3/28 WRT

[markopolo]

Nightfall: The Nexus
Ishtar Sink, Venus The Vex world-eating machine below the Academy has reawakened. Descend and dismantle the Mind that controls it.
Modifiers
Epic - Heavily shielded and highly aggressive enemies appear in great numbers.
Arc Burn - Arc Damage from any source is greatly increased.
Specialist - Special Weapon damage is favored.
Juggler - No ammo drops for your equipped weapon.
Ironclad - More enemies have shields.
Heroic Strike Playlist
Modifiers
Heroic - Enemies appear in greater numbers and are more aggressive.
Arc Burn - Arc Damage from any source is greatly increased.
Specialist - Special Weapon damage is favored.
Juggler - No ammo drops for your equipped weapon.
Vendor Planetary Material Exchange
Eris Morn - Hadium
Future War Cult - Wormspore
Dead Orbit - Wormspore
New Monarchy - Wormspore
Raid Challenge Mode: Aksis
Crucible Playlists:
Zone Control
Pending Data from Tower...
Challenge of Elders
Modifiers
Berserk - Minions of the Darkness won't flinch, even after massive damage.
Chaff - Player radar is disabled.
Melee Kill Bonus - Melee kills are worth more points.
Round Boss Enemy Race
1 Pilot Servitor Fallen
2 Val Aru'un Cabal
3 Overmind Minotaur Vex
Bounties
Name Description
Impressive Performance Earn points in Challenge of the Elders
Light Show With your Fireteam, generate Orbs of Light in Level 41 Prison of Elders or Challenge of the Elders.
Shock Trooper Use Arc abilities to kill enemies in Level 41 Prison of Elders or Challenge of the Elders.
Iron Lord Artifacts

Name Primary Talent
Memory of Silimar In the Crucible, resistance to damage-over-time attacks is greatly increased.
Memory of Skorri When your super is full, nearby allies' supers recharge faster.
Memory of Jolder Removes sprint cooldown penalty.
Shiro-4 Vanguard Scout Bounties

Name Description
Crushing Blows Use the Iron Battle Axe or powerful enemy weapons to decimate hostile threats.
Together We Rise Complete Public Events in the Plaguelands.
Stay Down Defeat Fallen.
Archon's Forge: Captains Complete Captain encounters in the Archon's Forge.
Titan Vanguard Bounties

Name Description
Strike Elite Earn "Gold Tier Achieved", "Silver Tier Achieved", or "Bronze Tier Achieved" Medals.
Sunrise Earn a Gold Tier Achieved Medal in the Nightfall before time expires.
Merciless Get 9 rapid enemy kills to earn "Rampage" Medals in SIVA Crisis Strikes.

[markopolo]

Logged in, got to rank 4, logged out. Cya until Destiny 2 or they backtrack and decide to give us more vaultspace to put all the cool shit they released

[TheHawkNY]

Nah, come back. Next week is VoG.

[qupie]

You don't really need vault space though. The raid primaries are exotic, so only the special heavys need to be in your vault.

This is easily the most fun time in destiny since WoTM was released.

Crota was a blast to play again. It was always a pretty good experience imho, but they made it way better now.

[TheHawkNY]

Apr 3, 2017 6:48:23 GMT -5 qupie said:

You don't really need vault space though. The raid primaries are exotic, so only the special heavys need to be in your vault.

This is easily the most fun time in destiny since WoTM was released.

Crota was a blast to play again. It was always a pretty good experience imho, but they made it way better now.

I agree, Crota is much improved. The Abyss isn't what I would call difficult, but it's a little more challenging now. The bridge encounter is much improved - I found it really annoying how people insisted on cheesing it before, even when it was clearly taking longer than just doing it legitimately. Now you just do it. Ir Yut challenge mode is an action-packed 2 minutes, and Crota challenge mode at least is not just watching one person use the sword.

[markopolo]

Apr 3, 2017 6:48:23 GMT -5 qupie said:

You don't really need vault space though. The raid primaries are exotic, so only the special heavys need to be in your vault.

That's good; I don't have any. Furthermore, I am a man of my word: I said I'd stop if this update didn't bring increased vault space. I'm like that. Ask TheHawkNY: I got a Monte Carlo before him and told him that I wouldn't use it until he got one. And it stayed there for months.

No vault space increase is just bull$hit; they don't have the legacy console excuse anymore. Whatever. I'm sticking to my word on this one. Besides, it'll be good for me to get ready for September. Right now, I have no reason to play and even if I did, I have no space to put the cool gear that I have. I grinded hard to get to T12 in 8 different setups and without vault space, I have little to no desire to delete those for raid gear that, if history has taught me anything, will get me to tier 10 because the rolls will be so incredibly trash.

Apr 3, 2017 6:48:23 GMT -5 qupie said:

This is easily the most fun time in destiny since WoTM was released.

