Shotguns

[dunsparceflinch]

Dec 29, 2015 21:41:38 GMT -5 RageHulkSmash said:

Whatever unit the RedDevs spreadsheet uses, assuming it's accurate. It says max range is 15, and the mid damage range is from 10 to 12.

On another note, how do headshot multipliers work on the brecci with the new damage mechanics?

There are five possibilities for the Brecci headshots:

- Per pellet damage is affected and is only rounded down AFTER all pellet damage is added together AND the multiplier is only applied to pellets that hit the head.

- Same as the first possibility, only the headshot multi gets applied to all pellets that hit rather than just the ones that hit the head.

- Just the base damage gets the multiplier.

- The base damage and all pellets that hit the head get affected.

- The base damage and all pellets that hit get the multiplier.

Edit: Okay the way it would work for each possibility is:

First one: 2HK in the second range with 5 regular pellet hits per shot, 4 pellets if at least 3 hit the head. 8 pellets at the third range if at least 2 hit the head, 7 pellets if at least 4 hit the head.

Second one: 2HK in the second range with 5 regular pellets, 4 if at least 1 hits the head. 2HK in the third range with 7 or 8 pellets if at least 1 hits the head.

Third one: 2HK in second range with 5 regular pellets, only 1 pellet needs to hit if you hit the head. 2HK in the third range if you hit the head and hit the enemy with a total of at least 2 pellets.

Fourth one and Fifth one: Same results as the Third one.

[Marvel4]

Assuming damage per pellet works like it did in previous games, headshots have no effect on it, because 2 * 1.4 = 2.8, which is rounded down.

[dunsparceflinch]

Dec 30, 2015 18:33:27 GMT -5 Marvel4 said:

Assuming damage per pellet works like it did in previous games, headshots have no effect on it, because 2 * 1.4 = 2.8, which is rounded down.

That's why I said in the first possibility that the rounding would have to happen after the pellets are added together.

The new damage system as well as the lack of multipliers for previous games' shotguns makes it hard to know how it would work. Did the code say anything about added damage being applied AFTER everything else? Because if it not then wouldn't it be safe to assume that it applies to added damage?

[Marvel4]

Dec 30, 2015 18:44:58 GMT -5 dunsparceflinch said:

That's why I said in the first possibility that the rounding would have to happen after the pellets are added together.

The new damage system as well as the lack of multipliers for previous games' shotguns makes it hard to know how it would work.

Not really. Previous games can be modded and have damage logs. The damage was not added together.

Example of three pellets hitting in one shot:

winchester1200_mp;20;MOD_PISTOL_BULLET;right_hand
winchester1200_mp;40;MOD_HEAD_SHOT;head
winchester1200_mp;40;MOD_HEAD_SHOT;head

[dunsparceflinch]

What about the added damage? Does the game apply the added damage after the multipliers or before? Does it get added to whatever pellet is first in the code or does it prioritize headshot pellets?

[Marvel4]

No idea. Headshots should affect it, but if it's added to the first (or last) pellet, getting headshot damage would be random if not all pellets hit the head.

[RageHulkSmash]

2HK is possible with headshots at max range, so added damage does get multiplied at some point. I didn't test how many pellets must hit the head and/or body though.

[MoopusMaximus]

I miss MW3 shotguns where Damage + SPAS/Model/KSG could consistently one shot from 20 feet away.

):

[dunsparceflinch]

Dec 30, 2015 23:09:44 GMT -5 RageHulkSmash said:

2HK is possible with headshots at max range, so added damage does get multiplied at some point. I didn't test how many pellets must hit the head and/or body though.

It would be pretty hard to test. In theory if the added damage gets multiplied, then it would take 2 pellets to kills, which means you could get a nonlethal hitmarker at half health, then finish them off with 2 tac nades. In fact, if the added damage AND the pellets get multiplied AFTER being added together, then a headshot would do 49 damage minimum with 1 pellet hit, meaning a non-lethal hitmarker at half health would be finished off by 1 tac nade.

[yomomma]

Long barrel on shotguns icreases minimum damage on all shottys by 13%. The max damage range increases by 5% per latest patch!

[UrbaneVirtuoso]

Dec 31, 2015 6:34:16 GMT -5 MoopusMaximus said:

I miss MW3 shotguns where Damage + SPAS/Model/KSG could consistently one shot from 20 feet away.

