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Post by GodMars on Nov 26, 2015 11:54:30 GMT -5
Grip and Stock have been getting a lot of discussion around here, so I thought a thread dedicated to them might help focus the discussion a bit and lead to some useful information. Expect a great variety of opinion as we don't have a lot of hard facts right now. Here is where I stand on these two attachments:
Grip: Provides a 7.5% reduction to viewkick. I find this attachment to be unneeded, as it provides little benefit. I've done extensive wall and bot testing both with and without the Grip on the wobbly KN-44, and I've seen no discernible difference in the two loadouts at any range. Would I give up an Optic or any of the other more beneficial attachments for Grip? Absolutely not.
Stock: An unknown amount of increased movement speed while ADS. Undeniably nerfed from past iterations, though not entirely useless. I was originally lead to believe that you lost all benefit once you began to fire, but I quickly found this to be false during actual gameplay. If not for my shift to getting diamond camos for SMGs, I'd have never discovered this. Sure, it's slower than it used to be in past games, but on SMGs that extra bit of movement makes a clear difference. I'd *almost* call this a must-have for SMGs; however, I still find it a tad too slow to be useful on ARs (and likely LMGs).
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Post by GodMars on Nov 26, 2015 12:55:49 GMT -5
I'm wondering if perhaps this shouldn't be moved to "Hey, Den." We don't have a lot of hard facts here, so I thought it was best suited in "Hey, Guy." But, maybe not.
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Post by UrbaneVirtuoso on Nov 26, 2015 13:19:10 GMT -5
The few things these are good for is XP challenges.
Brb gon' Quickdraw, Fast Mags and Laser instead.
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Slick
True Bro
Taking the piss
Posts: 1,015
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Post by Slick on Nov 26, 2015 13:55:23 GMT -5
Stock for strafing in and out of cover, except for smgs which basically have the AR/LMG stock speed for free. Gotta abuse dat latency.
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Lexapro
True Bro
PSN: Lexa_pro
Posts: 1,066
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Post by Lexapro on Nov 26, 2015 14:40:58 GMT -5
Stock on SMGs feels very close to normal walking speed, maybe 90% of it. It's not a must have and I don't think there ARE any must have attachments but it definitely grants an advantage in close range fights.
To me, the grip is no less useful than the long barrel on ARs, which only increases damage past 42 meters. But how often do you have engagements past 42 meters anyways? And in those situations, would it be more valuable to take 1 less bullet to kill (LB) or be able to maybe hit 1 more bullet (grip). In every other situation, the Long Barrel is doing nothing while the grip is helping at least a little bit. I have not done excessive testing but the grip simply FEELS better to me and I play better with it on some weapons.
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Dumien
True Bro
Black Market Trader
No engrams. Only disappointment.
Posts: 3,292
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Post by Dumien on Nov 26, 2015 16:54:02 GMT -5
Stock is absolutely fantastic for a gun like the Argus that can mitigate the drawback of not working when the gun is fired.
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Post by GodMars on Nov 26, 2015 17:07:01 GMT -5
Stock is absolutely fantastic for a gun like the Argus that can mitigate the drawback of not working when the gun is fired. From my testing it *appears* Stock works while firing.
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asasa
True Bro
fuck
Posts: 4,255
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Post by asasa on Nov 26, 2015 17:32:55 GMT -5
Damn all these unaccounted for issues with pick 10 that just won't get fixed.. Seriously, just make it pick 100 and adjust accordingly.. Weak, inexpensive attachments > expensive, powerful ones.
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banana
True Banana
Zoro > Law
Posts: 1,577
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Post by banana on Nov 26, 2015 20:34:19 GMT -5
Sounds hard to balance, especially for non den bros
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on Nov 26, 2015 20:37:01 GMT -5
That's how it always should've been. Why does a RDS cost as much as Stalker/QuickDraw/Steady Aim? Why does a ACOG cost as much as Awareness?
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Post by dunsparceflinch on Nov 26, 2015 20:57:04 GMT -5
Don't diss Recon/ACOG sight. Having an attachment that removes the sway on my Gorgon is nothing to scoff at.
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Post by RageHulkSmash on Nov 26, 2015 21:42:26 GMT -5
I still feel like stock is almost required on ARS and LMGs. I don't mind slowing down while firing, it happens even without stock and it probably increases my accuracy with the reduced movement sway. Turning corners while adsing is too good of a benefit to pass up imo.
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Post by imrlybord7 on Nov 27, 2015 0:55:09 GMT -5
I find Grip does make a real difference on a few guns. The ones that come to mind are the KN-44 and Razorback. I find them much more usable at long range with Grip than without it. But on most guns yeah it probably sucks.
SMGs without Stock ADS walk slower than they used to. SMGs with Stock ADS walk a bit faster than SMGs without Stock used to. I still find the base SMG ADS walk speed pretty solid. If you've really got a point to burn I guess it's not terrible though.
ARs without Stock probably ADS walk at about the same speed they always have. ARs with Stock got a huge ADS walk speed nerf, but once I got over the initial shock it grew on me. Feels crazy slow moving forward and back, a lot less slow moving side to side. You just have to use it to pre-aim right before you come around cover instead of the old method of pre-aiming almost all the time.
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Post by GodMars on Nov 27, 2015 23:14:03 GMT -5
I'm pretty much running Quickdraw and Stock on everything now.
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Post by hard1ine on Nov 28, 2015 20:25:23 GMT -5
Stock giving 100% movement speed was overpowered. EVERYONE ran it on ARs and LMGs when it did that much. Its still decent in BO3.
Grip is definitely in need of a buff.
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Post by dunsparceflinch on Nov 28, 2015 22:41:02 GMT -5
I'm sceptical about grip needing a buff until I know the numbers on how different sights affect recoil. A 7.5 reduction to kick in conjunction with Recon Sight's sway removal and possible very slight kick reduction would work well. Driftor mentioned that sights affect recoil as well, so I wouldn't be surprised if Recon sight decreased kick by 2% and more "normal" optics decreased kick by 1%.
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Post by lackingdamage on Dec 1, 2015 17:28:52 GMT -5
Still unsure on stock....
Does anybody know if decrease your idle sway ?
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Post by dunsparceflinch on Dec 1, 2015 17:57:17 GMT -5
Still unsure on stock.... Does anybody know if decrease your idle sway ? You forgot to say what attachment you are talking about with regards to idle sway. All I can say for certain is that Recon sight removes idle sway on everything that isn't a sniper. I very much doubt that stock affects idle sway.
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