So what's the consensus on Reach?

[mw0swedeking]

I know for myself and several of my friends it has been a huge dissapointment (although little by little our problems are being addressed by Bungie with their updates, so I haven't given up on it yet). My roommate has gone so far as to only call it Reach because "It's not really Halo."

So I'm happy that SWAT, Team Snipers, and Infection got their own playlists. Those are much needed improvements that made just trying to get into a game you wanted to play a frustration.

I didn't really want this to be a rant message, but it's about to go there, so if you don't want to read it stop now.

Am I the only one who hates all the maps? Forge world maps especially (the new one I played yesterday from the update was actually all right, Atom I think) feel like Bungie should publically apologize for and offer free map packs or something to make it up.

And the non forge world maps aren't great either. Powerhouse is all right, Countdown is pretty good, and Boardwalk seems like it should be all right but always turns out really slow paced.

The other huge problem I have is the spawns. They seem entirely random most of the time.

Anyway besides those two things, the melee system bothers me a little, every armor ability besides Sprint just serves to annoy, and grenade spam is a frequent problem.

The only time I can be sure I am having fun playing Reach is when I am playing a custom gametype with a couple of friends.

Sorry for the rant, I am kinda curious to hear other opinions on the game though.

[nimrod6134]

It's definitely a fun game but I'm not too captivated by it. I'm pretty much done playing it excluding the occasional online game with friends.

At first the online gametype voting seemed like the greatest idea to me but I don't feel that way anymore. I think the less popular gametypes are overshadowed because people stick with voting for the more popular ones. A prime example would be Oddball, my personal favorite. It seems that in general most players choose Zombies or Slayer in Rumble Pit voting, and rarely Oddball. Whereas if we were given Oddball on xmap, and a choice to vote to skip, players might hesitate to skip because they can't tell what may come up next. Don't get me wrong, I love all the gametypes but in my experience certain types dominate the pregame voting.

[Dissentia]

Bring on Black Ops, R.I.P. Halo. :/

[n1gh7]

after damage bleed through, more better custom maps, gametype fix, and melee fix everything should be better.

[pooneega]

Nimrod's first sentence sums it up for me. I don't really find myself dying to get home and play Reach as I have with other games. I think they've done a lot of things right in Reach as far as gun balance by adding bloom, and I'm actually very satisfied with how the armor abilities have brought a bit of depth to the game. Depending on the map, what your team/opponent is using, and what weapon you plan on using, there are reasons to use every one of the armor abilities so I think the balance there aint half bad. My only gripe (as stated before) is that damn armor lock... ugh.
The maps are whatever to me. Dont like Powerhouse, Sword Base aint half bad but everybody is starting to camp on the top floor in the room o' death (that one way room that the yellow vent goes up to), the Forge maps I dont mind because some of them are old favorites but the spawns are pretty terrible on em.
Still, I'm not wowed by Reach. Maybe cuz I'm burnt out on Halo... I played the dog shiza out of Halo 2 and 3 and at that point there were never games that frustrated me more than those two (then CoD came along ) and I definitely am not tryna get gray hairs from Reach.
Regardless, though, Bungie is pretty good with fixing glitches and listening to the community and making changes so I'm not gonna turn my copy back in or anything like that. I'm having fun trying to do the challenges for the day/week... actually gives me reason to play back through the campaign and to play firefight, the latter being a lot more fun than I had previously assumed.
Cheers to Bungie and Reach for me but I guess it isn't enough to divert my attention for too long. We'll see.

[n1gh7]

So team snipers. pretty much all I play now. that and arena.

[acidsnow]

Although I really love Halo: CE, and Reach does a good job of grabbing that original Halo feel... I sadly don't look forward to playing Reach. Something about CoD is just more run-&-gun-fun. I'll throw in CoD any time I wanna play, but for some reason Reach kinda stresses me out at times. The combat feels too involved at times, and teamwork is too important, without it Reach can just be a slaughter fest... Whereas in CoD, you can basically be a one man army: teamwork isn't nearly as important.

As weak as it sounds, I prefer my multiplayer games to be more fun than they are challenging. ...And ofc there are some games where Reach is just fun, but most take too much work, and work and play don't usually mix well.

Reach is still the best Halo game (since CE), but I'd agree that some of the maps are less than amazing. Luckily they all have enough personality to distinguish them.

IMO Reach is most fun when played with friends, which in itself takes work to coordinate, thus CoD takes the "instant self-gratification" award.

[pooneega]

You should try multi-team acidsnow. Ive been burnt out on regular Team Slayer for quite a while. Way too much coordination and talking is needed and too many squads play it. Multi team is pretty brainless. You just shoot anything that moves and you only need one other friend to play it. You kinda get the best of both worlds: lots of targets to shoot and you can still get involved with somebody on your friends list. Its what me and da homie play all the time when we get on.

