mannon
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Post by mannon on Nov 29, 2009 19:42:20 GMT -5
I'm pretty new to MW2 myself, although I did play a lot of W@W. I never got into it enough to actually get very good, though, because I require constant practice to maintain my skill levels at games.
So far MW2 has been a bit more forgiving than W@W for me, but that's probably largely because of the huge influx of players new to CoD, and I also LOVE not having to wait to respawn, although I find that I get impatient and don't change classes much during a match.
Camper hating is really more of a throwback to the days when all the good weapons and armor and such were scattered around the map so if you successfully camped and controlled a vital area you would dominate based merely on the fact that you got there first. It was a cheap, if still valid tactic, that unfortunately could ruin the fun in some games.
In MW2 and most modern multiplayer games this is no longer an issue, so camp away.
But a word of caution... Remember that even if you are using a silencer and cold blooded once you kill somebody you've given yourself away via the kill cam. So if you camp be looking for vengeful players to try to use that against you. Instead out think them and change positions, looking to set them up for an ambush when they try to ambush you where you killed them from. Of course, they could be looking for you to change positions too. It all goes back and forth and becomes something of a mind game, though MW2 is a bit too fast and chaotic for truly epic sniper wars most of the time. ;p
I'll have to try some of these suggestions for sure. As for the snap try it in single player and you'll see it for sure when you ADS. There seems to be a lot less snap in MP, but there still is some. Also your snap will usually only work out to a certain range and you have to be fairly close to on target sometimes. And I could be wrong but it seems like you a good amount of your enemy has to be visible for it to snap. If they're behind 70% cover it certainly seems harder to snap, although sometimes it will snap to them and be aimed at them through whatever low cover they are behind instead of the headshot. I'm sure there's more knowledgeable people on the specifics, these are just my impressions. There is less snap but it's still noticeable and you can still snap from target to target with little flicks between.
For me my aim is okies, but slow. So yeah 1 on 1's tend to not go too well. I personally do better at long range. Personally the FAMAS is a gun I rather like. I don't have the M16 yet. It's great at those long range shots. In fact you can snap, burst, snap, burst over and over to hit multiple or moving targets. Another note on this is that I rather like the ACOG sight even though it blocks a lot of view and is slower than iron sights I like the zoom, and I think it increases the snap range so you can snap to further targets.
One thing that's been rather nice for me is the heartbeat sensor. I rather like having it. Of course I'm not really a run and gunner either. I'm more of a stalker. The bonus with it is that you can still use it even while being jammed or using a blast shield, which blocks the radar and the audio cues are kinda nice. You really have to get used to it, though, because the ticks are very slow. Another piece of advice, when you turn around to check your six with it, wait for a tick, because it won't have detected anyone behind you on the last tick when you were facing the other way. Basically if you turn more than 90 degrees don't trust it until you get a new tic.
I used to love sniping in other games, but I can't seem to snipe in MW2 though. It takes too gorram long to aim down the sights with a scope so by the time I'm scoped they aren't in my sights anymore. I guess you have to pick a spot and just scope it for a while waiting or something. I dunno. I feel too vulnerable when I'm scoped to stay in it for very long.
As for the weapons I've done okay with the SCAR, but the TAR has been a major disappointment for me. So mebbe it's not very noob friendly. ;p I don't recommend scavenger. Unless you're a skilled player you won't live long enough to need more ammo all that often. And definitely focus on lower killstreak rewards. I unlocked the AC130 as my first one before I noticed it takes 11 kills. heh Wasted the unlock... I never bother activating it because I'm not gonna get it. I think my best streak was 10 so far. heh
Carepackage is by far the best killstreak reward for us, because it gives us a taste of the really meaty ones for only 4 kills. I just wish there was another 3 kill reward. I'm not a huge fan of the recon drones. Useful as they are I'd just like more options, especially when everybody else on the damn team is already popping drones. I'm sure they are far more useful in FFA.