.... meh.

Apr 3, 2017 6:48:23 GMT -5 qupie said:

Crota was a blast to play again. It was always a pretty good experience imho, but they made it way better now.

All Crota does is bring me back to the days when people would say "Dude... wtf are you sniping Crota? What? Really? You don't have a Ballerhorn? I don't believe you... Dude... I just deleted my 7th"

[markopolo]

Crota doesn't seem too hard, btw....

[TheHawkNY]

markopolo For Ir Yut challenge mode, you can get a Swordbearer to spawn, kill him, he drops a sword (kill her with it to complete challenge mode). They left the sword there instead of picking it up, started the Crota encounter, then picked it up so they had 2 swords. Then it was just stacking damage buffs.

[markopolo]

I assumed there was more than met the eye on this one

[qupie]

Wow that is quite impressive... I was wondering how you could possibly fill the vault up. As I personally have 0 problems with the current 3 page vualt, I even have a complete weapons page empty. I think a vault shouldn't be endless in the first place personally.

In hindsight I am glad I never started that T12 grind though. I am having fun with the raids again for a couple of weeks and then the destiny 1 disk will forever stay out of my PS4. No regrets though, it was one hell of a ride. 1214 hours www.wastedondestiny.com/playstation/mrqupie

I personally love this update, minimum effort, maximum fun for the raiders, which is in all honestly, the only thing this game really really shines in. But I guess you were never much of a raider.

[markopolo]

Apr 4, 2017 3:29:09 GMT -5 qupie said:

Wow that is quite impressive... I was wondering how you could possibly fill the vault up. As I personally have 0 problems with the current 3 page vualt, I even have a complete weapons page empty. I think a vault shouldn't be endless in the first place personally.

And I'm sure there's people who are far worse off than me

Apr 4, 2017 3:29:09 GMT -5 qupie said:

In hindsight I am glad I never started that T12 grind though. I am having fun with the raids again for a couple of weeks and then the destiny 1 disk will forever stay out of my PS4. No regrets though, it was one hell of a ride. 1214 hours www.wastedondestiny.com/playstation/mrqupie

Pfffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

1214. Top 21%

I'm 1793, top 9%... git on my level, Scrublord.

Though I am no Hawk... he's gotta be top 5% with 2500+ hours by now

Apr 4, 2017 3:29:09 GMT -5 qupie said:

I personally love this update, minimum effort, maximum fun for the raiders, which is in all honestly, the only thing this game really really shines in. But I guess you were never much of a raider.

I raided Kings Fall like a motherf$$ker... and then the LL increase... mercy mercy mercy sweet Lawd and baby jeebus, did Oryx get hellawrekd. Because I had the appropriate gear too. Without Hawk and his crew, I probably never would have touched Crota, as all the LFG sites were "Gjalie or GTFO"

[hebbnh]

Something doesn't add up here. So, T12 on 8 different setups, assuming all pieces are unique and each piece is used only with its corresponding set, and also assuming you have a unique ghost and artifact for each setup, and on top of that assuming only the active setup is in your character's inventory while everything else is stored for some unknown reason (i.e the absolute worst case scenario for vault space). Taking the equipped setup out of the equation, that's 7 armor slots to fill each with 7 unique pieces each, which obviously is 49 armor pieces total. There's room in the vault for 108 pieces, so you haven't even hit the halfway mark in my worst case scenario, which is frankly a ludicrous scenario to begin with. Realistically, all those setups fit just fine in a single character's inventory, and even if you don't want them all on that character, you're putting maybe half in the vault at most. That leaves 80ish spaces free, yeah? You could get 8 T12 setups on 3 different characters and still have vault space left over for basically every exotic in the game. Oh yeah, and ghosts don't even go in the armor vault anyway now that I think about it, so there's some more free space. The real question is WTF is actually in your vault that's taking up all that room? Because it sure as hell isn't only those T12 setups.

[markopolo]

I could trim the fat, if I spent the time to do so. I mainly have a lot of exotic dupes with different stat builds for different setups with perks.

[bradman]

I think a game about collecting things should allow you to collect (and keep) all the things you want.

[snes chalmers]

Oh wow, I only have 655 hours actively played (930 if tower and orbit time is included according to Destiny Status)...feels like more than that.

Puts me at about the top...48% I guess.

[markopolo]

Apr 4, 2017 16:12:49 GMT -5 bradman said:

I think a game about collecting things should allow you to collect (and keep) all the things you want.

The Philosopher King gets it.

I could expect this when the Last Gen was being supported. Now, that excuse is mute

[qupie]

Apr 4, 2017 10:09:06 GMT -5 markopolo said:

I'm 1793, top 9%... git on my level, Scrublord.

Did you even clear all the end game content in all that time, m'lady?