[mw0swedeking]

I'll second that, multiteam is a pretty fun game to play.

[whole9yards24]

Oct 27, 2010 17:48:43 GMT -5 acidsnow said:

Reach is still the best Halo game (since CE).

You are aware Bungie made a game called Halo 2, right?

Halo 2, hands down, is the best multiplayer FPS that has ever been made. I would go so far as to say that will ever be made. They just don't make 'em like they used to. I won't even get started on a rant about Reach and how terrible it is. Let's just say Bungie should have cut their losses after Halo 3 and never bothered to make ODST or Reach.

[nimrod6134]

Actually I would really like to hear why you don't like Reach. I love Halo 2 as well, but what don't you like specifically about Reach?

[mannon]

I loved Halo 2, but it wasn't perfect. Honestly, although I loved using weapons akimbo, I think it fubared weapon balance and they were never able to appropriately address that. Everything akimbo is either too good or too terrible.

I actually like the way Reach hearken's back more to CE than Halo 2 and beyond. It feels nostalgic to me. I'm also totally happy with the DMR replacing the BR. I loved the BR, but the DMR is a sweet weapon. And having the scope back on the pistol... ahhh... I have missed you my little handheld sniper pistol. hehehe

[ecomni]

I think that's probably the first time I've heard anyone say Halo 2 was their favorite Halo. It was the MW2 of the Halo series. Really fun, but full of way too much abuseable BS.


As for the topic itself, I've always felt like, competitively, Halo was a "better" game than COD (balance, netcode, teamplay, etc.), but it's simply not as fun or as pretty. Reach vs BO is no different. However, with Black Ops shying away from the "everything but the NOPE sink" approach that made MW2 such an enjoyably broken game and with Reach having its own enjoyable BS, I'll probably be going back into the Halo series a bit more, even though COD will still take the majority of my playtime.

[mannon]

Prelaunch I was less interested in Halo:Reach than after I actually got my hands on it some. Though I still haven't gotten to try BO it's been the opposite for me. Before launch I was getting rather keen to try it out, but now from what I'm reading it sounds like the QS nerf isn't working as intended, the weapons got the W@W dull same stats treatment, and things just don't sound too rosy. I was also hoping for some bigger maps like W@W seemed to have more range in them, (though I generally prefer the MW2 maps to W@W except for sniping).

Anyway... I'm kinda meh on BO now and much more interested in Reach... Though I'm nowhere near done with Red Dead Redemption so they can both wait. ;3

[ParaGoombaSlayer]

Eh, I hate most of the maps in the game, and the bloom is such that spammers can frequently out shoot people by just getting lucky. Would rather just play Halo 3, where you can actually dodge the grenades.

If everyone on Halo 1 PC would stop playing stupid laggy no shield all snipers or laggy no shield active camo rockets or laggy vehicle cluster fuck game types maybe I'd go back to that.

[mamaluigi]

I'm very happy with it. I enjoyed MW2 for a while but eventually gave it up because of the killstreak spam and general cheesiness (railgunrs, care package rushers, knife rushers, commando lunges, DC + OMA). I just fine Halo to be slower than Call of Duty. I actually do about as well in one as in the other - my k/d is around 1.1 in both games. But Halo feels somewhat more skill-based and less luck-based. There are fewer BS spawns, fewer instant kills from across the map, and just less cheese in general.

Another thing I have to bring up is the developer. Bungie is just more supportive than Treyarch. I've never felt "betrayed" by a Halo game.

There is a ton of whining about Halo Reach, especially among the hardcore Halo fans. I don't listen to it. In fact, it may be a good thing. If these hyper-competitive "no fun allowed" kiddies hate the game, then it's probably a good game.

[eLantern]

Loving it... it's the best FPS out right now for the Xbox, although MW2 is still right there, if only they could do a huge title patch in order to remove the OMA and Commando perks from Online use (I realize this would never happen). Black Ops is really good too, I like a lot of the ideas in the game, I actually like the darker grainier look to it, but I'm not a fan of the game engine and the issues associated with it. Not-to-mention, some of the ideas Treyarch used to please customers I also didn't think were necessary. A couple things I wish they would have brought back from WaW are the sound of the headshot and the destructive bodies as I thought it was pretty cool seeing opponents bodies getting tore up by explosives and whatnot.

Anyways, back to Halo: Reach... a completely different type of FPS from the CoD & BF types but still a really great game if you don't mind non-ADS FPSs. The engine that Halo runs off of is extremely well designed as is the whole game... highest quality Halo title yet.

