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Post by Protolisk on Aug 5, 2010 4:21:31 GMT -5
I need a help making a list of the guns in BC2 to avoid and those which are theoretically the best.
Assault
Useless guns F2000 -very low damage, moderately high fire rate. Not practical for an Assault rifle. Suited more for CQC
AUG -inferior version of M416 lower long range damage longer reload more visual recoil tighter spread while sighted and moving (only positive)
Other guns AEK-971 -Low recoil low damage, however hard to hit people long range as it bounces around a lot
M16A2 -Like the AN-94
Recommended weapons XM8 -
M416 -
AN-94 -
Engineer
Useless guns -
Other Guns -
Recommended weapons Used to be PP2000, not sure right now
Medic
Useless Weapons T88 -same fire rate as PKM but a lot lower damage Lower fire rate than guns of same damage Only advantage is 200 ammo capacity
Other Guns PKM -
M249 -
M60 -Not as powerful as it used to be
XM8 LMG -
MG36 -pretty much the same as XM8 only difference is that it comes standard with a red dot sigh,t however different to the normal red dot sight
Recommended Weapons MG3 -high fire rate
Sidearms
Useless MP-412 -slow fire rate
M93R -Burst fire is only good close range has lots of spread
Other guns M9 -
M1911 -
MP-443 -
Shotguns
Useless Spas-12 -identical to other pump actions except gun model is obscuring
USAS -Same as saiga but full auto You should be able to shoot the saiga just as fast
Other guns SAIGA -offers more control compared to USAS
R870 -
NS2000 -slightly different reloading style to R870
40mm -pretty good probably not practical
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Den
He's That Guy
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Post by Den on Aug 5, 2010 9:54:47 GMT -5
AEK-971 ★★★★☆ A weapon with no negative. It's average ability leads to many positives. All around good. Awesome iron sights.
XM8 ★★★★☆ Slightly more power up close and slightly less speed than the AEK-971. Benefits over the AEK in close range combat, less than 20m. Suffers at a distance ever so slightly because of the recoil.
F2000 ★★★☆☆ Less power and slightly more speed than the AEK-971. It has a fairly tight grouping in extended bursts but can be unpredictable at times.
AUG ★★☆☆☆ A slower, weaker version of the XM8. Serves no purpose when others are available.
AN94 ★★★★☆ A burst rifle with greater accuracy than most other automatic weapons in the game. The slow rate of fire is a boon to its high precision at a distance. The recent patch has knocked it from its seat of power in close combat, defeated by most others in killing potential. Its iron sights are below the point of aiming. Goes great with a 4x Scope, though.
M416 ★★★☆☆ A version of the AUG with slightly greater long range damage and less recoil. Its iron sights are below the point of aiming, similarly to the AN94.
M16A2 ★★★★☆ A burst fire version of the AEK-971. The burst function enforces a bit of discipline on heavy trigger fingers. Too bad it is the last Assault Class weapon to be gained.
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9A91 ★★★☆☆ Power type SMG. The one bullet more damage at a distance is no trade off to the ten less bullet capacity. Has a negligible accuracy advantage that only comes into play with excessive automatic fire.
SCAR ★★★★☆ Power type SMG. A superior capacity with negligible less accuracy from excessive automatic fire than the 9A91.
UMP ★★★★☆ Power type SMG. Superior initial accuracy on the move and the average in capacity between the 9A91 and SCAR.
XM8 C ★★★☆☆ Balance type SMG. Has a much more erratic level of recoil than the AKS74u (and most other guns). The small speed advantages make it a superior choice at close range.
AKS74u ★★★☆☆ Balance type SMG. Has a steadier recoil that gives it a range advantage over the XM8 Carbine.
UZI ★★★★☆ Speed type SMG. Ultimately, the Speed types best the Balance types since the trade of damage for speed is better. As of the recent patch, it's damage advantage is a bigger plus over the minor difference in speed. A stronger upwards climb prevent it from being as good at long range as the PP2000.
PP2000 ★★★★★ Speed type SMG. It has a minor advantage in accuracy both in spread and recoil over the Uzi and a fair advantage in capacity over the other SMGs. High accuracy, speed and capacity give it the edge over other SMGs, especially at long range.
