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Post by dunsparceflinch on May 13, 2015 15:09:20 GMT -5
What. No. 3 spread is fine. If you're going to change it, make it smaller, not larger. Whose side are you on anyway? This thread went off the rails quickly. This thread is a retrospective on Advanced Warfare. In retrospect, these shotguns suck. I mean, if you guys are expecting the tac19 to 1hk in 650 units every time then yeah it sucks, but otherwise they are great on anything that isn't instinct and sideshow. The bulldog is mediocre (needs more ammo and more 4pk range) but doesn't suck. The ohm is slow but powerful, especially considering you can put rapid fire on it. S12 is murder. It's not like ghosts where shotguns sucked because everything else was a 1-3hk, distances were long, and movement was slow.
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Post by iw5000 on May 13, 2015 15:13:30 GMT -5
... ^^^
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wwaa
True Bro
PC / PS4 / X1
Posts: 2,086
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Post by wwaa on May 13, 2015 15:34:31 GMT -5
PC:
I stopped playing AW in Jan '15 but I do not blame SHG for this.
I cannot play any COD game for more than 10 minutes per day. I tried them all in the meantime again looking for any challenge, & failed, the best one left is BO2:HC imo ... or - COD4.
I got totally bored with any COD and I suppose no developer can produce anything enjoyable for me using dat old COD:MP scheme/design anymore. TF - just boring, no interest. 2-3HK bolt SR makes me laugh, how stupid they are.
It is not abt "balance" or "maps" or "movement speed" or "whatever". It is abt "Challenge & Fun" - but both evaporated.
8 years and ~500k kills, billions of good games, but that is enough ... what MP game 'd you recommend now?
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bradman
True Bro
token old guy
Posts: 1,178
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Post by bradman on May 13, 2015 17:39:46 GMT -5
PC: I stopped playing AW in Jan '15 but I do not blame SHG for this. I cannot play any COD game for more than 10 minutes per day. I tried them all in the meantime again looking for any challenge, & failed, the best one left is BO2:HC imo ... or - COD4. I got totally bored with any COD and I suppose no developer can produce anything enjoyable for me using dat old COD:MP scheme/design anymore. TF - just boring, no interest. 2-3HK bolt SR makes me laugh, how stupid they are. It is not abt "balance" or "maps" or "movement speed" or "whatever". It is abt "Challenge & Fun" - but both evaporated. 8 years and ~500k kills, billions of good games, but that is enough ... what MP game 'd you recommend now? Battlefield.
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Post by ChloeB42 (Alexcalibur42) on May 13, 2015 18:26:51 GMT -5
What. No. 3 spread is fine. If you're going to change it, make it smaller, not larger. Whose side are you on anyway? This thread is a retrospective on Advanced Warfare. In retrospect, these shotguns suck. I mean, if you guys are expecting the tac19 to 1hk in 650 units every time then yeah it sucks, but otherwise they are great on anything that isn't instinct and sideshow. The bulldog is mediocre (needs more ammo and more 4pk range) but doesn't suck. The ohm is slow but powerful, especially considering you can put rapid fire on it. S12 is murder. It's not like ghosts where shotguns sucked because everything else was a 1-3hk, distances were long, and movement was slow. Ghosts shotguns are better than AW shotguns.
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on May 13, 2015 18:32:59 GMT -5
Well not better than the S-12.
However Ghost Doge is head and shoulders above both the Tacticool-19 and AW Doge though not to mention every Ghosts map was a shotgun map(Even Stoner's Haven) bar non-objective Whiteout.
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Post by dunsparceflinch on May 13, 2015 20:00:14 GMT -5
Well not better than the S-12. However Ghost Doge is head and shoulders above both the Tacticool-19 and AW Doge though not to mention every Ghosts map was a shotgun map(Even Stoner's Haven) bar non-objective Whiteout. How were ghosts' maps shotgun maps when 90% of the time it was long range sights? The only shotgun that worked in that game was the bulldoge. Otherwise you had slow firing shotguns that had to compete against 2-3hks (compared to the 3-4hks of aw). At least in aw there are constantly small-mid range areas and you can exo-boost to get near your target. That's part of the reason the s12 is considered murder even though it can only hit up to mid range. That's why in spite of it needing a buff, the aw bulldoge still gets some use.
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on May 13, 2015 20:28:38 GMT -5
Ghosts had maps had one key element: Cover.
Also the Tac-12 was pretty decent, 50-20 with decent ADS spread and reach.
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Post by kylet357 on May 14, 2015 6:11:31 GMT -5
Ghosts' shotguns were decent, but they're godly compared to AW's shotguns. Most of them can get two-pellet kills at least, and had very small ADS spread (the biggest ADS spread was like, what? 3 or 3.5?). Tac-12 was by far, in my opinion at least, the best shotgun. I'll take a consistent and strong one hit kill shotgun over one that relies on spamming shots in the general direction of the enemy.
