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Post by brutalonslaught on Apr 23, 2013 14:21:05 GMT -5
Red Dot Sight is immense on certain guns. There's a reason all the pros use it. I'm consistently surprised by the number of people who think that "the irons are fine so I'll use them".
Against shit players its fine but if you're playing good players you need a RDS
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Post by Morshu on Apr 23, 2013 15:23:30 GMT -5
Keep BOps2's Pick 10 system It would need some major tweaking though. The pick 10 system as it is in BO2 restricts just as much as it gives freedom. (Them having to remove pro perks and balance everything against each other).
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Post by Aphoristic on Apr 23, 2013 15:35:05 GMT -5
Pro perks are a flaw right there. Having to use a perk for many games doing certain challenges to unlock the full version of the perk? No thank you. The entire unlock system is mostly a joke in the first place.
Why should I have to use my AK for hours to unlock an optical attachment? Why should I have to level up to be allowed to unlock a gun? a perk? a killstreak?
Black Ops did this the best. You unlock what you want whenever you want. You still had to grind to unlock everything, but you weren't restricted in what you could choose to unlock (excluding guns which shouldn't have been).
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Post by UrbaneVirtuoso on Apr 23, 2013 15:46:34 GMT -5
Still, what's nice about unlock progression is that people don't immediately get access to game-breakers like KAP-40s, VSATs and AN-94s, unless tokens are spent.
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Post by lackingdamage on Apr 24, 2013 17:39:43 GMT -5
Okay, been thinking here some of my serious ideas. Not many but that all I think would be good to do. Now to read over the rest of the thread want to see what people have put. Yea it a very late reply but been busy. Matchmaking Improve it using the same system BO2 runs, most players would agree it runs pretty smooth. Sometimes it can be ugly but overall it works. Improve it, don't go back to the same system MW3 was using for the love of god. Flinch Can we tone down flinch please ? Not sure if anybody else has talked about it but super annoying. Bumping somebody into a headshot on you is not nice to see in the killcam. If you don't want to remove it completely how about giving LMGs a nice bonus of no flinch they are heavy machine guns after all. Spawns Demo increase the number of spawn points making spawn trapping harder to pull off. Same goes with FFA not sure on the effect it would have with overall pacing. What gamemode do you play ? curious And thanks for the feedback, you're right it was a joke post just to prove a point your vision of the game nothing like the devs vision. End of the day just want a smoother COD, I still play the game even with things that annoy me in it still. Alright then, sorry for getting a bit pissy there. Demo/CTF/HQ have been my main ones i suppose. In the past Sabo/Team Defender in MW3 but those are gone now ;( It fine Guess should have used a couple smilies to get the point I was not being serious. Can't play demo hate how the spawns work, CTF is good do play it from time to play. HQ is another one which I do dip into now and again. I miss sabo it was so much fun. V in reply to OMA coming back OMA was a interesting perk, but not something I used that often. Only time I used it with any real class was with the LMGs to skip the reload. It was quicker to switch over reload, do like the class changing element of it. Did mess around changing classes all the time with OMA a couple games in a row but not a perk I used that often outside of with the LMGs. It should come back if you fix the explosive spam problem with it which is a simple fix. Sure it added something to the game, it gave the LMGs something no reason for it not to return.
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Post by Aphoristic on Apr 24, 2013 20:27:50 GMT -5
Still, what's nice about unlock progression is that people don't immediately get access to game-breakers like KAP-40s, VSATs and AN-94s, unless tokens are spent. Ideally, nothing is gamebreaking. Plus access to everything would allow for quicker feedback on if something is overpowered/underpowered which in turn should make rebalancing happen more quickly.
