MW2 TTK + More Chart

[zeebo]

I've updated the chart.
cod-stats.webs.com/mw2.htm

If you have any additional ideas on anything to add, please post and lemme know!

Also, feel free to criticize any problems I may have made; I'll work to update everything and develop a functional chart.

Thanks, Z.

[xenon]

FAMAS is a burst weapon. no stopping power and extreme range = 4 bullets (unless third bullet is a head shot). delay alone between bursts are 0.32 seconds.

"TTK Max" = 0.1950 seconds must be wrong.

[zeebo]

Dec 22, 2009 18:38:27 GMT -5 xenon said:

FAMAS is a burst weapon. no stopping power and extreme range = 4 bullets (unless third bullet is a head shot). delay alone between bursts are 0.32 seconds.

"TTK Max" = 0.1950 seconds must be wrong.

Alright, thanks! I somehow missed that, the M16 and the M93R.

Am I correct by saying the "real" formula is (BTK-1)*(60/ROF)+0.32 ?
I assume this is correct because the first bullet appears immediately, therefore BTK-1. Multiply that by the number of succeeding bullets to finish the time for that burst. Then a waiting time of 0.32 until the next burst, but the first bullet appears immediately; therefore, there is no need to multiply by 60/ROF again.

[vaari90]

Yes, it appears that would be the case. So the TTK max would be a ghastly 0.45?

[Den]

Shot Wait Shot Wait Shot Wait Delay Shot
.065 + .065 + .065 + .2 = .395

[zeebo]

Dec 22, 2009 19:01:06 GMT -5 vaari90 said:

Yes, it appears that would be the case. So the TTK max would be a ghastly 0.45?

Hm, well, I'll use Den's firetime of 0.65.

So... ((0.650*(4.00-1.00))+0.320) = 0.515

Dec 22, 2009 19:04:29 GMT -5 Den said:

Shot Wait Shot Wait Shot Wait Delay Shot
.065 + .065 + .065 + .2 = .395

Is the wait 0.2 or 0.32?

[gus]

denkirson.xanga.com/715966769/modern-warfare-2/

The wait time between bursts for the FAMAS, M16 and M93R is still 0.2 seconds.
It is possible, though, that they may have their own individual burst wait times now.

I'm confused, though. It says the wait time for all of them is .2 seconds, then it says they could be different?

[ilikev8]

You should add in SMG's TTK WITH rapid fire and akimbo.

[zeebo]

Dec 22, 2009 21:50:40 GMT -5 ilikev8 said:

You should add in SMG's TTK WITH rapid fire and akimbo.

Could anyone provide a quick number that ROF is multiplied by while using rapid fire?

Also, the formula for Akimbo should be...
(ROUNDUP((BTK-2)/2)*(60/ROF)
Bullets to kill -2 divided by 2. In case of decimal, round up to nearest whole, then multiply that by 60 divided by rate of fire.

Correct?

[zeebo]

Updated with akimbo, rapid fire, and other small details.
cod-stats.webs.com/mw2.htm

[gus]

Cool, thanks.

[toad]

Great chart, thank you.

[xenon]

Rapid Fire:

RoF x1.33 [or time between shots x0.75 - same thing].

TTK with rapid fire = TTK without rapid fire x0.75

Rapid fire screw up recoil, which does not matter while you hip fire (so TTK-numbers are a true 33% better with rapid fire at close range). However, on distance where you use ADS, Rapid Fire will actually increase TTK (a bad thing(tm)) - not reduce it.


Akimbo:

For average RPM you could say RoF x2.00 [or time between shots x0.50 - same thing]. However, first two bullets (if they hit) will be at time stamp 0.000 sec. third and fourth bullet will be at same time stamp as the second bullet would have without akimbo. More accurate way is to use the normal RoF but divide number of bullets to kill by 2 (rounded up). Also note that akimbo SMGs have a huge reticle and will not hit with as many bullets as ADS or hip-fire with a single SMG - unless maybe you are at point blank knife range. At distance where you would need ADS akimbo will actually increase TTK to the point to where you at extreme range would empty both clips and still not hit your target.



