BF3 - Damage Charts, Stats and Mechanics

[symthic]

symthic.com?s=bf3

All criticism, help etc, is more than welcome.

Charts removed from here due to too much work keeping them updated to both, forum and my web page

[frankelstner]

nvm

[bel]

Dammit, I go to bed and someone does this. Nice work. I'd stick the attachment stuff up there as well when you get the chance.

[symthic]

General weapons are next on my list.
Attachment variables seem to be same for every gun so it shall be an own chart for them and vehicle specializations alone.
Now it's time to get some sleep.

[dogeyedboy]

A little help with Horizontal Recoil, my brain's not quite getting it. For every shot will it pick a random value from the min-max? Wouldn't that make a gun like the SCAR predominantly move to one side more than the other, or am I just getting it ALL wrong?

[bel]

First things first, I'd make it a bit more obvious that this is now real data rather than practical testing. Can you change your thread title, or get Den to?

For the general weapon stuff, here's where it is in the files:

The fire rate is in the first heading:


FiringFunctionData
FireLogic
RateOfFire 600.0
RateOfFireForBurst 600.0
ReloadTime 2.84999990463
ReloadTimeBulletsLeft 2.25
ReloadThreshold 0.75


And just below that, ammo and reload data:


FiringFunctionData
[...]
Ammo
AmmoConfigData
MagazineCapacity 21
NumberOfMagazines 6
TraceFrequency 1
AmmoPickupMinAmount 0
AmmoPickupMaxAmount 0
AutoReplenishMagazine False
AutoReplenishDelay 5.0
AmmoBagPickupDelayMultiplier 1.0
AmmoBagPickupAmount 4294967295


Oh, also; initial bullet velocity looks like it's in the same section, a bit further up again:


Shot
ShotConfigData
InitialPosition
Vec3
x 0.0
y 0.0
z 0.0
InitialDirection
Vec3
x 0.0
y 0.0
z 1.0
InitialSpeed
Vec3
x 0.0
y 0.0
z 420.0


The z direction on InitialSpeed is going to be speed away from muzzle at spawn. Vec3 is directional relative to the gun, so it's moving directly away from the muzzle (0,0,1.0) at (0,0,420.0). Note that the chart is currently just using the bullet properties. The weapons seem to have their own muzzle velocities. We might have to actually test which value is used by the game.

I'll leave the actual collation up to the man with the chart (rule no. 57: always defer to the man with the chart), but that's where you can rip it from.

[bel]

Nov 21, 2011 18:51:32 GMT -5 dogeyedboy said:

A little help with Horizontal Recoil, my brain's not quite getting it. For every shot will it pick a random value from the min-max? Wouldn't that make a gun like the SCAR predominantly move to one side more than the other, or am I just getting it ALL wrong?

I think the chart actually has the horizontal recoil values wrong, or at least is presenting it confusingly. Here's the actual rip for the SCAR again:


Recoil
GunSwayRecoilData
RecoilAmplitudeMax 10.0
RecoilAmplitudeIncPerShot 0.5
HorizontalRecoilAmplitudeIncPerShotMin -0.20000000298
HorizontalRecoilAmplitudeIncPerShotMax 0.20000000298
HorizontalRecoilAmplitudeMax 10.0
RecoilAmplitudeDecreaseFactor 15.0


Relevant numbers are horizontal min max, and amplitude max. I'm guessing, but my assumption is that these work differently to the min and max for spread.

I suspect that it randomly rolls a number between min and max (-0.2 and +0.2) upon firing and moves the gun's x axis by that amount. That would cause the gun to jitter back and forwards. It's capped at 10 degrees in any direction, but it's never going to get that far horizontally anyway.

I'm honestly not sure where the 0.5 on the chart comes from for the SCAR.

[battleaxerx]

The joy and love in my heart for this community and its amazing contributors is immeasurable.

=) Add it to the list of things to be thankful for!

[bel]

I'm just going to keep dumping information here as I find it, since this looks like the best place to collate it all. I'm probably going to end up with like a sextuple post, but perhaps Den will forgive me.

I think I've found where the bullet types link in.