I've unlocked sentry gun since I'm also not a huge fan of predator missiles. They usually only get you 1 or 2 kills and can whiff completely if they all get under cover. If I could let the drone circle before launching it like in SP I'd like that better. I guess the best advice is to save it for when you know you have targets, but I get impatient and wanna pop it off right away. ;p I love the sentry gun, and it can get lots of kills, especially if you can defend it a tad and put it somewhere they really wanna go. But it can also be a bitch since you will often get popped trying to pick it up and then they will get it. ;-( I hate losing my SG... even worse to the other team.
I also suggest using your teammates to guard your flanks. You can follow them and try to two team enemies, but if you're semi unskilled like me then they get all the kills and you don't do much good. Better to follow along a parallel route with a teammate so they are effectively guarding your flank whether they know it or not. Just be careful. If you see them die on the map you know that you're being flanked.
Definitely watch the kill cams and the game winning shots some.
I'm trying out the USP now and I more or less skpped the M4 so I'll go back and check it out too. I really like AR's and longish range, though. So I don't think I'mma be an SMG guy in MW2 like I was in W@W. Very different games in so many ways despite the almost identical mechanics. heh
Anyway, Imma try out some different things.
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i8
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Post by i8 on Nov 30, 2009 7:02:47 GMT -5
ok stopping power does everything that hardline does except 1 less death coldblooded is useless for a newb cause he wont know how to flank on the maps stopping power makes a huge difference cause its useful in most situations and takes alot less skill to use
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qupie
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Post by qupie on Nov 30, 2009 16:29:29 GMT -5
yeah that seems about right
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Post by ssog on Nov 30, 2009 17:22:13 GMT -5
ok stopping power does everything that hardline does except 1 less death coldblooded is useless for a newb cause he wont know how to flank on the maps stopping power makes a huge difference cause its useful in most situations and takes alot less skill to use Stopping Power does absolutely everything that Hardline does... except for absolutely everything that Hardline does. Of course, by that token, Hardline does everything Stopping Power does except for everything that Stopping Power does, too. Cold Blooded is useful for a heck of a lot more than flanking. It's also useful for tactical loitering, creeping, hiding, and absolutely everything once the enemy has air support up. Very n00b-friendly perk. Stopping Power is only USEFUL in a situation if it gets you a kill where you otherwise would not have gotten one... and for n00bs, it doesn't do that. In a heads-up 1-on-1, it doesn't get you a kill (you still lose). If you get the drop on the enemy, you get the kill, but you would have had it without SP, too. The only time a n00b should be running SP is if he's sniping or doing some form of long-range tactical loitering.
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i8
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Post by i8 on Nov 30, 2009 17:43:04 GMT -5
the whole stopping power does everything that hardline does means that getting 1 less kill for a killstreak is useless when with stopping power u get the same killstreak for the same amount of effort cause it makes getting kills easier and yes newbs will get kills with stopping power cause of the fact it does everything u dont have to aim as consistently to kill if u spray u kill easier if u shoot through a wall u do more damage if u sneak up on someone u definately will kill them before they turn around kick affects u less cause u r shooting less shots it conserves ammo less time spent reloading u take down killstreaks easier it helps campers especially window campers u have a better chance to kill multiple enemies and it has no counter stopping power is the whore of all perks that divorced juggernaut cause it couldn't handle her
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i8
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Post by i8 on Nov 30, 2009 17:45:32 GMT -5
what i ment to say is stopping power is the whore of all perks that divorced juggernaut cause it couldn't handle her
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i8
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Post by i8 on Nov 30, 2009 17:47:24 GMT -5
wow wait lol thats funny if u type w h o r e it replaces it with me
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Post by ssog on Nov 30, 2009 22:14:03 GMT -5
the whole stopping power does everything that hardline does means that getting 1 less kill for a killstreak is useless when with stopping power u get the same killstreak for the same amount of effort cause it makes getting kills easier and yes newbs will get kills with stopping power cause of the fact it does everything u dont have to aim as consistently to kill if u spray u kill easier if u shoot through a wall u do more damage if u sneak up on someone u definately will kill them before they turn around kick affects u less cause u r shooting less shots it conserves ammo less time spent reloading u take down killstreaks easier it helps campers especially window campers u have a better chance to kill multiple enemies and it has no counter stopping power is the whore of all perks that divorced juggernaut cause it couldn't handle her Speaking as someone who has used a lot of both stopping power and hardline... it's a hell of a lot easier to get a 2-kill streak without SP than it is to get a 3-kill streak with SP. Heck, it's almost as easy to get a 3-kill streak without SP as it is with SP. Especially for a bad player, where getting the drop = kill, and not getting the drop = death. In that case, SP will rarely change anything from a non-kill to a kill. There are some guns that were just made for SP (the AUG and the Barrett, for starters), but by and large, bad players are better off with a different perk 2.