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mmacola
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Post by mmacola on Apr 24, 2013 20:43:59 GMT -5
Still, what's nice about unlock progression is that people don't immediately get access to game-breakers like KAP-40s, VSATs and AN-94s, unless tokens are spent. Ideally, nothing is gamebreaking. Plus access to everything would allow for quicker feedback on if something is overpowered/underpowered which in turn should make rebalancing happen more quickly. Good point. At the very least people wouldn't say "this gun is op" just because said gun is unlocked very early and thus overused (for example, bo2 MP7)
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Post by Morshu on Apr 25, 2013 19:35:04 GMT -5
Pro perks are a flaw right there. Having to use a perk for many games doing certain challenges to unlock the full version of the perk? No thank you. The entire unlock system is mostly a joke in the first place. Why should I have to use my AK for hours to unlock an optical attachment? Why should I have to level up to be allowed to unlock a gun? a perk? a killstreak? Black Ops did this the best. You unlock what you want whenever you want. You still had to grind to unlock everything, but you weren't restricted in what you could choose to unlock (excluding guns which shouldn't have been). You have to understand the psychology of what makes you feel pleasure in a game. Imagine how bland games would be if everything was given to you right at the start. There would be no motivation to do anything and no pride in using something since everyone has complete and equal access to it. Its not about having good stuff but acquiring good stuff in a game that gives you the sense of satisfaction. Just to put my point in easy perspective, who do think would be happier- Someone who is in third world poverty getting a million dollars or a bank CEO getting a billion dollars? Progress is the key to happiness. Sure the grinding can be annoying but it is necessary in order to keep a game a fun. Remove the unlock system in a game because you hate grinding would be like working at McDonald's for the rest of your life because you hate going to college or trying to find a new job. The devs just have to do their part in balancing how long or hard it should be to unlock stuff. Too short and its feels like everythings already unlocked anyway and too long it can become frustrating and cause you to lose interest.
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Post by Morshu on Apr 25, 2013 20:09:04 GMT -5
I think CoD would be fun without an unlock system. Why? What action would you find I pleasure in with a CoD without an unlock system? Maybe getting a lot of kills one game or showing off your skills to your friends but that would be about it.
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Post by APOCALYPSE on Apr 25, 2013 20:13:20 GMT -5
I think CoD would be fun without an unlock system. Why? What action would you find I pleasure in with a CoD without an unlock system? Maybe getting a lot of kills one game or showing off your skills to your friends but that would be about it. Winning? Setting your own personal challenges rather than being forced to play the hitmarker Olympics until you get damage or whatever?
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Post by Morshu on Apr 25, 2013 20:26:04 GMT -5
Why? What action would you find I pleasure in with a CoD without an unlock system? Maybe getting a lot of kills one game or showing off your skills to your friends but that would be about it. Winning? Setting your own personal challenges rather than being forced to play the hitmarker Olympics until you get damage or whatever? I didn't like how shotguns were done in mw3. The damage prof. was basically forced on you and they weren't great even with it. Don't put the entire unlock system down because of a fu ck up. Again, the devs have to do their job in making sure it works.
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Post by Morshu on Apr 25, 2013 20:56:23 GMT -5
Why? What action would you find I pleasure in with a CoD without an unlock system? Maybe getting a lot of kills one game or showing off your skills to your friends but that would be about it. I honestly can't tell if you're joking or not. If that argument held any sort of weight then please explain why there is a single person in the game who plays once they reach max level. Cuz in my case I've been using the exact same classes in MW2 for well over a year. Single player is a completely different ball park then multiplayer. Single player uses a story, emotional shocks and cinematic scenes, none of which can be present in CoD multiplayer. You play the story a couple of times and thats it. The only thing that can be fun in a multiplayer is ranking up and showing off. You still can find fun in game after you maxed out, but it isn't nearly as fun. It then just becoming better skilled after each game, which is progress, which is what the unlock system gives more of. There will also always be more challenges and emblems to complete/unlock. So you are true in which a game doesn't NEED an unlock system to be fun, since there is always room for skill improvement, but an unlock gives more to improve then just your skill, thus increasing the fun factor. The unlock system is a direct embodiment of being able to improve yourself in a game which is what makes competitive multiplayer fun.
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Post by Morshu on Apr 25, 2013 21:10:57 GMT -5
I didn't even mention single player in that post. You didnt even address the one thing i asked you to. And please read my edit. i've invested countless hours into those few examples alone because the competitive aspect of the game is fun IN AND OF ITSELF. EDIT: And the only thing about single player games is the story? Are you even capable of rationalizing the idea of playing the game being fun? I mean I just bunged on all the 2D metroids recently. To say it has a half decent story is laughable at best, but they're fun fu cking games. Hell for the first 15 years games had virtually no concept of a story whatsoever; how the hell would they even exist as a media? Yeah I read misread that comment for a second there but decided to go ahead and talk about single player anyway since it was probably going to brought up. Answer to your question in above comment.