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PKM ★★★★☆ A powerful starting LMG, average in most other aspects. No flaw other than being belt-fed with a long reload like most of the machine guns.
M249 ★★☆☆☆ Weaker than most LMGs at a distance with only a small advantage in speed. However the doubled capacity and low recoil among other LMGs are somewhat inviting for mid range combat. It will lose out by a hair against any other LMG up close or at a great distance.
T88 ★★☆☆☆ The T88 is a weaker version of the PKM with double the capacity. The extra hundred rounds isn't much of a direct benefit to being fundamentally inferior in power to the PKM.
M60 ★★★☆☆ An LMG with high full automatic accuracy and low recoil when sighted. It is the go-to LMG for long range shooting, however it pales in comparison to the PKM (and most other LMGs) in any other encounter.
XM8 LMG ★★★★☆ An LMG with average damage and accuracy among LMGs. Advantages in firing and reloading speed. A weapon with no faults and good at any range.
MG36 ★★★★☆ A version of the XM8 LMG with a built in wide open scope. The faint red dot is difficult to use in some maps. However the lack of obstruction is a good incentive to take it over the XM8 in some scenarios.
MG3 ★★★☆☆ Recent patches have made it a significantly powerful weapon due to its high speed. A better trade of damage for speed than the M249, however it is not a weapon meant for ammo conservation.
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M24 ★★★☆☆ An average bolt action rifle with a standard crosshair scope.
T88 S ★★★☆☆ An average semi-automatic rifle with a chevron crosshair.
SV98 ★★★★☆ An average bolt action rifle with a chevron crosshair. Also has double the capacity of the other bolt rifles.
SVU ★★★★★ A silenced version of the T88. The most efficient Recon Rifle for designated marksmen.
GOL ★★★☆☆ An average bolt action rifle with a thicker solid crosshair than the M24. A slightly slower rechamber time than the M24 and SV98. It has the benefit of no up-down scope sway like the other rifles (PC only).
VSS ★★★★☆ Another silent rifle. Fully automatic. Statistically comparable to the current-patch G3 rifle. Extremely useful for offensive Recons who aren't trying to be "Snipers".
M95 ★★☆☆☆ A slow bolt action with no benefit over the other bolt actions against infantry. However the damage against light vehicles has a bit of a utility purpose. Unless several M95 rifles are firing at a helicopter (and you should hope such a thing isn't happening), the damage isn't going to add up fast enough.
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M9 ★★★★☆ The balance of power and capacity. A great choice for close and mid range combat.
MP443 ★★★★☆ A great gain in capacity over a minor loss in power from the M9. Great for suppressing and shootouts at any range.
1911 ★★★★☆ A significant gain in power but with a significant loss in capacity. Doesn't benefit much from Magnum ammo so its options are open.
REX ★★★☆☆ A redundant gain in power over the 1911 with a significant loss in reload speed. However with Magnum ammo, a single headshot up close is lethal.
M93R ★☆☆☆☆ Low damage and accuracy. Even if it did land a hit, said hit is minor.
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THOMPSON ★★★☆☆ Compared to the Engineer's SMGs, the Thompson is below average. However it has superior initial accuracy while on the move when sighted compared to most weapons.
M14 ★★★☆☆ A scopeless version of a semi-automatic sniper rifle. The sights are below and slightly to the right of the point of aiming, making distance shots troublesome.
M1 GARAND ★★★★☆ Slightly less in capacity and reload speed than the M14. Also suffering from sights below the point of aiming, however not to such as degree as the M14. A novelty weapon, though not actually all that bad.
G3 ★★★★☆ A powerful, slow assault rifle that suffers greatly from inaccuracy with automatic fire. With a steady trigger finger and three or four round bursts, it is an efficient weapon.
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M870 ★★★☆☆ A standard pump action shotgun. Has a small frame that won't obscure the screen.
SPAS ★★☆☆☆ A standard pump action shotgun. The stock is still folded, causing a large portion of the screen to be obscured behind the weapon.
