two might be reasonable. VGChartz does not include digital downloads. Do we know this for sure? I thought they have some level of guesses on digital purchase. If they include nothing from digital, then their usefulness will diminish significantly over time as there are increasing number of players going digital. Anyways, with the 2 numbers we can guess that the number of copies sold is around 12-15 million across all platforms.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 11, 2015 12:00:48 GMT -5
I sure as hell never considered getting Destiny on anything but digital. I knew this wouldn't be a game I would play a month or two and sell. I want it always on the system, ready for me to launch. Honestly after using Steam so much on PC I don't even like disks anymore. They are nothing more than an annoyance unless I'm planning to resell the game later.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Mar 11, 2015 12:37:21 GMT -5
guys the 17 million player number wasn't important or relevant to the thread.
I just thought it was neat.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Mar 11, 2015 12:43:41 GMT -5
guys the 17 million player number wasn't important or relevant to the thread. I just thought it was neat. I kinda thought so too
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Post by GodMars on Mar 11, 2015 12:49:48 GMT -5
VGChartz does not include digital downloads. Do we know this for sure? Yes
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 11, 2015 21:14:09 GMT -5
Does VGChartz capture digital downloads, or does it only count physical copies sold by retailers? Not that I think there's 7 million people who downloaded the game going unaccounted for, but a million or two might be reasonable. VGChartz does not include digital downloads. Yes, i have heard that passed around quite often. But....from what i have read, VGChartz does not release exact details of how it estimates it's sales, only that it uses many evolving and updating tools. Also, from what i have read, most all companies do not release digital console sales at all. So anything done, would be done via estimation and other indirect methods. Regardless, the game did not sell 17 million units. With or without Digital sales. That is classic Activision bullsh1t and lies, trying to manipulate the media. They started doing this a few years ago with CoD and have continued right on doing it with Destiny. There are less people playing this game than CoDAW right now, and that's not saying much.
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 11, 2015 21:19:10 GMT -5
guys the 17 million player number wasn't important or relevant to the thread. I just thought it was neat. I kinda thought so too I hear you Dumien. It just annoys me to no end how Activision manipulates the media with silly numbers that mean nothing. Like how they released "Games Shipped" a while ago in place of 1 week actual sales data. Just silly manipulation. And now this, using 'registered users' as some reported figure. It's dumb. It means nothing. I have two accounts. Does that mean there are 'two' of me?
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 11, 2015 21:23:47 GMT -5
VGChartz does not include digital downloads. Do we know this for sure? I thought they have some level of guesses on digital purchase. If they include nothing from digital, then their usefulness will diminish significantly over time as there are increasing number of players going digital. Anyways, with the 2 numbers we can guess that the number of copies sold is around 12-15 million across all platforms. Actuallly, the most accurate number is taking the real actual sales after 24 hours, then a week, and then a month (if available). If you do that, marginal to big selling console games almost always follow the same sales rate over time. Doing say 30% of their business in the first 24 hrs, 45% in a week, and then say 75% in a month. (those are ballparks, i can't remember the actual percentages) Almost all bigger name console games follow this very simple pattern. And we know this pattern is correct, because typically after a year or more later, almost every company will finally release ACTUAL game units sold either directly or indirectly through corporate reports. Easy to back check this. Following the above pattern, Destiny was tracking to sell around 10 to 11 million, if i remember things correctly. Remember the golden rule. If Destiny actually had 17 million people buying this game....Activision would have actually said, "17 million people bought this game". Why? Because they love to toot their own horn. But Activision didn't say that. They instead released goofball meaningless numbers like 'registered' players, which was just a backdoor way of avoiding telling the truth.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Mar 11, 2015 22:18:15 GMT -5
Cool, cool. Let's move on.
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Post by TheHawkNY on Mar 12, 2015 11:03:54 GMT -5
I hope the upcoming Doom game has raids. I could double barrel demons from hell until my thumbs bleed.