):

Clearly, you haven't witnessed the glory that was MW2 shotguns.

[doctoryes]

Dec 27, 2015 2:31:05 GMT -5 -3055- said:

Dec 27, 2015 0:53:28 GMT -5 illram said:

Is long barrel useless on Argus and KRM? Haven't been following the spreadsheet updates recently.

Long barrel increases min damage range by 13% and decreases max damage range by 13%. So it's even worse on argus and krm than on haymaker/brecci cuz followup shots with the krm/arg is way more punishing than haymaker/brecci. The best shotgun to consider it on is the haymaker since the haymakers 3sk range is so piss poor. But even then i don't recommend it at all.

3055, unless you can site something, anything, I'm calling BS about the 13% decrease in max damage range. I see it on no spreadsheets, nor have I seen this mentioned by anyone anywhere but here.

[LeGitBeeSting]

Dec 31, 2015 23:25:50 GMT -5 UrbaneVirtuoso said:

Dec 31, 2015 6:34:16 GMT -5 MoopusMaximus said:

I miss MW3 shotguns where Damage + SPAS/Model/KSG could consistently one shot from 20 feet away.

):

Clearly, you haven't witnessed the glory that was MW2 shotguns.

Well admittedly the 9 pellet Striker (RIP, buck you Roberta/o) was probably better than any MW2 shotgun.

[RageHulkSmash]

Pre-nerf striker with damage and specialist... heaven @_@

[Blurred Wolf]

Didn't the USAS have the same stats just with a lower fire rate but with Ex-Con-Lite built in?

[dunsparceflinch]

Jan 1, 2016 14:15:22 GMT -5 Blurred Wolf said:

Didn't the USAS have the same stats just with a lower fire rate but with Ex-Con-Lite built in?

Not quite. USAS 12 was originally 6 pellets too but it was 25-5 damage per pellet.

The prepatch striker with mags and damage was ridiculous. Literally made it like a semi-auto MW2 spas12 without stopping power in a game with smaller maps.

[-3055-]

Dec 31, 2015 23:27:39 GMT -5 doctoryes said:

Dec 27, 2015 2:31:05 GMT -5 -3055- said:

Long barrel increases min damage range by 13% and decreases max damage range by 13%. So it's even worse on argus and krm than on haymaker/brecci cuz followup shots with the krm/arg is way more punishing than haymaker/brecci. The best shotgun to consider it on is the haymaker since the haymakers 3sk range is so piss poor. But even then i don't recommend it at all.

3055, unless you can site something, anything, I'm calling BS about the 13% decrease in max damage range. I see it on no spreadsheets, nor have I seen this mentioned by anyone anywhere but here.

This was what i was told since week 2 of cod from multiple people on this site, i just haven't updated that post. The actual effect of LB has been stated by marvel earlier

[MoopusMaximus]

Dec 31, 2015 23:25:50 GMT -5 UrbaneVirtuoso said:

Dec 31, 2015 6:34:16 GMT -5 MoopusMaximus said:

I miss MW3 shotguns where Damage + SPAS/Model/KSG could consistently one shot from 20 feet away.

):

Clearly, you haven't witnessed the glory that was MW2 shotguns.

Extendomag pre-patch Damage shotties were way better.

[dunsparceflinch]

Jan 2, 2016 7:43:01 GMT -5 MoopusMaximus said:

Dec 31, 2015 23:25:50 GMT -5 UrbaneVirtuoso said:

Clearly, you haven't witnessed the glory that was MW2 shotguns.

Extendomag pre-patch Damage shotties were way better.

Striker yes. Everything else, god no. Extended mag damage MW3 spas12 had less potential 1HK range than MW2 spas12 without stopping power. KSG with the combo was just an MW2 spas12 without SP. AA12 was the worst primary ever in MW3.

[kylet357]

Jan 2, 2016 10:55:50 GMT -5 dunsparceflinch said:

Jan 2, 2016 7:43:01 GMT -5 MoopusMaximus said:

Extendomag pre-patch Damage shotties were way better.

Striker yes. Everything else, god no. Extended mag damage MW3 spas12 had less potential 1HK range than MW2 spas12 without stopping power. KSG with the combo was just an MW2 spas12 without SP. AA12 was the worst primary ever in MW3.