[kobefan012345]

I wanna take a shower after reading this

[chip sandwich]

It's a pretty cool guy. Still the same old bullshit from old halo games, but Armor Lock is there to throw a wrench in the works (anti-Rocket and anti-Sword). The whole credits thingy is pretty cool but the ranking system is a bit dull, though at least it doesn't bring too many problems with it. Although the old system was good, there was a lot of shit like "omg ur not a 50 in team doubles and MLG gtfo noob" and obnoxious derankers and whatnot. High level competitive Halo depresses the fuck out of me though, too much focus on whoring the power weapons. Yes, there's a lot of teamwork which is absolutely necessary, and you have to learn things like spawns and map callouts, but still, GOTTA GET THE ENERGY SWORD I GOTTA GET IT FIRST GOTTA HOLD ALL THE POWER WEAPONS I WANT IT I WANT IT I WANT IT. BR skills are essential, but they are unlikely to get you past 45 alone. Then again I wasn't all that great at Halo 3 so yeah. I'm not a fan of the whole "skill meens jack shit, all u gotta do 2 win is expl0it everythign u can as much as u can" philosophy, and CoD caters better to my "use bad weapons against cheap stuff" instinct etc. etc.

I would play the Arena in Reach, but I live in Australia and there are only 100 people in each playlist, so no fucking way. Mostly just Team Slayer or Team Swat for me, but Team Slayer has rocket launchers and energy swords, and Swat has RIDICULOUS spawning.

As for the maps, there's a certain dullness to them that really itches me. It's really cool that they have the arena based combat schtick in campaign rather than corridor shooting, but I don't like how they rip the maps almost 100% straight from single player. Also, Forge World sucks, if they could include some different environments that would be sweet, but unfortunately it's Installation 04's temperate green planes and evergreen hills everywhere. Plus some of the smaller maps are just awful. The Cage makes me want to vomit, it feels like a lazy last second hack job. I don't really play the bigger maps too much, Spire is pretty bad, Haemorrage and Boneyard are okay and Paradiso is a stalemate.

Still, the multiplayer is fun, and I like trying to be like Arbitur and using "Magnum and Sprint" against armor ability spamming noobs. Although to be honest, I have almost no animosity towards Armor Lock. I hate grenades and rockets even more, and armor lock helps against grenades and rockets, therefore I accept armor lock's place in the game. The only power weapon I try to actively go for is the sniper, because sniping is always cool and goes with my Scout Helmet. Also, magnum = secks. Slayer is so much better with the magnum secondary.

[slobbergoat]

Strangely enough I only have two complaints about Reach but they're so major they basically obliterate anything nice I have to say about it.

Firstly, the maps suck. There are no good maps in Reach. What makes them suck isn't merely one factor but myriads: Firstly, most of the maps follow a "two bases" design, particularly the larger ones. This isn't necessarily bad except for the way most of these said maps don't have enough cover in between the two bases to allow players to adequately attack the base in question.

Map designs often feature arbitrarily placed, and massive numbers of, power weapons - sometimes more than an entire team can carry. The seemingly entirely random placement makes level control a chore and makes a huge number of fights ridiculously one-sided.

Maps with vehicles have too many vehicles and the vehicles are often overpowered, particularly in the case of Scorpions. This is exacerbated by the way plasma pistols are seemingly far too uncommon on levels with vehicles and don't even shut the Scorpion's gun down.

Finally, maps have too many players (8 players on maps that would be big for 2) and the indoor map designs are too narrow, making grenade spam a huge problem. This ties into...

Secondly, the Game Rules are also extremely poorly thought out. Seemingly most gametypes start you with an AR, a pistol, and two grenades - no realistically useful longrange effectiveness and yet two spammable high damage midrange explosives. Given that a lot of levels are extremely cramped with long, straight hallways, grenade spam makes skillful fights nearly nonexistent.

Multiteam has MAGNITUDES too many players for the maps it tends to place them on - typically maps that would be busy with 2v2.

And, being locked in to playing a map and not being able to join in progress is Build Engine era, stoneage idiocy that has no place in a game made after 1996.

---

Overall the game is mediocre with a full team of competent allies, horrible with only one or two friends, and unplayable on your own.

[nimrod6134]

I definitely understand where some of your complaints are coming from but I think saying "[t]here are no good maps in Reach" is pretty ridiculous. I guess it's all just personal opinion but I think maps like Boardwalk and Sword Base don't really meet any of you qualms, but the two base/no cover situation is definitely apparent in some maps and aggravates me as well.

I've only played the other games in the Halo series at my friends houses so I can't really speak about the map size to player ratio, but as a newer player to the series I think they generally fit well.

I didn't think the game was anything special when I first purchased it but I am really enjoying it now

[chip sandwich]

I personally prefer Reach's guns and gameplay to Halo 3, but the Forge maps in Reach suck ass, Forge maps in sandbox for 3 were pretty damn cool. Still, Reach controls a lot better than Halo 3, Halo 3 feels very jerky and suffers from "too slow, slow and too fast" stick turning speeds.

