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Post by Megaqwerty on Nov 23, 2012 14:39:48 GMT -5
Use a macro. Strike fear in the hearts of all.
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Post by RageHulkSmash on Nov 24, 2012 3:28:17 GMT -5
Do all full autos go 2-round-burst with select fire?
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mmacola
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Post by mmacola on Nov 24, 2012 3:30:21 GMT -5
Nope. It is weapon specific
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Post by RageHulkSmash on Nov 24, 2012 3:32:21 GMT -5
That's weird...
It kinda sucks they don't have recoil plots with foregrip. Do we even know the exact stats for foregrip yet?
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Post by beer0clock on Nov 24, 2012 3:48:01 GMT -5
I think its like +2% or 2.25% center speed
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Post by RageHulkSmash on Nov 24, 2012 4:24:16 GMT -5
I think its like +2% or 2.25% center speed Only 2%? Wasn't it like 25% in previous games?
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Post by beer0clock on Nov 24, 2012 5:36:58 GMT -5
I think its like +2% or 2.25% center speed Only 2%? Wasn't it like 25% in previous games? It was about either 6% or 12% in BO1 (as later mentioned, +100 or +200)
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Post by Marvel4 on Nov 24, 2012 5:38:58 GMT -5
No, Grip in Black Ops increases centerspeed by 100 or 200 on most weapons.
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Evan950
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Post by Evan950 on Nov 24, 2012 7:06:50 GMT -5
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mmacola
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Post by mmacola on Nov 24, 2012 8:28:04 GMT -5
poorly made weapon plots. They probably used a 2 dimension way to test, versus the in-game 3 dimensional (which causes the recoil to be more spherical instead of squarical )
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Den
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Post by Den on Nov 24, 2012 8:40:04 GMT -5
The X and Y kick axes are independent of one another, so the two maximums would meet at a corner.
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Evan950
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Post by Evan950 on Nov 24, 2012 10:39:50 GMT -5
is it just that the software they are using to make the plots is different to our old one or is the recoil a little different now? i've never seen the recoil plots that look with corners
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arcanine2009
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Post by arcanine2009 on Nov 24, 2012 22:16:18 GMT -5
What about LMG recoil plots?
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arcanine2009
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Post by arcanine2009 on Nov 24, 2012 22:18:55 GMT -5
I don't understand how you guys all think the FAL outclasses the SMR. They are entirely different guns for different roles. The FAL imo is sort of the jack of all trades gun. Good at all ranges, but is semi auto takes a little more ability to track targets and spam the trigger, but crushes close range and long range due to extremely high damage. But you may get beat with certain ARs in the middle ranges. The only change i could see as fair on the SMR would be a little less recoil. But since its a semi auto, its not hard at all to just let it recenter before you shoot again. I don't find it that hard to hit a good percentage of my shots at full 450rpm. Here's the thing though, its 2hk range is immense. Everyone wants to say "Other than range, the FAL has it beat." Well yeah, of course, but that 2hk range is a huge advantage. Since the first shot is instant, all you have to do is line up a second shot and its a kill at any kind of decent range. That isn't the case with the FAL. I would expect the hipspread and aim speed to be worse, because if not, it would outclass the FAL. So basically this is the way I look at the two guns. The FAL is a solid gun that is good at all ranges and can be used in a variety of ways. It excels at close and long ranges, and is actually not bad on smaller maps, due to 2 hits close range with decent hipspread and ADS time. Its also tremendous at very long ranges due to its 3hk and great accuracy. It can struggle at middle ranges though, compared to other guns, however if it has just enough fire rate to be competitive in the middle----The SMR on the other hand, is completely different, it struggles at close range, with bad hipspread and bad ADS time, but its isn't completely useless there, because it does still have that 2hk. But where its really good is middle-long ranges. That 2hk extends very far, and WILL beat any other gun, barring a sniper, at longer ranges. Its a sniper/AR hybrid. It's intended range is that longer middle range that the FAL might struggle in. Its perfectly balanced IMO, maybe a little bit less recoil on the SMR, but its hardly something that needs adressed early on in the cycle. +1 2:12 And frankly, the recoil is straight up. Like that's the hardest thing ever to compensate right? It 's recoil would be a problem at long range. Wasn't exactly easy to get 2-3 shot kills at long range with the M14 in Bo, was it? You can't shoot very fast at long range to be accurate with this gun. FAL OSW's recoil is pretty much non-existent on the other hand. I bet you could get in 3 bullets before you get in SMR's 2 shot kill range.