But yeah lol that is quite a lot. I think I played more than you in the first years from what I remember, but dipped out after Oryx challenge modes and only came back for a few weeks with challenge of the elders and VoTM.

Oryx is easily the worse raid to play though imho, almost no fighting and only mechanics. Vault of glass was a blast yesterday. Especially since they patched the cheeses.

Get ready to get wrecked by Templar though.

[TheHawkNY]

2,635, top 3%.

Revised VoG is great. You're missing out if you don't do it. If anyone would like to join, I'll try to assemble a team to get you through.

[markopolo]

Apr 5, 2017 4:05:09 GMT -5 qupie said:

Did you even clear all the end game content in all that time, m'lady?

Yes. I have completed every raid

Apr 5, 2017 4:05:09 GMT -5 qupie said:

Oryx is easily the worse raid to play though imho, almost no fighting and only mechanics.

To me, KF is the best raid in the game. It takes effort, coordination, and most importantly, teamwork where no one gets carried. Everyone has a job to do, everyone has to execute the job, no slackers or someone just sitting in a corner making sure they don't die. I never once got the feeling of accomplishment from the game that I did beating Oryx, except for the one time Hawk and I killed Skolas and difused the bombs with 2 seconds to spare. It's a long raid, that's for sure. But there's a lot more fighting in it, than say WotM

Granted, I didn't do VoG very much (6ish times completed, probably) and I didn't do Crota much more than that (dozen times) but KF HM CM was hellafun. Even the jumping ship puzzle.

[TheHawkNY]

With how the raids have been redone, I think I agree with qupie on this. The coordination, teamwork, and mechanics are fun; but really only for the first few times you do a raid. Mastering the mechanics and finally completing a portion of the raid is really satisfying. But after that, it's just not fun anymore. You're just trying to get through the raid in a reasonable amount of time. At that point, the fun part isn't the jumping puzzle, it's not where you sit there and DPS a boss, and it's not really about the mechanics because doing it correctly no longer feels rewarding.

Ultimately, I like killing enemies. That's the part I find fun. The portions of the raids where you're killing enemies and there is a risk of death are the portions that I actually enjoy playing. Confluxes, Oracles, the Abyss, the Bridge, Vosik; parts where everyone is fighting for their lives, trying to not get overwhelmed by adds. In King's Fall, the adds are nothing more than a shooting gallery. Opening the portal is nothing but to consume time and prevent it from being done without a team like people did with Crota. The same is true with the Gate - yes, you stand there and shoot adds, but it's uninteresting, they're never going to kill you. The adds at Warpriest really aren't challenging, nor are the ones at Golgoroth. Deathsinger and Oryx adds are nothing more than either shooting from inside a bubble within which you're invincible, or sniping them as they spawn. There's nothing particularly thrilling about sniping an ogre as he spawns four times.

It's sad that it took them over two years to fix Crota. It's still not a particularly challenging raid, but it is probably the most fun now.

[markopolo]

I did KF HM with PUG's from reddit fireteams.

You found it boring Hawk, because you play with the same crew over and over and over again. There's comradery, there's predictability, you know what your teammates are going to do. You don't get that with Pugs. Yes, you have to deal with the incompetency, but ultimately, there is a great satisfaction in helping out complete strangers who never have done something, do it.

To each their own

[TheHawkNY]

Apr 5, 2017 15:33:17 GMT -5 markopolo said:

I did KF HM with PUG's from reddit fireteams.

You found it boring Hawk, because you play with the same crew over and over and over again. There's comradery, there's predictability, you know what your teammates are going to do. You don't get that with Pugs. Yes, you have to deal with the incompetency, but ultimately, there is a great satisfaction in helping out complete strangers who never have done something, do it.

To each their own

I've helped my fair share of groups of noobs through the raids. I agree that it's satisfying, but it's because you're going out of your way to basically recreate the experience of first doing the raid. It's not anything inherent in the raid itself. If you had done the same thing with VoG or Crota instead of KF, you'd probably feel more fond of those raids instead. I think everyone has that raid that's special to them for whatever reason, and that's legitimate. VoG will forever hold a special place in my heart from that first weekend we spent over 30 hours and still failed to complete it.

Ultimately, a raid needs to be satisfying in a lot of experiences - your first time, struggling with a group, and running through it smoothly. I can't say which of the raids is the best for the first time, because it's hard to see it through a lens other than your first time, which obviously varies. I'm fine with struggling with mechanics my first time, but I can't say I have much patience for struggling with the mechanics my 10th time doing a raid. I'd much rather be swallowed up by a wave of enemies than wipe because someone's timing was off by a couple of seconds.

Also, have you ever had someone's bombs not detonate for no reason while doing Oryx challenge mode? Had someone miss a jump on the fourth phase? That makes you repeat the past 15 minutes. F that noise.