NEOSTEAD ★★★★☆ A pump action shotgun with a significant reload speed advantage over the SPAS and Remngton.
SAIGA ★★★☆☆ A standard semi-automatic shotgun. The single shot function makes it a more effective mid range weapon when used with Slugs over the USAS.
USAS ★★★☆☆ An automatic version of the Saiga. A superior point blank buckshot weapon over the Saiga for the mere fact that is is full auto.
40mm SHOTGUN ★★★☆☆ A significant powerhouse of a buckshot shotgun. A do-or-die type of weapon due to the single round capacity and only two round reserve. The power advantage makes it a "do" in the hands of a trained twitch shooter. A dud for anyone else.
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rpsx
True Bro
Posts: 10,016
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Post by rpsx on Aug 5, 2010 10:42:34 GMT -5
FANTASTIC reply. gets a bookmark for sure.
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Post by infininja on Aug 5, 2010 19:13:20 GMT -5
In platinuming (what an awkward made up verb) the M93R, I found it to be a great ambush weapon around corners when I was carrying a primary weapon I was uncomfortable using up close. Its time to kill often won out. Then again, I can usually land my shots; if you start missing with it you're absolutely screwed. It's also useless at any further ranges.
Surprisingly, I'm having a lot less fun using the MP-443 (that and the M9 are the only pistols I have left to platinum). I used to like it a lot when the game came out, but I may have been using it with the previously beastly M95 to put in that last shot with a high capacity sidearm. Right now I'm finding it doesn't have enough power to take down all but the most stationary or unaware of players.
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Post by Protolisk on Aug 6, 2010 2:58:31 GMT -5
Awesome reply Den. Thanks
How are you getting the stars? alt codes?
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Den
He's That Guy
Posts: 4,294,967,295
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Post by Den on Aug 6, 2010 4:18:02 GMT -5
★☆ 9733 and 9734
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Post by Protolisk on Aug 6, 2010 20:20:57 GMT -5
thanks
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Post by verify on Aug 19, 2010 20:52:15 GMT -5
Den, for the Uzi, what do you mean by "stronger upwards climb"?
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Den
He's That Guy
Posts: 4,294,967,295
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Post by Den on Aug 20, 2010 2:42:27 GMT -5
It has a slight bit more recoil than the PP2000, enough that it'll pull up with excessive fire.
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Post by Protolisk on Aug 20, 2010 7:45:54 GMT -5
So would it be right to say the best guns for each class are still AN94 M60 PP2000 SVU
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Den
He's That Guy
Posts: 4,294,967,295
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Post by Den on Aug 20, 2010 13:04:11 GMT -5
For raw power, the AN94 and M60 can't be beat. The PP2000 and SVU have the greatest benefits with the fewest trade-offs.
But they aren't the end-all.
Bolt action rifles sometimes have their place, especially in the hands of someone who is actually capable of using them (not that many). The T88 is infinitely inferior to the SVU by not being silenced. And while the VSS is great up close, combat Recon could do just as well or better with a G3 or shotgun.
The power SMGs are more favorable choices if you absolutely know you'll be fighting in very close quarters and you've got hella reflexes. The AK and XM8c are pretty much obsolete, their more average trade of speed and power don't match up to the PP2000 and Uzi's long range accuracy.
While the AN94 may be powerful and accurate, giving it both great point blank and longest range superiority. But it lacks the level of speed that suits my or others' styles, as it is the two extremes of power and speed. The rest of the Assault weapons are much closer to an average of their three primary statistics (Power, Speed, Accuracy) than the AN94, and any of them can be much more suitable.
Yeah, M60 is still pretty much the statistically superior choice. Not by much, but still. Same as above, the M60's slow rate of fire may not be favorable to some. Maybe the PKM and T88 are just enough. Or further than that, the XM8 and MG36 for a balance of speed and power. Or further than that and the SAW and MG3 for high speed and low power.
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Post by zany on Aug 21, 2010 14:53:08 GMT -5
i did a little test featuring the UMP & XM8C (as i only play eng) the UMP stats are very good (the best?) but i dunno why it doesn't drop enemies as fast as the xm8c, it just doesn't feel right. Den can you explain this?