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Post by Morshu on Apr 25, 2013 21:18:43 GMT -5
if that's your answer then i'm just gonna assume you're pulling my leg and be done with this. Ok to make this all simple: Unlock system = being able to progress and improve Being able to progress and improve= fun Having an unlock system isn't the only way to improve yourself in a game as there is natural skill improvement, but it is the same concept and thus adds more fun to the game. If you don't understand this mousey then I don't know what else to tell you.
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Post by Aphoristic on Apr 25, 2013 21:59:28 GMT -5
You have to understand the psychology of what makes you feel pleasure in a game. Imagine how bland games would be if everything was given to you right at the start. There would be no motivation to do anything and no pride in using something since everyone has complete and equal access to it. Its not about having good stuff but acquiring good stuff in a game that gives you the sense of satisfaction. Just to put my point in easy perspective, who do think would be happier- Someone who is in third world poverty getting a million dollars or a bank CEO getting a billion dollars? Progress is the key to happiness. Sure the grinding can be annoying but it is necessary in order to keep a game a fun. Remove the unlock system in a game because you hate grinding would be like working at McDonald's for the rest of your life because you hate going to college or trying to find a new job. The devs just have to do their part in balancing how long or hard it should be to unlock stuff. Too short and its feels like everythings already unlocked anyway and too long it can become frustrating and cause you to lose interest. You need to read my post again. I didn't say to remove an unlock system. I said to remove the prerequisite bulldoo-doo from the unlock system (what Black Ops did, mostly). You still can grind to unlock absolutely everything if you want to, but you aren't forced to do it for one thing in particular because that is retarded bulldoo-doo that makes people not want to play the game/prestige in the first place. Also I would be Foxtrotting ecstatic if I were a bank CEO getting a billion dollars. if that's your answer then i'm just gonna assume you're pulling my leg and be done with this. Ok to make this all simple: Unlock system = being able to progress and improve Being able to progress and improve= fun Having an unlock system isn't the only way to improve yourself in a game as there is natural skill improvement, but it is the same concept and thus adds more fun to the game. If you don't understand this mousey then I don't know what else to tell you. An unlock system like that works if you are playing the game for the first time. Black Ops 2 won't even let you unlock everything unless you go through it 11 times. It is bulldoo-doo. Even if it is your first time through, why should I have to use a gun extensively to unlock an optical attachment? If it's one I prefer for that weapon, well I guess I'm screwed and have to grind for no reason to get it.
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banana
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Post by banana on Apr 25, 2013 22:06:18 GMT -5
I like how bo2 uses the unlock tokens but I feel it would be better if there are no level requirements for things. For example you could get the an94 at any level you want but you need at least 1 unlock token.
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Usagi
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Post by Usagi on Apr 25, 2013 22:06:48 GMT -5
Black Ops 2 won't even let you unlock everything unless you go through it 11 times. It is bulldoo-doo. Yeah, that was pretty stupid. I can't think of a single reason why this is better than just having everything unlocked when you reach max level like in all of the CoDs except BO1 and 2. Tokens are bullshit.
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mmacola
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Post by mmacola on Apr 25, 2013 22:18:09 GMT -5
I think CoD would be fun without an unlock system. Why? What action would you find I pleasure in with a CoD without an unlock system? Maybe getting a lot of kills one game or showing off your skills to your friends but that would be about it. I see your point. In BO1 I didn't feel challenged at all, because there wasn't good aesthetic rewards (emblems or calling cards) and guns didn't have attachment challenges. In MW2 and 3, there was the Titles and Emblems, which I felt was quite nice. In BO2, we have lots of challenges plus camos and calling cards to go for. Honestly BO2 system is the best, because in previous games you had to grind like a mofo only to prestige and lose every challenge progress you had done so far (think Sitrep Pro), so basically the only challenge you had was prestige. My point is, levelling up to gain stuff isn't suited for a fps. You can see that in Battlefield, as you unlock everything very early and then the whole game is open to you, without excessive ten prestiges for a grind to finally have fun.
