probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Feb 17, 2015 1:57:57 GMT -5
 Notes- Each plot represents 1000 simulations of the weapon being fired:
- For "normal" weapons, each simulation represents a 15-round burst (or fewer if the weapon has a lower capacity). Shots 1 - 3 are in blue, shots 4 - 6 are in green, shots 7 - 9 are in yellow, shots 10 - 12 are in orange, and shots 13 - 15 are in red.
- For energy weapons that overheat, each simulation represents the weapon being fired until either a complete overheat occurs or 2 seconds pass, whichever occurs first. Shots fired at 0 - 20% heat are in blue, 20 - 40% are in green, 40 - 60% are in yellow, 60 - 80% shots are in orange, and 80 - 100% shots are in red.
- For energy weapons that never overheat and always reach the 2-second limit (e.g., Ripped Energy Turret), shots fired at 0 - 0.4s are in blue, 0.4 - 0.8s are in green, 0.8 - 1.2s are in yellow, 1.2 - 1.6s are in orange, and 1.6 - 2.0s are in red.
Grid lines are spaced one degree apart on all plots - this is so you can directly compare them - and the axes indicating zero degrees are drawn in yellow.
- Only attachment combinations which materially affect ViewKick, GunKick (while ADS) and fireTime are included.
- "Included" attachments are not regarded as attachments here; their effect on accuracy is incorporated into the corresponding variant.
- For semi-automatic weapons, the firerate is assumed to be either the firecap itself or 625 RPM, whichever is lower.
- For the burst-fire weapons, the actual delay between the last shot of the previous burst and the next shot is assumed to be the greater of the following:
- 0.096 seconds, less the time since the last trigger pull (assumes the player cannot consistently pull the trigger faster than 625 RPM, the same assumption made for semi-automatic weapons), or
- The actual burst delay of the weapon plus its fireTime.
- The inaccuracy score stated in each plot is a measure of how far from the origin (in degrees) the weapon will take on average over each simulation, not necessarily the "size" of the plot. Lower is better, with zero being a perfect score.
Plots Sorted By WeaponAssault Rifles
Submachine Guns
Heavy Weapons
Sniper Rifles
Shotguns
Pistols
Specials
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Post by zimpoo on Feb 17, 2015 13:58:02 GMT -5
Is there a unit to inaccuracy ? Also, would you explain how you drew those plots ? (I'd understand if you don't want to  ) |
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Feb 17, 2015 14:07:10 GMT -5
Is there a unit to inaccuracy ? Also, would you explain how you drew those plots ? (I'd understand if you don't want to ) Inaccuracy is measured in degrees. (I'll add that to the Notes.) Basically, I wrote a script in Mathematica that I run a spreadsheet though containing all the weapons and relevant attachment/variant combinations. Then I upload them by hand to imgur and link them here. |
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Post by noscreenname on Feb 17, 2015 14:09:39 GMT -5
Good doggie. Thanks bro.
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Post by zimpoo on Feb 17, 2015 17:02:05 GMT -5
Is there a unit to inaccuracy ? Also, would you explain how you drew those plots ? (I'd understand if you don't want to ) Inaccuracy is measured in degrees. (I'll add that to the Notes.) Basically, I wrote a script in Mathematica that I run a spreadsheet though containing all the weapons and relevant attachment/variant combinations. Then I upload them by hand to imgur and link them here. Wow, very interesting ! Many thanks  |
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Post by pupilofcod on Feb 20, 2015 15:01:59 GMT -5
Thanks for doing this Probaddie, you da DOG!
Your plots make it really easy to see why BAL and ASM are fan favorites, the easily accommodating vertical recoil and high fire rates work very well with the movement and pace of the game. Has there ever been a buff or nerf where the recoil pattern itself has changed in COD, or just the magnitude of the pattern? For example the FNG9 nerf from MW3 where they were given recoil. I'm asking because without a recoil pattern change I think the ASM and BAL will continue to be top tier through the next balance pass simply because increasing the vertical recoil alone on them will only cause players to counter by aiming down more. The guns that have non uniform recoil patterns will still be more difficult to aim with despite the damage increases they may get. And by the way your SN6 plots sadden me greatly....sigh SHG.
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Feb 21, 2015 4:50:05 GMT -5
Thanks for doing this Probaddie, you da DOG! Your plots make it really easy to see why BAL and ASM are fan favorites, the easily accommodating vertical recoil and high fire rates work very well with the movement and pace of the game. Has there ever been a buff or nerf where the recoil pattern itself has changed in COD, or just the magnitude of the pattern? For example the FNG9 nerf from MW3 where they were given recoil. I'm asking because without a recoil pattern change I think the ASM and BAL will continue to be top tier through the next balance pass simply because increasing the vertical recoil alone on them will only cause players to counter by aiming down more. The guns that have non uniform recoil patterns will still be more difficult to aim with despite the damage increases they may get. And by the way your SN6 plots sadden me greatly....sigh SHG. First, I can't really comment on the FMG9 nerf you're referring to. The only one we have any direct knowledge about is the one where the Akimbo version had its fireTime increased (eventually). Second, strictly speaking, every recoil change has changed the recoil profile of the weapon in question, at least in some slight way. This is because you have to doctor the numbers in a very specific manner to get the "pattern" to scale linearly. Doing anything else will technically alter the recoil in a way that does not preserve the original pattern, though in a slight way. So to answer your question: I can't come up with an example where just the magnitude was increased/decreased and the overall pattern conserved. |
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Post by pupilofcod on Feb 22, 2015 3:10:02 GMT -5
I think I had that FMG change mixed up, thanks for the clarification.