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Post by ZeroKelvin^ on Aug 21, 2010 15:05:22 GMT -5
The power SMGs are more favorable choices if you absolutely know you'll be fighting in very close quarters and you've got hella reflexes. The AK and XM8c are pretty much obsolete, their more average trade of speed and power don't match up to the PP2000 and Uzi's long range accuracy. I agree that at long range the Uzi and PP2000 are clearly better, but wouldn't the smarter choice at long range be to either use the CG or RPG or avoid engagement?
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Den
He's That Guy
Posts: 4,294,967,295
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Post by Den on Aug 21, 2010 15:16:37 GMT -5
At point blank range, both the XM8 and UMP will kill an enemy at the same exact time (0.4 seconds not including latency and travel time) without any missed shots and no pausing between shots.
The UMP will suffer more from a miss than the XM8 by mere rate of fire, so each miss will have the XM8 inch ahead in killing speed.
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Post by randomblah on Aug 22, 2010 14:07:33 GMT -5
I've done pretty well with VSS recon attacking buildings, even without a sight. The silencer is helpful, and if an enemy is really far I can still kill them, and I find the no scope surprisingly accurate. Also shooting an enemy in a group from behind is good for confusion since the enemy sniper line plays which could make enemies focus on a hill finding an enemy, rather than you.
But if you want to use ACOG or RDS that's generally better for those close ranges, but if you want another spec it's not always too bad of an idea.
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Post by zany on Aug 26, 2010 12:13:02 GMT -5
At point blank range, both the XM8 and UMP will kill an enemy at the same exact time (0.4 seconds not including latency and travel time) without any missed shots and no pausing between shots. The UMP will suffer more from a miss than the XM8 by mere rate of fire, so each miss will have the XM8 inch ahead in killing speed. (i use mag ammo so the ump it 2 millisecond faster?) i never thought about that...so basically for cqc you rather have high rof than damage
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Post by Flubadoo on Sept 4, 2010 14:01:21 GMT -5
I just love dropping people with the SVU in nelson bay since they can't see the flash or hear you. ITS A BEAUTIFUL GUN!!
However, I'm gonna say flat out that I really don't think the M60 is that great. Missing 1 shot = large addition to TTK. The recoil at longer ranges is also pretty unbearable. I usually stick to the PKM or MG36.
Also, I find that the PP2000 simply spends its ammo WAY too fast, which is why I go with the UMP.
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Post by infininja on Sept 4, 2010 20:44:05 GMT -5
However, I'm gonna say flat out that I really don't think the M60 is that great. Missing 1 shot = large addition to TTK. The recoil at longer ranges is also pretty unbearable. I usually stick to the PKM or MG36. Man that's weird. I use the M60 because it has seemingly no effective recoil. That thing snipes people.
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Post by Flubadoo on Sept 5, 2010 12:10:59 GMT -5
It is too much visual recoil/bounces too much for me.
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Post by onikage on Sept 12, 2010 5:38:53 GMT -5
And while the VSS is great up close, combat Recon could do just as well or better with a G3 or shotgun. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the VSS straight up superior to the G3 by any metric? Better damage, faster fire rate, lower recoil, silenced. Right? The only advantage I can see to using the G3 is having spec 1 open for something other than optics, but it still seems like an inferior choice. If there was a spec that added 25% dmg, increased your fire rate by 20% and halved your recoil, everyone would us it. That's essentially what using the VSS+RDS over the G3 is. Edit: I suppose if you're rushing the MCOMs with C4 the Ex Up would be better, but it seems like assault would be an all-around better choice for that role anyhow.
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Post by onikage on Nov 6, 2010 12:13:55 GMT -5
Hey Den, would you mind editing your megapost above to reflect the most recent patch (or reposting an updated version)? I'd just be interested to see how your rankings have changed.
Thanks.
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Den
He's That Guy
Posts: 4,294,967,295
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Post by Den on Nov 6, 2010 12:34:40 GMT -5
Probably wouldn't change much. Just bump up the F2000's stars for its accuracy boost. Maybe take out the "power" from the M60 and AN94.