[qupie]

Yeah Hawk perfectly explains why I found KF kinda boring after ~10 clears. They just went overboard with mechanics and the actual shooting part was mostly gone. Mainly DPS checks and right positioning. Which is also fun, but I play a FPS to shoot stuff.

That is why VoG and WoTM are the best raids for me. Confluxes, oracles, Vosiks and the warmachine were (kind of) challenging even if you knew what to do.

[wings]

Apr 6, 2017 3:36:13 GMT -5 qupie said:

Yeah Hawk perfectly explains why I found KF kinda boring after ~10 clears. They just went overboard with mechanics and the actual shooting part was mostly gone. Mainly DPS checks and right positioning. Which is also fun, but I play a FPS to shoot stuff.

This is probably a result of Bungie trying to attract a broad amount of players so the players' game time spent is in a broad category of games. I tend to find players who have King's Fall as their favourite raid to be more likely to play MMOs and RPGs, while those that prefer Vault of Glass tend to have a shooter background. The mechanics aren't that strong compared to other games and I'd rather they focus on mechanics than extra health on enemies because it's lazy design. If there are little mechanics in a raid, what distinguishes a raid from a strike?

[TheHawkNY]

Apr 7, 2017 12:03:51 GMT -5 wings said:

Apr 6, 2017 3:36:13 GMT -5 qupie said:

Yeah Hawk perfectly explains why I found KF kinda boring after ~10 clears. They just went overboard with mechanics and the actual shooting part was mostly gone. Mainly DPS checks and right positioning. Which is also fun, but I play a FPS to shoot stuff.

This is probably a result of Bungie trying to attract a broad amount of players so the players' game time spent is in a broad category of games. I tend to find players who have King's Fall as their favourite raid to be more likely to play MMOs and RPGs, while those that prefer Vault of Glass tend to have a shooter background. The mechanics aren't that strong compared to other games and I'd rather they focus on mechanics than extra health on enemies because it's lazy design. If there are little mechanics in a raid, what distinguishes a raid from a strike?

I'd say that what separates a raid from a strike (aside from the obvious length and size of group) is that a raid necessitates coordination, where you can make it through a strike no matter how terrible your randoms that you never speak to are.

A fight having mechanics does not mean it does not also have to have adds. But King's Fall is so devoid of adds that it becomes all mechanics. You could probably go through the whole raid shooting only the bosses, not a single bullet at the adds, without being a liability to the rest of your fireteam.

[wings]

Apr 7, 2017 13:22:55 GMT -5 TheHawkNY said:

I'd say that what separates a raid from a strike (aside from the obvious length and size of group) is that a raid necessitates coordination, where you can make it through a strike no matter how terrible your randoms that you never speak to are.

A fight having mechanics does not mean it does not also have to have adds. But King's Fall is so devoid of adds that it becomes all mechanics. You could probably go through the whole raid shooting only the bosses, not a single bullet at the adds, without being a liability to the rest of your fireteam.

Well, I found the Nightfall for Shield Brothers a while back (solar burn, grounded and exposure?) tougher than the Vosik challenge mode during that week. Perhaps that is an exception because of the modifiers.

A lot of the adds aren't particularly dangerous with their AI, with the Hive probably being the least dangerous. I'm not sure how ignoring most adds will be like for King's Fall next week. It will be the first time I've played it since the added sniper flinch, although I kill what is necessary anyway. I can't wait for the salt lords on Reddit and Bungie.net, who cried over getting domed by snipers in Crucible trying to challenge them head-on with weak primaries from afar, fail to clear the adds at Warpriest and getting descoped because they left Acolytes at the boss' platform and moan about it. I do think Vault of Glass has the best blend of mechanics and combat and it's my favourite raid, but I don't think it's mechanic-heavy like a World of Warcraft raid is, if that makes sense.

[qupie]

What is wrong with a conflux stage in between mechanics though? From a design standpoint it doesnt even have to be a lot of work, while it does increase the lenght of the raid. It is a great alternation with the rest of the encounters. Just like the pain in the ass adds at the templar fight last week. That is what I want. The enemies where not even artificially strong (that isn't really a thing anymore anyway imho), but there where plenty and you had to do some mechanics in the meanwhile. I think they learned from Oryx though, as WoTM had some more adds in it, which actually posed a thread every now and then.

I can see your point though in your comparison to WoW. I am a PFS player, and like the loot/raid mechanics in desiny. (opposed to I am no WoW player who like the shooting mechanics in Destiny).

I personally don't care at all about the strike/raid differences. Even if the only differences are that the one is longer with a bigger fireteam I would be completely fine with it. Why should there be a bigger difference anyway?

A strike can be solo'd, and a raid can't. Thats it for me. Coorparation doesn't perse mean 10 mechanics in one fight. Heck, the conflux and oracle phase has pretty much no mechanics, but still needs a lot of coorporation and good callouts.