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i8
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Post by i8 on Nov 30, 2009 22:51:41 GMT -5
No they r better with stopping power cause its universally useful and most people use it so the old sayin about how so many people use it it becomes a nescesity still applies
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Dec 2, 2009 4:23:00 GMT -5
It's something of a tossup and comes down to play style in a lot of ways. Stopping power generally means 1 less bullet to kill, which really isn't all that much. The thing is noobs spray a lot more bullets than they hit so needing 1 more hit often means firing 2 or 3 more bullets before you get it if not more.
In the extreme cases of truly catching someone completely off guard and truly going head to head with no advantage to either player I agree that SP will not help a new player at all. They will win in the first case (unless they really cock it up) and will die in the second, hands down. Hence the idea becomes to either try to get the drop on enemies more and go head to head less with CB, or to just get the side benefit of getting your kill streaks easier.
In practice, however, there are many encounters which fall somewhere in between the two. Where you might get to shoot first, but the enemy isn't exactly caught with their pants down. I've noticed that with SP I win a lot more of those because I kill faster. I may still be slower than the other guy, but if I get to shoot first and he has to react I've got something of an advantage.
In this case interestingly the more skilled the player is the less they will benefit from SP, because they will need fewer shots to get the prerequisite number of hits needed to kill.
The effectiveness of CB seems to go up with player experience and map awareness.
This suggests that perhaps new players may wish to start on SP and graduate up to CB as they gain experience, but again it will depend on play style, as well as reaction time. People with fast reaction times may prefer strait up fights to flanking.
As for hardline I'm a bit split on it. I love the idea of getting my rewards easier. I love them, but it's hard for me to get my rewards. I tend to have a hard time getting more than just the UAV, which gets old and boring. Yes it's useful, but it's neither fun nor sexy like the others. Hell just the way the game respawns works against you since you can't ever really know the game won't respawn someone right behind you, which I loath! (I often miss the respawn rooms from TFC.)
Hardline definitely benefits people with smaller kill streaks more than those with bigger ones. For example if you've already got 6 kills the benefit of 1 kill isn't as big as the difference between 2 and 3. And getting care packages at 3 kills rather than four is quite cool.
Personally I think it would be nice to have hardline as a death streak reward instead, though. Compared to CB and SP it does seem a tad under powered. But that all depends. If your strategy relies heavily on your kill streak rewards, using lower ones to unlock higher ones and such, then that one kill could mean the difference between getting a reward that opens up the AC130 or chopper gunner for you. And that has the potential to push your K/D ratio way up.
The other part of that which is good for new players is that while it takes skill to really make the KS rewards really count, it doesn't take that much skill to get some kills and have some fun with them, and that can be a huge refreshment from getting knifed and shot in the back every 30 seconds. (The knife attack and bad respaws are probably the most frustrating things for new players. In fact I rather wish the knife was only a 1HK from behind sometimes.)
Unfortunately the death streak rewards do not give the same kind of change of pace and quick respite from the action that kill streaks do. And those are precisely the players that need a break to cool off and not throw the controller into the garbage disposal. Hence why I'd really like to see Hardline as a death streak. It would give you a motivation to get back into the fight.
Martyrdom is somewhat satisfying, but it won't be effective for much longer. I remember it as a perk in W@W and everyone just learned to avoid the dropped 'nades. I think the MW2 community hasn't quite got the knack since it's a death streak now instead and not too common (was everywhere for a while in W@W) and there are still a lot of new players. But that will probably wear off.