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Post by illram on May 14, 2015 17:51:48 GMT -5
I have not played Ghosts enough, or AW enough to get a feel for their shotguns but has anything felt better than a MW2 SPAS? I want that back. As a secondary.
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Post by ChloeB42 (Alexcalibur42) on May 14, 2015 18:49:07 GMT -5
No CoD will ever be as good as MW2 in regards to shotguns. There have been games with good shotguns or at least usable shotguns, but MW2 had good shotguns free as secondaries. Nothing will ever beat that.
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Post by Marvel4 on May 15, 2015 5:42:26 GMT -5
Most of them can get two-pellet kills at least, and had very small ADS spread (the biggest ADS spread was like, what? 3 or 3.5?).
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Post by alexanaxela on May 19, 2015 17:06:14 GMT -5
All doesnt matter as the spread is too big to get a OHKs after 6 meters. ohks are easy up to 9.5 meters with advanced rifling. It's the prepatch tac-19 that couldn't get ohks past 6 meters. And past that it's almost always a 2hk if you can hit them. i wish i had the game you had. The tac19 roundhouse i used is just constant 2~3 hit kills outside of very close range which is just mindblowing considering it's the strongest shotgun at range in cod history (30 damage per pellet out to 812 inches). I've had numerous times where i've shot a person 3 times and they still didn't die. I'd rather just use the r870 or the stakeout. The spread is just waaay to huge to offer any kind of consistency outside of point blank
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Post by lackingdamage on May 23, 2015 6:24:31 GMT -5
As somebody who did not pick up advanced warfare [thank you ghosts] this thread is sort of interesting. From what I seen the gap between PC call of duty and console is way bigger on advanced warfare. Appears the same old design problems stay with the series spawns are caused by the one size fit all map design.
Was also told by friends that advanced warfare played like rubbish on my platform so avoided picking it up.
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Post by Megaqwerty on May 26, 2015 14:18:26 GMT -5
Ghosts PC had a competent design, but suffered doubly so from technical issues. Sniper scopes never worked in the game and still do not work (the dual rendering crashes frame rate, even on extreme rigs).
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Post by dunsparceflinch on Jun 5, 2015 11:28:58 GMT -5
Back on topic, one of things I really liked about AW was the way streaks were designed. Customizable. For the most part not too OP except for maybe exo system hack. Even the most powerful killing streak, the paladin, wasn't so OP that it would cause everyone to rage quit. Much more preferable to black ops 2 with stuff like the swarm and that streak that showed everyone permanently regardless of their perks.
Only bad part was that hardline was a more geared for lowered streaks. It should have been -100 plus an extra 25 points for every kill.
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Post by hard1ine on Jun 22, 2015 14:04:54 GMT -5
AW had some great ideas but failed to execute on them. Exos weren't inherently bad, but the tiny maps and Blast Suppressor made them more annoying than fun.
Weapon and perk balance were the two main reasons AW blew. Every gun except the BAL-27 and ASM1 needed buffs badly.
Perks should have been:
Tier 1: Toughness * Flak Jacket Blind Eye * Low Profile Danger Close
Tier 2: Gung-Ho Hard Wired * Cold Blooded Overcharge * Fast Hands
Tier 3: Blast Suppressor Scavenger Lightweight * Peripherals * Hardline
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Post by MoopusMaximus on Jun 23, 2015 0:34:42 GMT -5
I miss the old CoD.
AW has shifted the series in a direction that is terrible. I don't think anybody thought "wow CoD would be so much better with jetpacks!" The exo's have effectively given every player Juiced (from MW3) and any kind of non-rushing gameplay is next to impossible. Killing an enemy will only result in them thrusting right back to you in 5 seconds.
Sledgehammer, you suck. One can only hope that your terrible dev team can never touch Call of Duty again.
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Post by iw5000 on Jun 23, 2015 7:52:50 GMT -5
I miss the old CoD. AW has shifted the series in a direction that is terrible. I don't think anybody thought "wow CoD would be so much better with jetpacks!" The exo's have effectively given every player Juiced (from MW3) and any kind of non-rushing gameplay is next to impossible. Killing an enemy will only result in them thrusting right back to you in 5 seconds. Sledgehammer, you suck. One can only hope that your terrible dev team can never touch Call of Duty again. Somewhere along the line, developers just sort of assumed that to make the game better..... you had to make it faster, jumpier and more action. Looking back in hindsight, I don't think that was necessarily the best route to take. Perhaps the newer CoD's, with their better technology, should have been looking at other ways to make the game 'better', over and above the typical improved graphics with each new release. Think outside the box. 'Better' could be improved aiming mechanics, teammate interactions, etc... It seems like run/jump faster is to easy of a solution. A lazy approach. Bigger/faster is not always better.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Jun 23, 2015 13:56:26 GMT -5
I have that it is said most of the community complains that Call of Duty changes too little year each. But I say unto you: Call of Duty changes too much each year. The greatest detriment to Call of Duty as a serious sport (aside from its intrinsic mechanics) is that the game fundamentally changes each and every year. It would be like if some popular MOBA switched from League to DOTA to Heroes and back every year. Conceptually very similar games and anyone good at one is good at the others, but annual changeovers reduce the capacity for consistent high level play. I, for one, would be okay with Call of Duty be an annual expansion that is blatant so, one that simply keeps and updates the best content in the game and trims the fat. I hope that as the game continues to decline and cease to be such a large source of revenue, Activision either ceases current annual releases or switches to updates as above. If CoD 201X cost $30 every year, but didn't cost millions to develop and market, it could be sustainable for both the publisher and consumers. Critically, however, it would allow Call of Duty to compete with Counterstrike as a sport, something that will never happen given the current state of the game. TL;DR: CoD4 was cool, I guess. Yeah but those are harder to put on a box than "jetpacks." If a new Call of Duty had every single word on the box just be "SHOTGUNS", I would buy every copy. All of them.