You're wrong on the SPAS-12 part. Higher overall damage per shot (not per pellet) due to the extra pellets, at both min and max ranges, and they have the same range values. So yeah, SPAS-12 w/ Ext Mags Glitch and Damage > MW2 SPAS-12 (with or without Stopping Power).

[illram]

In the non-glitched, post-patch world, the MW2 SPAS-12 still reigns supreme.

[dunsparceflinch]

Jan 2, 2016 13:38:10 GMT -5 kylet357 said:

Jan 2, 2016 10:55:50 GMT -5 dunsparceflinch said:

Striker yes. Everything else, god no. Extended mag damage MW3 spas12 had less potential 1HK range than MW2 spas12 without stopping power. KSG with the combo was just an MW2 spas12 without SP. AA12 was the worst primary ever in MW3.

You're wrong on the SPAS-12 part. Higher overall damage per shot (not per pellet) due to the extra pellets, at both min and max ranges, and they have the same range values. So yeah, SPAS-12 w/ Ext Mags Glitch and Damage > MW2 SPAS-12 (with or without Stopping Power).

Except the damage per pellet of the MW3 spas12 was 25-5 until they patched the extended mags glitch while the MW2 spas12 was 40-25 per pellet.

25-5 * 1.4 = 35-7.

35-7 * 12pellets = 420-84.

For Reference:

40-25 * 1.4 = 56-35

56-35 * 8pellets = 448-280

So while the closest range damage ended up similar, the SPAS-12 from MW2 had much better 1HK range.

[kylet357]

Jan 2, 2016 16:19:57 GMT -5 dunsparceflinch said:

Jan 2, 2016 13:38:10 GMT -5 kylet357 said:

You're wrong on the SPAS-12 part. Higher overall damage per shot (not per pellet) due to the extra pellets, at both min and max ranges, and they have the same range values. So yeah, SPAS-12 w/ Ext Mags Glitch and Damage > MW2 SPAS-12 (with or without Stopping Power).

Except the damage per pellet of the MW3 spas12 was 25-5 until they patched the extended mags glitch while the MW2 spas12 was 40-25 per pellet.

25-5 * 1.4 = 35-7.

35-7 * 12pellets = 420-84.

For Reference:

40-25 * 1.4 = 56-35

56-35 * 8pellets = 448-280

So while the closest range damage ended up similar, the SPAS-12 from MW2 had much better 1HK range.

Wrong damage figures bruh. MW3 SPAS-12 is 30-14 and MW2 SPAS-12 did 40-20, not 40-25.

[kylet357]

Jan 2, 2016 14:45:37 GMT -5 illram said:

In the non-glitched, post-patch world, the MW2 SPAS-12 still reigns supreme.

Yeah, I'll agree with that.

[dunsparceflinch]

Jan 2, 2016 18:03:26 GMT -5 kylet357 said:

Jan 2, 2016 16:19:57 GMT -5 dunsparceflinch said:

Except the damage per pellet of the MW3 spas12 was 25-5 until they patched the extended mags glitch while the MW2 spas12 was 40-25 per pellet.

25-5 * 1.4 = 35-7.

35-7 * 12pellets = 420-84.

For Reference:

40-25 * 1.4 = 56-35

56-35 * 8pellets = 448-280

So while the closest range damage ended up similar, the SPAS-12 from MW2 had much better 1HK range.

Wrong damage figures bruh. MW3 SPAS-12 is 30-14 and MW2 SPAS-12 did 40-20, not 40-25.

Already told you, it wasn't 30-14 until they patched the damage and extended mags on shotguns. Before that patch, it was 25-5. That's why Driftor's old in MW3 in depth video on the spas-12 says 25-5 damage.

[kylet357]

Jan 2, 2016 18:11:09 GMT -5 dunsparceflinch said:

Jan 2, 2016 18:03:26 GMT -5 kylet357 said:

Wrong damage figures bruh. MW3 SPAS-12 is 30-14 and MW2 SPAS-12 did 40-20, not 40-25.

Already told you, it wasn't 30-14 until they patched the damage and extended mags on shotguns. Before that patch, it was 25-5. That's why Driftor's old in MW3 in depth video on the spas-12 says 25-5 damage.

ah, yeah. I forgot they buffed it.

[Marvel4]

205 Brecci with Long Barrel:
Minimum Base Damage: 33 * 0.8 = 26
Head Minimum Base Damage: 26 * 1.4 = 36

You need to hit at least 7 pellets for a 2HK.

2 * 7 + 36 = 50