TTK for burst weapons:

Divide average RPM (the number of rounds a weapon fire during 60 seconds) by 3 and you get avg number of burst cycles (including delay) per minute.

60 seconds divided by avg number of burst cycles (including delay) give you time in seconds for one burst cycle (including delay).

subtract time between bursts and you get the time it take to fire three bullets.

divide this number by three and you get the time it take to fire one bullet. (60 divided by time it take to fire one bullet and you get RPM when not counting dealys)

TTK for 2 bullets = time to fire one bullet
TTK for 3 bullets = time to fire two bullets
TTK for 4 bullets = time to fire two bullets + delay

according to this page:
denkirson.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=430
M16A4 have an average RPM of 468.75 and only a 0.28 sec delay between bursts. FAMAS have an average RPM of 428.67 but got a 0.32 sec delay between bursts which means FAMAS fire the three bullets faster than M16 but M16 have a higher average RPM. Raffie have an average RPM of 454.55 and 0.32 sec delay.

FAMAS that would give a TTK of:
2 bullets = 0,0333 sec (first bullet is at time stamp 0,0000)
3 bullets = 0,0666 sec
4 bullets = 0,3866 sec
and an average RPM during bursts (not counting delay between bursts) of 1800 rounds per minute(!)

For M16A4 the same gives:
2 bullets = 0,0347
3 bullets = 0,0693
4 bullets = 0,3493
and an average RPM during bursts (not counting delay between bursts) of 1730 rounds per minute(!)

[With reservations of raw data not being correct]

[mannon]

I think den's firetime and delay on the M16 and FAMAS could be correct. Firing them both together in split screen the bursts actually seem identical. That's obviously not a very good testing method, but I would still expect to be able to tell the difference after a whole clip of firing.

I should also mention that it seems to me that after you fire a burst if you pull the trigger during the delay it will still fire the next burst. In fact it may allow you to buffer the trigger pull even during the firing of the first burst. I was not able to find a timing that did not fire two bursts with an xbox controller. On PC of course you could much more quickly and accurately test this, especially with a script.

Trying to spam the trigger to achieve the maximum fire rate seems to work okay for a few bursts but then it gets more difficult because if the game does buffer the trigger pull until the next burst can be fired it seems to only do it for the length of one burst and delay cycle.

I sort of secretly still hope that the two have slightly different firetimes and delays, but I think that even the testing that shows them as different puts their times close enough that it is conceivably within the margin of error.

In my split screen testing I reversed the triggers on one controller, put them together, and pushed both triggers with the same finger to elimitate as best I could any difference in timing. Obviously these are analog triggers and it's not possible to calibrate them or verify that they are manufactured with any uniformity, however the bursts fired when both triggers were pulled did sound to be pretty well in sync. More importantly when the triggers were spammed together the subsequent bursts which should have been fired as soon as possible because the trigger was pulled before the dalay, also seemed to be in perfect sync with each other. Obviously I cannot measure tenths and hundredths of a second with human ears and eyes, but humans are pretty good at detecting patterns and changes in patterns and a desynchronizing of the bursts should be detectable.

I'm still willing to believe either version given better data, but for the moment I'm more inclined to trust Den's testing methods.

[acidsnow]

My anti-virus program STOPzilla has prevented me from visiting your link.

[zeebo]

Dec 23, 2009 8:49:59 GMT -5 acidsnow said:

My anti-virus program STOPzilla has prevented me from visiting your link.

Hmm... I'll also try hosting the chart somewhere else.

[xenon]

Dec 23, 2009 7:34:37 GMT -5 mannon said:

I think den's firetime and delay on the M16 and FAMAS could be correct. Firing them both together in split screen the bursts actually seem identical.

Then again, you would probably not notice if time between rounds of of the two guns were for example 0,02 seconds faster and time between bursts were for example 0,04 seconds slower (as all individual bursts from both weapons would then start at the same time stamp).

Shrug.