For the AEK:

SoldierWeaponData
WeaponClass wc545x45mmWP

That's definitely worth knowing. It's about halfway down the file in a the block after the recoil information.

Some other stuff that might be worth reporting:

SoldierWeaponData
[...]
RenderFov 55.0
ZoomRenderFov 20.0

...looks like it gives the amount of zoom on the ironsight.

Near the end of the file there's this kind of stuff:

WeaponSpeedData 3bdefcd6b0cccd48b36d82d4968b0a4c
ZoomOutSpeed 1.0
ZoomInSpeed 1.5
UnDeploySpeed 1.0
DeploySpeed 1.0
WeaponZoomModifier 9c601aefe517584ba17476c3f0fe2b48
$
WeaponModifierBase
ZoomRenderFov 15.0

Which is probably for the different scopes, but it's impossible to tell which attachment is which.

There's also:

WeaponMiscModifier b7c66a1862c1dc4eb934b1c80f84c02f
$
WeaponModifierBase
EnableBreathControl False
CanBeInSupportedShooting False
UnZoomOnBoltAction True
HoldBoltActionUntilZoomRelease True
IsSilenced True

...which, for this block, must correspond to the silencer, because of the last variable. The others are either redundant or obvious.
It's worth noting that the SCAR-H has no parameter wherre IsSilenced="True," which is consistent with the whole "appears on minimap" thing. That rip is from the AEK, which does silence properly according to the practical chart.

Some things I can't find:

How silencers affect bullet damage
Ads speeds for the guns themselves
Whether the fire modes alter anything (demize99 tweeted at one stage that burst fire had less spread and more recoil)

[omalley]

I LOVE YOU GUYS. but um wheres all the info for the m4 m4a1 and m16a3 and a4?

[omalley]

sidenote, it would be cool to get rpms so we can know difference between the bolt actions (m98B is slower than m40 but not sure how much) and between diff types of fire

[warriorks]

Awesome. Thank you guys for the time and effort you all have put in to produce these stats.

Im sure you guys will get to this all in due time but... In addition to RPMs^^ also the reload times for each weapon would be a helpful.

Thanks again

[rukqoa]

One question I've always had is how do you guys make these charts? Scripted or manual drawing? Blows my mind how fast you can come up with these graphics. XD

[symthic]

I already have script for reload times, rpm and ammo capacity.
I don't have to manually check every file, my script runs them through and parses the wanted values.

Trying to find some time today to add them to chart.

[bel]

Nov 22, 2011 2:30:40 GMT -5 symthic said:

I already have script for reload times, rpm and ammo capacity.
I don't have to manually check every file, my script runs them through and parses the wanted values.

Trying to find some time today to add them to chart.

I realise you have a script, you wouldn't have been able to do it all by hand in that timeframe. But you have to know what the variables are to parse them, and some aren't so obvious.

Also, your Horizontal recoil stat is wrong for a number of guns, as is muzzle velocity for all guns except the snipers.

Also, patch going live as we speak, so much of this will be obsolete in a few hours anyway.

[neverlast74]

This is GREAT! Thank you very much.
one Question... I am not sure how to interpret the data.... comparing the Assault rifles: m416 and aek971:

the H-Inc is -0.3 and 0.1 so (difference is 0.4) and increase of aek971 it is -0.5 and 0.5 (so total 1)

so this tells me the range of H-spread is bigger/worse for the aek971 - right?

2nd Question... do we know the effect approx in % of a grip?

[neverlast74]

Patch news for PC ... battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/news/view/2832654775415378344/

Slightly increased the range of the P90 and MP7 and PDW-R.
• Slightly increased the range of the 5.56mm PDW-R and decreased the minimum damage at long range.
• Slightly increased the minimum range of the Mk11, SVD, and M39 EMR 7.62mm rifles.
• Decreased the maximum damage and maximum range of the G3 and SCAR-H 7.62mm weapons.

[SheWolf]

so..what exactly is "minimum range"?
what about maximum range? is that when the bullet disappears? if yes, why decrease if for scar and g3?