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Post by ][nquisitor Mateo on Nov 7, 2010 17:22:34 GMT -5
So now the best weapons are:
Assault: AEK (G3) Engineer: G3 Medic: PKM Sniper: M95
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Post by ven on Nov 8, 2010 5:08:32 GMT -5
First of all I don't think there's such thing as the best weapon ever, but there are quite a few that are good. This info is for normal game mode:
Assault: 1. AEK is great - it's stable, has high rate of fire and good long-range damage; excellent mechanical aiming, also great with 4x scope; if you don't like low-range dmg, get 40mm shotgun 2. XM8 - it's slightly better than AEK at low range, but also kicks more, good with red dot 3. F2000 - can be devastating at low-medium range after the patch, difficult to kill multiple enemies; when using scope it loses to both AEK and XM8, but it's really accurate for run&gun, like SMG for Assault 4. M416 - this weapon hasn't got that great stats, but it's really easy to shoot both 1-shot, short, and long series.
Engineer: 1. I like PP2000 for longer range. It got nerfed some time ago, but it's a good weapon for run&gun actions and adding missing damage after rocket launcher shot; very quiet 2. 09A-91 is one great weapon for very close range
Medic: 1. MG36 - built-in red dot, and good overall accuracy make it a nice weapon; short skipped reload time; the only problem is black screen outside the scope area; if you don't like this red dot, grab XM8 LMG 2. MG3 - good for short range if you run with a dedicated assault 3/4 - some people like PKM and M249, but I couldn't learn to use them for some reason
Recon: 1. SV98 - imo the best anti-infantry bolt-action rifle. It's got the same damage as the rest, while having shorter reload times and more ammo; because I don't like VSS, I use it with 4x scope for fast recon action 2. M95 - you can destroy a heli 3. SVU /T88 - it's quiet and requires 1 headshot at v. close range with magnum 4. Some people like Gol as it doesn't move when aiming
--- All classes: 870 / NS2000 with slugs: 1-shot 1-kill when hitting head or even body at close range; it's not that awesome after the latest patch, but still great; we've been successfully using it for Assault, Medic and Recon; the best combination in my opinion is 1 guy with shotgun with slugs + 1 with auto weapon (or an awesome player with SVU/T88); I pair them with M93R
G3 is really good, especially after the latest patch. It's got terribly huge spread at full auto, and it's difficult to shoot at long range, but at medium it's really nice. I use it mostly with Assault to get C4, but it's also interesting for Engineer.
Saiga / USAS - they're totally overpowered after the latest patch, when using buckshot magnum, great for all classes, especially Assault, however not when going alone.
Pistols - 443 seems to be the best overall pistol (damage/time and damage capacity), but I usually pair fast-shooting primary weapons with 412 and sniper rifles / pump action shotguns with fast-shooting pistols. Sometimes, I try to pick the pistol with damage that would be good for what I leave with a primary gun. For example M93R is not the best, but it's great for killing guys after successful shotgun shot (at a greater range I prefer 1911).
oh, and a knife - it's actually pretty cool when you get familiar with it
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novem
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Post by novem on Dec 17, 2010 7:11:07 GMT -5
My some thoughts about AN94 after the patch. But first a post of guy Red Frostraven from EA forums about Ceramic armor / magnum ammo
Ok, so basically before patch AN94 was almost perfect gun, great accuracy and power at long range, and big damage (taking huge benefits from magnum- 2 bursts to kill) at close range. Only slight change in damage from 20->17.6 means, that you need 3 bursts in cqc, and with magnum you still need 3 bursts (17.6*1.25=22). 3 burst versus fully automatic rifle means that 90% of cqc you are dead (and i know it from experience, smgs or ars just rape you in close fight). Also not to mention horrible iron sights (red dot or acog is a must, but you can't get LW then, which is pain) and the thing, that with Aek or XM8 you can "snipe" with burts as with An (just practice), but with An you can't go fullauto. Still AN94 is better than for example F2k, so i would rate it 3.5/5, or stay it at 4, and change AEK and XM8 ratings to 5.
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