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 12, 2015 11:22:20 GMT -5
I would be curious if the new patch helped or hurt the lack of interest in Crucible? Obviously, people don't like it. But has buffing the shotguns renewed interest? I played a little bit a few nights ago. I actually quit halfway through my second game. It just sucked lol.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 12, 2015 11:53:01 GMT -5
Shotguns got nerfed for Crucible purposes, so I doubt it. Range and damage falloff were both nerfed, and the damage increase only affects PvE. People who bought a Felwinter's Lie or two might have jumped in to try it out for a while, but I'd imagine they left again after a few games.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 12, 2015 12:58:41 GMT -5
They got nerfed for sure, but they are still good. I think the higher range shotguns got nerfed more as well. At point blank they are still deadly.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 12, 2015 13:02:32 GMT -5
They got nerfed for sure, but they are still good. I think the higher range shotguns got nerfed more as well. At point blank they are still deadly. So is my melee. #Warlock Master Race
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 12, 2015 13:04:22 GMT -5
Shotguns got nerfed for Crucible purposes, so I doubt it. Range and damage falloff were both nerfed, and the damage increase only affects PvE. People who bought a Felwinter's Lie or two might have jumped in to try it out for a while, but I'd imagine they left again after a few games. I played the other night, nothing but shotties and people not playing the objective. That crap was bad enough in CoD. But with Destiny's FPS training wheels, it just makes the game garbage. It's like all the people who couldn't/can't play CoD, needed to sandbag dom games to do well...they are all now residing in the Crucible. Crucible deserves a swift beheading, and sent out to the garbage.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 12, 2015 13:18:18 GMT -5
Warlock melee is pretty good. Titan melee, tho... feck those feckers... lol I didn't think you could 1 hit kill with melee in Crucible, but actually I have had Titans do that to me, and I don't like it. Must learn to be more aware of people's classes, because I often assume I can win a close quarters 1 v 1 with a shotgun hit and a melee, but when Titans just 1 hit me it kinda falls flat.
On the other hand I have 1 hit killed a Hunter or two... O,o They may have been lower level than me, (Iron Banner) but I don't know. I'm going to have to look into melee damage in Crucible. I need to know the details.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Mar 12, 2015 13:24:57 GMT -5
It annoys me to no end that you can't melee OHK someone... but that's probably what's left of my COD player mindset
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 12, 2015 13:41:01 GMT -5
I never liked the panic knife. I think you should only get melee 1HK's in special circumstances like from behind or something. Maybe with an attack that has a slow windup or whatever, but you shouldn't be able to charge someone blasting you full auto, shrug it off, and punch/slap/knife them. I call shenanigans... For the most part I like having 2HK melee. It emphasizes the shoot/smack combo. Especially with the slightly longer TTK 1HK doesn't feel exactly appropriate for Destiny.
However melee's in Destiny also have a special attack that has a cooldown so there's that, and then there's melee sunsinger super and worse yet bladedancer super, but then those are supers. Not sure I'm totally against the Titan thing I just wasn't aware of it. Wonder if I respec my subclass if it makes any difference or if I just need to be wary of them in CQC and/or get off a 1HK shotgun blast first...
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Mar 12, 2015 14:04:51 GMT -5
Shotguns got nerfed for Crucible purposes, so I doubt it. Range and damage falloff were both nerfed, and the damage increase only affects PvE. People who bought a Felwinter's Lie or two might have jumped in to try it out for a while, but I'd imagine they left again after a few games. I played the other night, nothing but shotties and people not playing the objective. That crap was bad enough in CoD. But with Destiny's FPS training wheels, it just makes the game garbage. It's like all the people who couldn't/can't play CoD, needed to sandbag dom games to do well...they are all now residing in the Crucible. Crucible deserves a swift beheading, and sent out to the garbage. Yeah, shotguns are still everywhere as fusion rifles got nerfed too. Within their range, shotguns dominate, and most of the maps are fairly close-quarters so it's not exactly a surprise to see shotguns all over the place. Play TDM or rumble if you're by yourself, and poof...all your idiot-teammates-not-PTFOing problems go away. FPS training wheels? Like what? Supers? Heavy ammo spawns? Always-on radar? Shotguns that dominate up close? All things that are present in some for or another in other FPSs. It's not like Destiny just magically gives you kills when you look in the general direction of the enemy.
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Post by iw5000 on Mar 12, 2015 14:19:46 GMT -5
Go play CoDAW. Then go play Destiny's Crucible. You'll see exactly why I toss out words like 'training wheels'.
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