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Post by RageHulkSmash on Nov 25, 2012 21:56:24 GMT -5
Any chance we can get the LMG scans?
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Post by bigal093 on Nov 26, 2012 13:33:51 GMT -5
+1 2:12 And frankly, the recoil is straight up. Like that's the hardest thing ever to compensate right? It 's recoil would be a problem at long range. Wasn't exactly easy to get 2-3 shot kills at long range with the M14 in Bo, was it? You can't shoot very fast at long range to be accurate with this gun. FAL OSW's recoil is pretty much non-existent on the other hand. I bet you could get in 3 bullets before you get in SMR's 2 shot kill range. 2 shots is always easier to hit than 3 because of the instant first shot, barring some ridiculous gun with a ton of recoil. basically if i hit 1 shot, all i need to do is get my crosshairs over the guy once more. that 2 shot kill range is massive for the SMR, so at almost any existent range in Blops II it will 2 hit, unless you're trying to use it like a DSR sniper. At maximum range though, yes, FAL shits all over it.
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Post by osvald2020 on Nov 26, 2012 16:29:07 GMT -5
They should increase both Fal's and SMR's firerates to at least 750(preferably 1200). then they should about halve the Fal's two hit kill range to about ten meters and decrease the SMR's recoil a little bit. Then they would be pretty balanced between each other and also between the rest of the assault rifles. In other words bring back the cod 4 and cod WAW philosophy that semi-auto guns should have low recoil and fast fire rate.
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Tyzerra
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Post by Tyzerra on Nov 26, 2012 18:25:26 GMT -5
Yeah, 1200 RPM was just ridiculous back in COD 4 and WaW. I used to be freaking close to the ~1,000 RPM mark back in the WaW days, and that shit was unreal But yeah, I think a ~600 RPM cap would be nice. 1,200 is out of the question
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 27, 2012 3:28:51 GMT -5
I think 700 would be fine. Fast enough that you're not going to inhibit most "traditional" grip players (single trigger finger) but slow enough that macros aren't game breaking.
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Tyzerra
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Post by Tyzerra on Nov 27, 2012 4:42:21 GMT -5
^ Agreed.
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Evan950
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Post by Evan950 on Nov 27, 2012 7:44:14 GMT -5
these square recoil plots look almost identical
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Post by Megaqwerty on Nov 27, 2012 12:50:20 GMT -5
...which is now possible with the new way weapons are handled.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Nov 27, 2012 14:55:44 GMT -5
Weapon stats can now change dynamically while in use, such as seen on the AN94 and the HAMR.
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Post by osvald2020 on Nov 27, 2012 16:06:29 GMT -5
Of course i can't tap at a rate of 1200 continuosly but what i meant is that sometimes i exceed 750 rpm between two of the shots and the 1200 rpm is just to be safe that players with fast trigger fingers don't shoot slower than they are able to. That's why i used the asp so much in BO1 because it had superior firecap to the other pistols that would just jam. I could also see and feel a difference between usp 45. and p99 firerates in mw3. Also it's easy to report players for modded controllers etc. and you get insta banned if caught for doing so
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on Nov 27, 2012 16:12:02 GMT -5
This plays in head when ever someone mentions the HAMR
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Post by Megaqwerty on Nov 27, 2012 16:12:23 GMT -5
Just to be safe, we should set all semi autos to 60000 RPM (fire time of 0.001 s) to ensure that players are able to fire the semi autos as fast as they can punch the trigger regardless of their frame rate.
Don't see nothing wrong with that.
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Post by citrus on Nov 27, 2012 17:03:16 GMT -5
Vector actually looks pretty much outclassed by the MP7; even its recoil isn't that much better.
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Tyzerra
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Post by Tyzerra on Nov 27, 2012 17:17:54 GMT -5
Vector actually looks pretty much outclassed by the MP7; even its recoil isn't that much better. What the...? First someone suggests that the PDW outclasses the MSMC, which I prefer more. And now someone suggests that the MP7 outclasses the Vector, which I again prefer more. What's going on here?
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arcanine2009
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Post by arcanine2009 on Nov 28, 2012 1:36:43 GMT -5
SMR needs a buff. Give it the same RoF as the FAL, and trade hipfire spreads with the FAL.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Nov 28, 2012 12:46:15 GMT -5
SMR is fine: stop using it in close range and use it as a DMR at distances where you only need two shots and the other guy needs 4 or more. Just increase the FAL hip spread to match it.
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