[bel]

By minimum range, they mean the range at which damage falloff begins. So the Mk11 does its full 50 damage at slightly longer ranges after the patch.

Another error in the chart; I'm pretty confident all the bolt-action snipers do 35 supp. The M98B and SV98 are currently listed at 10.

[symthic]

Nov 22, 2011 5:06:21 GMT -5 bel said:

bolt-action snipers do 35 supp. The M98B and SV98 are currently listed at 10.

You're right. After I get home from work, I'll update the chart and add general weapons.

[rainydog]

Thanks for the chart symthic, very much appreciated.

Have to say that the 'balancing' is very poor and lazy, however. There's so many variables they could have used to balance and make each weapon distinctive, yet it's basically copy and paste jobs across the board with minor changes in recoil numbers.

Providing the rates of fire on Battlelog are accurate, certain weapons are just outright worthless unless you want to intentionally hanticap yourself. And just lol at the AN-94 when compared to the F2000.

I know Dice were trying to be quasi-realistic by basing damage on real life ROF's and bullet calibers etc. but they still could've made some effort to compensate with all the variables they're working with. There should always be pro's and cons to every weapon in the game, its not hard to do.

And lol again at the Scar and G3 nerfs in the patch. They were two weapons that were actually nicely tuned and balanced.

[yhzh]

Did anyone else have to redownload the whole game, and then get the patch?

Most of the stuff looks good. Once they add built in voip, my list of complaints will all be minor issues.

[swyck]

Excellent work and much appreciated.

[turdferguson]

Nov 22, 2011 7:59:34 GMT -5 rainydog said:

Thanks for the chart symthic, very much appreciated.

Have to say that the 'balancing' is very poor and lazy, however. There's so many variables they could have used to balance and make each weapon distinctive, yet it's basically copy and paste jobs across the board with minor changes in recoil numbers.

Providing the rates of fire on Battlelog are accurate, certain weapons are just outright worthless unless you want to intentionally hanticap yourself. And just lol at the AN-94 when compared to the F2000.

I know Dice were trying to be quasi-realistic by basing damage on real life ROF's and bullet calibers etc. but they still could've made some effort to compensate with all the variables they're working with. There should always be pro's and cons to every weapon in the game, its not hard to do.

And lol again at the Scar and G3 nerfs in the patch. They were two weapons that were actually nicely tuned and balanced.

I don't think we completely understand these data yet. Once we understand how some of these variables interact with each other (via attachments, other modifiers per gun), we may quantitatively find some unique quirks and niches for some of these guns.

[yhzh]

I think the damage values for the m60 are off on the chart.

[symthic]

True, M60 had incorrect damage. Rest of it's values should be fine.

Added attachment and general charts

Ill remove the chart from here since it's too much job to keep it updated to both places.

[yhzh]

Thanks for putting all this together. Looks like it took a lot of time and effort.

[battleaxerx]

I made a silly (But accurate?) little graph in MS paint for when flechette starts to out damage buckshot... According to my graph, buck and flechette do the same damage at 13.7 distance (Meters I guess) And after that flechette linearly does more and more damage... as you know.
A pic of a distance of 13.7 as seen through the 870's ADS Iron sights would be neat...

Also, according to my graph, both shells are doing 13.5 damage at that range (13.7). Is that even capable of 1hko?

[didjeridu]

Speed is very interesting. It completely changes my whole outlook on the guns. Now I absolutely must have the guns with the fastest bullet velocity. Luckily for me, the M16 is one of them.

The M4A1 looks like it's definitely better than the A-91. The T-88, PKP, and M60 are looking like a trio of sad pandas. Is there really any point in using a bolt-action besides the M98? It's head and shoulders better than the SV98/M40. The PDW-R looks like the PDW of choice, and the VAL looks like a spray and pray kind of weapon at any sort of ranged combat. The Rex isn't looking too hot for range. The 1911 is a cruel joke unless you're right in someone's face, in which case the Rex is better.

[yhzh]

The other bolt actions cycle the action faster between shots.
I still like the A-91 more for the recoil, but the charts don't show the M4's recoil or spread.
Bullet velocity doesn't make too much of a difference at carbine engagement ranges.