Final stand gives you a second chance, but against experienced players it's almost worthless, they just keep shooting and finish you off before you can do much. Again that's one that get's less useful the more experienced the community gets.
I also dislike Painkiller. It is only good for two things, bad respawns, and rushing the enemy. The duration is just too short. So if you're playstyle is more careful and long range or stealthy it's completely useless. That one I think should not start the timer until you take your first hit, though perhaps have an even shorter timer. That way you would still get some benefit even if you aren't a run 'n gunner.
I suppose copycat is okay, but I don't much like it for the same reason I seldom use the premade classes. I like to tweak every detail on my classes, which is also the only way I can familiarize myself with them. If I use the premade classes I forget what's what or regret that it has X perk instead of Y, and with Copycat I have that as well as the fact that I only have a few seconds to see the enemy's class and decide whether I want it or not, and I've usually hit X and respawned in frustration by then anyway.
So I guess I'm a bit underwhelmed by the death streaks. lol I applaud the idea but think the execution could have been better. I've always found it unbalancing to reward the best players with even more ways to utterly decimate the weaker ones. That coupled with basically no player matching unlike Halo means a steep learning curve for new players. I rather liked going up against people of roughly my skill level in Halo and climbing up the ranks bit by bit rather than simply dying in massive quantities playing against much faster and better players all the time. Having a ranking system, instead of just ranking, was nice. Then again the last Halo I played online was Halo 2.
I also thought the shield would be perhaps more new player friendly, but I think it's less. It's much harder to really make that effective, at least unless you have a friend to team up with and more or less babysit you.
That's not necessarily a bad thing. The fact that there is enough nuance to nearly every facet of the game that you can learn something new about nearly everything to get better and better is well... cool. It just makes it hard on the new guys. lol
I wonder if it's better or worse for new players to start off on FFA. It seems like you might get more experience quicker that way and get to try out ideas and strategies quickly. The downside is you're gonna get flanked and flanked and flanked and unlucky respawns, and so on...
Really, you would think modern games would have better (less frustrating) ways to respawn players than the simple randomly drop you into the shit method that's been around since FPS was invented. To me there's nothing more aggravating than being killed within seconds by an enemy I couldn't even see, much less have avoided. I'm not saying respawn rooms are the answer, but I could think of a lots of different ways to deal with it. Some would even be fun and refreshing. But anyway, getting off topic...
BTW I'm still fairly new, but not exactly the gold standard for new players. Still for my play style honestly I think the FAMAS with SP suits me best so far. With SP even at long range it can kill in one burst without a headshot. Or kill in just two bullets if at least one of them is a headshot. It's also fairly accurate and since it burst fires the kick is basically nullified between bursts. It's a great long range AR. I haven't got the M16 yet, but I will probably love it. It's actually not bad at close range either. At close range it's a 2 shot kill with SP. That's a tad overkill considering it's going to fire the third shot anyway. On the other hand it's good if one of your shots misses due to battle conditions and even if you don't miss it does kill them slightly quicker. (Though I still would only recommend SP for the FAMAS for long range.)
BTW it will not OHK so there's no reason to aim for the head at close range if you use SP. If you don't use SP that could be different. It takes the full 3 shot burst to kill without SP and no head shots. If you only get one headshot it still takes all 3 to kill, but a headshot and body shot will be very close. That ain't worth a kill, but getting hit for 96 damage tends to jack with people quite a bit and they may not have been at full health to begin with. Two headshots of course, will kill. So if you use SP then aim for centermass up close as there's no benefit. But if you don't use SP headshots could be good. You might not aim strait for the head since you could miss completely, but you could aim a little high just in case the kick gets some.
On the other hand it can be good to aim low if you take damage since that kicks up.
Anyway the point is, where the FAMAS is weak isn't so much in a close quarters 1 on 1, but when you have a group. If you have 3 guys charging you then you will really wish you could spray.
I find ADS snapping targets to be more effective with it than just staying in sights, and more effective than ADS snapping with full auto guns that you can just hold the trigger down and walk. With the FAMAS I will often ADS, burst, burst, ADS... I'm not sure it's a good tactic, but it's worked for me. Use that snap. It's not perfect, but it helps.