Halo 1 had the best sounding guns though. 2 and 3 go into plastic toy territory.

Also, fuck full parties. The worst shit is when you go in Slayer Pro against a full party, coz there's very little you can do to settle the score in terms of weapon selection and you can't tell where the hell your teammates are without spinning around like a fool (no motion sensor to display friendlies). I'm pretty much strictly solo because all my friends play Blops.

Fave maps: Sword Base (duh), Countdown, Powerhouse
Least: Ivory Tower, Spire Slayer, The Cage

[slobbergoat]

Feb 4, 2011 12:58:35 GMT -5 chip sandwich said:

Also, Foxtrot full parties. The worst doo-doo is when you go in Slayer Pro against a full party, coz there's very little you can do to settle the score in terms of weapon selection and you can't tell where the hell your teammates are without spinning around like a fool (no motion sensor to display friendlies). I'm pretty much strictly solo because all my friends play Blops.

Oh yeah

This this this this thisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthis

Given the pre-quake stoneage idiot garbage netcode that Reach has that explicitly disallows join in progresses and punishes a player for quitting, why the christ is there no option for Mercenary TDM? The moment you get joined into a game when you're not in a party of at least four good players and you see the whole other team speechbubbles you might as well just dashboard and save yourself the time.

[chip sandwich]

Feb 7, 2011 14:58:26 GMT -5 slobbergoat said:

Oh yeah

This this this this thisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthisthis

Given the pre-quake stoneage idiot garbage netcode that Reach has that explicitly disallows join in progresses and punishes a player for quitting, why the christ is there no option for Mercenary TDM? The moment you get joined into a game when you're not in a party of at least four good players and you see the whole other team speechbubbles you might as well just dashboard and save yourself the time.

I had one of these in Halo 3 yesterday. I was playing Social Slayer as a warmup, and the whole enemy team were speechbubbles, all of them were >45 and two of them were 50s. I'm not afraid of going toe-to-toe in a BR duel with a 50, even though I'm only a mid-30 max (I sucked at H3 when I first played it, then I got CoD 4 and didn't play ranked H3 again until Reach came out), but as I looked at the rest of my team, none of whom were above 10, it's was pretty much game over steaktacular times two.

Team SWAT in Reach is a bit more tolerable because you can instakill, but it's still not very fun.

[mannon]

I only got to play one game online before my gold sub expired. My teammates were all being mostly useless and I couldn't figure it out. Then one of them started shooting me. I decided to just stand there and look at him until he killed me, then I booted him for it. Next thing the rest of my team up and quits. But even though it was my first online game and I hadn't played Halo online since Halo 2 and thus was WAY out of practice I decided I didn't want to quit my very first game so I was all stubborn and stuck it out for the full duration against 4 other players. heh

I didn't do great, but I actually didn't do all that terrible for my first game back. It wasn't until the game finally ended that I realized what happened... The entire other team and two people on my team were all in the same clan. So that's why they shot me then quit. They were apparently just whoring up their friend's win stats and credits, ect... lahme...

Still, I like the game and have already spent about half as much time just playing the campaign (keep doing single player challenges and going for achievements) as my whole MW2 online play. (At least going by the stat where it doesn't count all the WAITING. heh)

Speaking of waiting... this seems to be getting worse rather than better. Trying to play online tends to result in truly stupedously gobsmackingly huge amounts of time waiting between games and finding lobbies and for players to join, then quit, then more join... ect. GOD! I really wish we could do some of our own damn searching ala GameSpy. I used to love GameSpy! Hell there were servers I became a regular on and would play some of the same peeps, but even when I didn't I would usually go find a server and play on that one server for hours or even all night. Now it seems like the best I can get is mebbe 2 games before I gotta find a whole new gorram lobby or at least wait because the whole other team just quit. Jebus... The new ADD generation of online gamers really bug me sometimes.

It just seems like there's no such thing as sportsmanship anymore. We can't just get together and play games for fun and see who wins. Now people try to win the game before it's even started by controlling who they play against and gang up on, and quitting anytime the other players win more than one game in a row.

I'm definitely in favor of a mercenary mode for Halo. heh I rather liked it in MW2 even though the competition was usually actually more skilled than the non merc tdm peeps. Still if I'm not rolling with a crew I'd rather play random but skilled individuals vs a team of jackholes who are going to bone me for no other reason than half my team is dildoing each other to KS boost...

(heh I wonder what the filters will do to that. >,>)

[mannon]

heh Apparently "dildoing" isn't filtered... yet. ;p

I hope this does not offend our almighty Den. I don't purposefully circumvent the filters. In fact here is the ONLY place I actually enjoy the chat filters. Sometimes I swear just to get the filter text, because it amuses me. hehehe