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Post by iw5000 on Jun 23, 2015 15:07:01 GMT -5
I don't know about that. Shouldn't the question be if CS can compete with CoD as an Esport? At least as of last year, CoD already seems to be much bigger as an Esport.
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Post by iw5000 on Jun 23, 2015 16:09:19 GMT -5
I don't know about that. Shouldn't the question be if CS can compete with CoD as an Esport? At least as of last year, CoD already seems to be much bigger as an Esport. It was for a bit but CS has grown much faster and further. CS passed 1 million concurrent viewers at ESL One some months back (according to this it was a quarter of that the previous year). I'm having trouble finding exact numbers for CoD Championships (people say it wasnt officially released but the highest I'm seeing from people is 400-600k). The biggest one on record is 205k at MLG Columbus it seems. Regardless I still don't think they're directly competing for viewers. The CS viewership is predominantly PC players which as you can imagine shouldn't really make up much of cod's viewership. If anything I think they'd be helping one another just by making competitive shooters more popular in general. Sounds like they are both doing ok, with neither really dominating the other....and who is doing better depends on what way the internet breeze is blowing for that day.
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Post by Megaqwerty on Jun 23, 2015 16:24:43 GMT -5
My point isn't about the competition between CS and CoD (my impression was that CS was less popular), but rather that CS is a serious sport and respected as such while CoD is not, for reasons previously discussed.
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Post by iw5000 on Jun 24, 2015 5:39:50 GMT -5
My point isn't about the competition between CS and CoD (my impression was that CS was less popular), but rather that CS is a serious sport and respected as such while CoD is not, for reasons previously discussed. not to be argumentative, but from what i have seen from the CoD World's and other major comps, ... those competing are pretty serious. And the crowds there don't think differently. And that's from any perspective. Announcers, broadcasters, crowd, competitors - none of them are saying " blah, aim assist with CoD, no respect" A competition is derived from the people involved, not so much from the mechanics of the game. You know? It's like college baseball and it's NCAA tourney. No one is mocking the tourney for being less, because they are using aluminum bats, which make for easier hitting.
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Post by iw5000 on Jun 24, 2015 8:51:15 GMT -5
Heaven forbid any of them care about anything beyond their little circle. Theyre already at the mercy of devs who're anything but consistent when it comes to supporting the competitive scene. Their games popularity is on the decline and there's fu ck all for them to do after. I'm sure the world hopscotch competition isnt full of haters in the audience either but id be amazed to hear if anyones making a living off of it. Sorry, but I'm not feeling your point. Yes, the game is in decline. I'm not playing it anymore, so I certainly can relate to that point and I don't think anyone would argue it. But what does it matter if the game is currently inclining, declining or stagnant, especially when discussing the point that was made before, which I was responding to "rather that CS is a serious sport and respected as such while CoD is not" who exactly are you (and mega) referring to when discussing respect? Is some overseeing body of people who have the ability to cast judgment on what is and what isn't to be respected? The CS people? I think it goes without saying of course they'll say that. But who the fvck are they? They are just yet another tiny group of thumb-twiddlers pretending to be Red Bull athletes, just like the CoD comp players. They're no different, so any talk about what is 'respect' coming from them seems kind of silly. Or are we discussing the PC crowd? They are the overseers of deciding what is respectable? if so, who are they to cast dispersions? Really now, what difference (in relation to respect) is there if aim assist is present? PC players are using a mouse & keyboard, which is considerably easier to play with. And setting both of those things aside, at the end of the day, all those people are sitting on their asses playing a video game. The only respect their going to get from anyone, is from their own community, which is mostly pre teen kids. I don't think Connor McGregor or Tom Brady is sitting around at night thinking about how some CS player is to be respected as a great athlete. I don't know anything about Hopscotch. I'm pretty sure there is probably some type of championships buried in their 'sport' somewhere, and no one is making a living. But if making a living is the condition for respect, CS and CoD are kind of both going to fail. As I said up above, ultimately what makes a game/sport/hobby competitive is separate from the whole respect thing.
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