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
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Post by probaddie on Feb 23, 2015 15:18:08 GMT -5
I just finished re-uploading plots due to an error in my plotting code that affected fireTimes. All plots that were affected have been revised.
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
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Post by probaddie on Feb 24, 2015 15:59:41 GMT -5
Heavy Weapon and Sniper Rifle plots have been updated with plots for crouching and prone positions.
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probaddie
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You're triggering my intelligence
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Post by probaddie on Feb 24, 2015 18:42:38 GMT -5
So apparently Heavy Weapons do not receive any recoil reduction in Advanced Warfare, despite the existence of a script in the game (from Modern Warfare 3) that confers a benefit to LMGs. The reason for this is because the game differentiates Heavy Weapons (weapon_heavy) from LMGs (weapon_lmg). I have tweeted Michael Condrey about this in the hopes that it is a bug; meanwhile, the plots showing stance differences will remain until the upcoming patch. If no change is made then, I will re-upload (sigh) the Heavy Weapon plots.
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Post by thewhitetestament on Feb 25, 2015 10:37:21 GMT -5
So apparently Heavy Weapons do not receive any recoil reduction in Advanced Warfare, despite the existence of a script in the game (from Modern Warfare 3) that confers a benefit to LMGs. The reason for this is because the game differentiates Heavy Weapons (weapon_heavy) from LMGs (weapon_lmg). I have tweeted Michael Condrey about this in the hopes that it is a bug; meanwhile, the plots showing stance differences will remain until the upcoming patch. If no change is made then, I will re-upload (sigh) the Heavy Weapon plots. Can you elaborate on what this means? You say they do not receive any recoil reduction, but in your plots you show that, the Ameli for example, receives a recoil reduction with Grip and/or going prone. |
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Post by thewhitetestament on Feb 25, 2015 10:44:32 GMT -5
His plots utilize a program that he inputs data into himself. They account for the recoil reduction which doesnt happen in game. So am I correct to assume that, based on this thread, the Grip does absolutely nothing to reduce the recoil for the Ameli (or, of course, all Heavy Weapons)? Black Ops 2 all over again! I'm on the PS4 and the Placebo effect must be sky high if this is the case. I swear I see a huge visual recoil reduction with both the Ameli and the EM1 with the Grip attachment. |
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Post by thewhitetestament on Feb 25, 2015 10:53:40 GMT -5
I feel like he was only referring to the prone bonus. Hmm... okay, now that I could attest to. The Ameli is my favored weapon (max prestige now, so ample usage) and I can certainly say I do not ever recall seeing a noticeable decrease in recoil when going prone with the Ameli. I remember the recoil being almost non-existent in prior games when doing this with the LMGs. |
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Post by Megaqwerty on Feb 25, 2015 11:04:01 GMT -5
The reason for this is because the game differentiates Heavy Weapons (weapon_heavy) from LMGs (weapon_lmg). These guys are a bunch of fucking idiots. |
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Feb 25, 2015 11:06:06 GMT -5
I feel like he was only referring to the prone bonus. Yeah, I forgot to put the word "stance" in there. Crouching and proning do not give a recoil reduction to heavy weapons. |
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Feb 25, 2015 11:16:43 GMT -5
Is there anything else that differentiates them from lmgs? Maybe they intended to not include the prone bonus but wanted to make it easy to implement if need be. Not that I know of. It's also possible they reclassified them as heavy weapons because the EM1 and EPM3 can't rightly be called "machine" guns (in the usual sense of the word) but overlooked this consequence. My money is on that theory. |
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Post by ChloeB42 (Alexcalibur42) on Feb 25, 2015 11:20:25 GMT -5
Maybe they just forgot they reclassified LMGs and/or just didn't remove the old code because it didn't affect anything. Hopefully it's the former and they change it.
EDIT: Probaddie beat me to the punch.
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Feb 26, 2015 14:47:48 GMT -5
The plots were revised yet again to fix a bug with variable firetime weapons. Also, the delay between bursts for burst-fire weapons is now properly frame-bound.
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lllRL
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Post by lllRL on Feb 27, 2015 0:55:34 GMT -5
The SN6 variants with -10% viewkick (Money/Jury/Magistrate) have higher inaccuracy scores than the base SN6?