I also think the heartbeat sensor is great for new players. I'm addicted to them. >,> Thermal is cool, though a bit slow to ADS.
I'm thinking I might actually try thermal with a silencer on my FAMAS with SP so it 1 burst kills at long range. SP then pretty effectively mitigates the silencer and if I'm engaging at long range anyway I'm already getting the lower damage so I might as well use a silencer. Though for short range slight of hand pro would be better used with the thermal than a silencer.
Anyway... I don't think the TAR is very noob friendly, but I'm about to start on it's challenges, and the M4 that I skipped. The SCAR-H is okay and might be more noob friendly than the FAMAS for most people.
For me the FAMAS is pretty damn cool. It's my AR sniper gun since I don't have the FAL, though I might aught to try the LMG's for that.
The sniper rifles I can't get the hang of. Scoping takes too gorram long and you are never really safe tactical loitering. I tend to die or get no kills because I'm so far from the action there's nobody to kill. Mebbe now that I have slight of hand pro, or mebbe if I unlocked an acog... I'm still learning the maps, though. I'm not confident enough to snipe it's very very different from my days in TFC sniping with that giant red dot. ;p
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Post by chyros on Dec 2, 2009 19:59:16 GMT -5
SCAR w/ grenade launcher Model 1887 Akimbo Semtex Scavenger Stopping Power Steady Aim Painkiller Swap Scav for SoH and I couldn't have put it any better.
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Post by ssog on Dec 2, 2009 21:49:25 GMT -5
As for hardline I'm a bit split on it. I love the idea of getting my rewards easier. I love them, but it's hard for me to get my rewards. I tend to have a hard time getting more than just the UAV, which gets old and boring. Yes it's useful, but it's neither fun nor sexy like the others. Hell just the way the game respawns works against you since you can't ever really know the game won't respawn someone right behind you, which I loath! (I often miss the respawn rooms from TFC.) Hardline definitely benefits people with smaller kill streaks more than those with bigger ones. For example if you've already got 6 kills the benefit of 1 kill isn't as big as the difference between 2 and 3. And getting care packages at 3 kills rather than four is quite cool. Personally I think it would be nice to have hardline as a death streak reward instead, though. Compared to CB and SP it does seem a tad under powered. But that all depends. If your strategy relies heavily on your kill streak rewards, using lower ones to unlock higher ones and such, then that one kill could mean the difference between getting a reward that opens up the AC130 or chopper gunner for you. And that has the potential to push your K/D ratio way up. The other part of that which is good for new players is that while it takes skill to really make the KS rewards really count, it doesn't take that much skill to get some kills and have some fun with them, and that can be a huge refreshment from getting knifed and shot in the back every 30 seconds. (The knife attack and bad respaws are probably the most frustrating things for new players. In fact I rather wish the knife was only a 1HK from behind sometimes.) Unfortunately the death streak rewards do not give the same kind of change of pace and quick respite from the action that kill streaks do. And those are precisely the players that need a break to cool off and not throw the controller into the garbage disposal. Hence why I'd really like to see Hardline as a death streak. It would give you a motivation to get back into the fight. Martyrdom is somewhat satisfying, but it won't be effective for much longer. I remember it as a perk in W@W and everyone just learned to avoid the dropped 'nades. I think the MW2 community hasn't quite got the knack since it's a death streak now instead and not too common (was everywhere for a while in W@W) and there are still a lot of new players. But that will probably wear off. Final stand gives you a second chance, but against experienced players it's almost worthless, they just keep shooting and finish you off before you can do much. Again that's one that get's less useful the more experienced the community gets. I also dislike Painkiller. It is only good for two things, bad respawns, and rushing the enemy. The duration is just too short. So if you're playstyle is more careful and long range or stealthy it's completely useless. That one I think should not start the timer until you take your first hit, though perhaps have an even shorter timer. That way you would still get some benefit even if you aren't a run 'n gunner. I suppose copycat is okay, but I don't much like it for the same reason I seldom use the premade classes. I like to tweak every detail on my classes, which is also the only way I can familiarize myself with them. If I use the premade classes I forget what's what or regret that it has X perk instead of Y, and with Copycat I have that as well as the fact that I only have a few seconds to see the enemy's class and decide whether I want it or not, and I've usually hit X and respawned in frustration by then anyway. Painkiller and Final Stand are both marvelous death streak rewards. Final Stand works better on large maps or when you're sticking to cover, because then even if someone puts you down there's no guarantee they can finish you (and, since you've got your whole loadout, you can certainly make things more difficult for them). It's also great when you're playing with friends and working in 2-man cells, because your partner will usually take out the guy that put you down and then you just wait the 7-10 seconds until you're back up again. Painkiller is phenomenal on smaller maps, you just have to be very aggressive once you get it. Generally, getting painkiller means an immediate end to my deathstreak, because I'll just rush the other team. Having three times as much life as the other guy = win. As for the rest of your post... SP is definitely great on the FAMAS. It's also great on the AUG. There are a few guns that really, really benefit from SP. On the other hand, there are several guns that get almost no benefit from SP whatsoever (the FAL, the UMP). I'm just talking about the 80% of the guns in the game that are not abnormally affected by SP one way or the other.
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i8
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Post by i8 on Dec 2, 2009 22:35:04 GMT -5
all guns are made extremely effective by stopping power unless the base damage ends in a 5 or is 50
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Post by mw0swedeking on Dec 3, 2009 0:04:55 GMT -5
Don't use Stopping Power right away! It's really tempting, but don't. You will become dependent on it, and it will be worse for you in the long run.
The exceptions are the snipers and the FaM16, then it's acceptable.
I would recommend Cold blooded, because getting killed by killstreaks is really frustrating, but that has an annoyingly high unlock (which is really making me not want to prestige). Gametypes, FFA is pretty good, just keep circling the map, you'll learn it pretty quick. Headquarters is pretty good because you know where people are going. Don't you dare play Hide and Seek... er, Search and Destroy. No respawns will lead to unbearable frustration.
One more thing, I'm pretty sure the guns do not Snap to targets in Multiplayer. You get aim assist, but Snapping to targets + snipers/shotguns/fam16 would be super stupid.
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Post by ssog on Dec 3, 2009 5:12:13 GMT -5
all guns are made extremely effective by stopping power unless the base damage ends in a 5 or is 50 Nope. A silenced P90, for instance, will go from a 5 bullet kill to a 4 bullet kill 85% of the time. That's not "extremely affected". That's actually a pretty minor difference- if you can land 4 shots, then the 5th shot should be an absolute walk in the park, especially since the other guy is having his sights kicked all over the place as you shoot him. Any time a gun goes from a 2 shot kill to a 1 shot kill, or from a 3 shot kill to a 2 shot kill, that's a major effect. Taking a gun from a 4 shot kill to a 3 shot kill or from a 5 shot kill to a 4 shot kill is a much smaller effect.
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Post by imrlybord7 on Dec 3, 2009 19:29:20 GMT -5
ssog, you also have to take ROF into account. High ROF weapons are less affected by SP in terms of TTK.
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Post by Orske on Dec 4, 2009 22:30:54 GMT -5
These posts helped big time. Im actually getting pretty good. I finally got my mic in the mail feel free to add me if you on xbox live gamer tag is: orske I'll help you lose a few games
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toysrme
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Post by toysrme on Dec 7, 2009 5:14:35 GMT -5
im so walking a pair of newb players through objective gametypes right now and they're going .75-1.25 through the games (VS around .5) by having them whore m4/scar/acr+HBS+tube + AA-12 (or at4/stinger when air support comes). bling+stopping power+steady aim
the tube & HBS make all the difference in the world in making them useful players as they get a better idea where the other sloppy players are (noone there level takes ninja...) AND the ability to tube into danger/hotspots instead of trying to engage players who are faster & more accurate.
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i8
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Post by i8 on Dec 7, 2009 7:01:05 GMT -5
notice the stopping power on that class tehe
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