Wut.
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lllRL
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Post by lllRL on Feb 27, 2015 1:01:24 GMT -5
Oh I almost forgot... does anyone know why the HBRa3 (without grip) has identical recoil + centerspeed numbers to the AN94 from BO2, yet the HBR seems to deviate away from its original firing point faster, despite the two having virtually identical fire rates (ignoring the quirky fire time decrease on the first few shots)? I only ever really use the AN94 when I play BO2, and the nice, controllable recoil is one of the reasons why. Strange, or maybe I'm just missing something :/
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Feb 27, 2015 5:04:13 GMT -5
The SN6 variants with -10% viewkick (Money/Jury/Magistrate) have higher inaccuracy scores than the base SN6? Wut. I bungled the fireTime multipliers for those variants. I uploaded fixed plots. Should be all good now. |
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Feb 27, 2015 11:05:26 GMT -5
The plots were revised yet again to fix a bug with variable firetime weapons; Rapid Fire was incorrectly being applied to the intro firetime for variable firerate weapons. Also, the HBRa3 was revised due to a recent discovery by Marvel4: it also linearly interpolates its fireTime, similar to the ASM1.
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lllRL
True Bro
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Post by lllRL on Feb 27, 2015 12:55:38 GMT -5
The SN6 variants with -10% viewkick (Money/Jury/Magistrate) have higher inaccuracy scores than the base SN6? Wut. I bungled the fireTime multipliers for those variants. I uploaded fixed plots. Should be all good now. Ah gotcha, thanks. The fire rate change on the SN6 is fairly minor so I just assumed that was posted about for the ASM1/Bal etc. |
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Feb 28, 2015 21:39:40 GMT -5
I've created a spreadsheet that measures inaccuracy scores for all weapons using 10,000 simulations. You can find it here; there is also a link in my recoil statistics thread. |
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Mar 4, 2015 14:47:54 GMT -5
A major update has been applied to the plots: - New plots reflecting the updates to the MK14, AMS1, SN6, AMR9, Lynx and S-12 have been added
- The EPM3 plots had an error that has now been fixed (they used the old CenterSpeed of 800 instead of 1500)
- Plots for the Ohm have been added. As of now, I only have statistics on the default (Heavy) mode.
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Mar 8, 2015 7:06:39 GMT -5
Plots for the Ohm in Shotgun Mode have been added.
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Post by ninopettis on Mar 13, 2015 5:07:32 GMT -5
- The inaccuracy score stated in each plot is a measure of how far from the origin (in degrees) the weapon will take on average over each simulation, not necessarily the "size" of the plot. Lower is better, with zero being a perfect score.
Would it be possible to generate two different inaccuracy scores; one for degrees of vertical recoil and one for degrees of horizontical recoil? Does that even make sense? Would it be a lot of work? The reason I ask is because I was comparing the base SMGs against each other. The SN6 has a low score, the ASM has a high score, and the KF5 and MP11 are both in the middle. Yet, the ASM's recoil might be preferable due to having more verticality than the others, making it easier to control. |
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probaddie
True Bro
You're triggering my intelligence
Posts: 11,043
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Post by probaddie on Mar 15, 2015 17:09:58 GMT -5
- The inaccuracy score stated in each plot is a measure of how far from the origin (in degrees) the weapon will take on average over each simulation, not necessarily the "size" of the plot. Lower is better, with zero being a perfect score.
Would it be possible to generate two different inaccuracy scores; one for degrees of vertical recoil and one for degrees of horizontical recoil? Does that even make sense? Would it be a lot of work? The reason I ask is because I was comparing the base SMGs against each other. The SN6 has a low score, the ASM has a high score, and the KF5 and MP11 are both in the middle. Yet, the ASM's recoil might be preferable due to having more verticality than the others, making it easier to control. Doing this for the recoil plots just isn't in the cards; it would require me to re-upload everything. I may try something you'll like and upload it in a spreadsheet. Back when I did just the recoil scores, I published a set that had a vertical bias in them that reduced the impact that vertical recoil contributed to the final score of each weapon. I'll see what I can rig up tomorrow. |
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Post by ninopettis on Mar 17, 2015 1:27:27 GMT -5
Would it be possible to generate two different inaccuracy scores; one for degrees of vertical recoil and one for degrees of horizontical recoil? Does that even make sense? Would it be a lot of work? The reason I ask is because I was comparing the base SMGs against each other. The SN6 has a low score, the ASM has a high score, and the KF5 and MP11 are both in the middle. Yet, the ASM's recoil might be preferable due to having more verticality than the others, making it easier to control. Doing this for the recoil plots just isn't in the cards; it would require me to re-upload everything. I may try something you'll like and upload it in a spreadsheet. Back when I did just the recoil scores, I published a set that had a vertical bias in them that reduced the impact that vertical recoil contributed to the final score of each weapon. I'll see what I can rig up tomorrow. Nice, that sounds good, thanks. |
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