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Brick2urface
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Post by Brick2urface on Apr 26, 2013 0:15:57 GMT -5
Make it so the mobility perks allow you to reload while sprinting. Or just build that into everyone by default.
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Post by Aphoristic on Apr 26, 2013 5:50:04 GMT -5
But then how will I cancel my reload with sprinting?
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Post by Aphoristic on Apr 26, 2013 7:43:22 GMT -5
nooooooooooooooo.com/Also, why were you were ready to respond 2 minutes after me posting in the early hours of the morning? <_<
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Post by otisman666 on Apr 26, 2013 8:59:33 GMT -5
I would agree that unlocking guns is a good thing. Isn't that the point of most GAMES? Get to check point A so you can then progress to checkpoint B.
The fact that BO II tried to force people into prestiging was bogus. What about the guy who likes to stay at max level, prestige 0?
Kind of a pointless discussion if you ask me. The no level progression thing was tried in BO, but for some reason wasn't brought back. If the Devs or Activision thought it worked, it certainly would have been seen again.
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Shakerag
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Post by Shakerag on Apr 26, 2013 9:08:55 GMT -5
That's one thing that pissed me off about BO2. I can't sit at max level, prestige 1 and have everything unlocked. I think prestiging (is that a word?) should be something optional, not required. I can't unlock some goofyass emblem until prestige 8? Okay. I can't have all weapons/parks/killstreaks/etc available to me at one time until prestige 11? DIAF.
If BO2 reset challenges on prestige (given that it's forcing you to prestige if you want everything unlocked), I likely would have quit playing long ago.
Oh, and it's kind of bullshit annoying to have camo unlocks gated. "Oh yeah, I just got a bloodthirsty with my executioner!" "Oh wait, that effort is for naught, because I haven't gotten the requisite number of headshots first!" Even more bullshit with the launcher camo challenges.
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Post by -3055- on Apr 26, 2013 11:55:03 GMT -5
True. Even starting with one extra worker/miner would give that person a huge advantage.
I kinda like how cod is set up now, though. The difference between the best weapon in a class and the worst weapon in the class is at worst acceptable. Other than akimbo executioner and KAP-40 long barrel / extended mag.
However, I do find the fact that everything won't be unlocked until the very very very end to be unfair. They should hand out the rest of the unlock coins at the very end (lvl 55, max EXP). There are different setups/killstreaks that are advantageous to certain gamemodes. It seems unfair to practically pigeonhole players to a small set of abilities for the duration of their play.
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Post by Marvel4 on Apr 26, 2013 12:01:38 GMT -5
Oh, and it's kind of bulldoo-doo annoying to have camo unlocks gated. "Oh yeah, I just got a bloodthirsty with my executioner!" "Oh wait, that effort is for naught, because I haven't gotten the requisite number of headshots first!" Even more bulldoo-doo with the launcher camo challenges.
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Post by Morshu on Apr 26, 2013 15:38:38 GMT -5
You need to read my post again. I didn't say to remove an unlock system. I said to remove the prerequisite bulldoo-doo from the unlock system (what Black Ops did, mostly). You still can grind to unlock absolutely everything if you want to, but you aren't forced to do it for one thing in particular because that is retarded bulldoo-doo that makes people not want to play the game/prestige in the first place. Ok I can see what you are saying about the prerequisite stuff, but you would still just go and buy/get the best stuff first without much work put into it. A good to work a little to get the good stuff, it makes you feel better when you do get it. And if there is something you REALLY want there are permanent unlock tokens. I think the unlock system was best in mw3.
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Post by Aphoristic on Apr 26, 2013 16:20:58 GMT -5
You need to read my post again. I didn't say to remove an unlock system. I said to remove the prerequisite bulldoo-doo from the unlock system (what Black Ops did, mostly). You still can grind to unlock absolutely everything if you want to, but you aren't forced to do it for one thing in particular because that is retarded bulldoo-doo that makes people not want to play the game/prestige in the first place. Ok I can see what you are saying about the prerequisite stuff, but you would still just go and buy/get the best stuff first without much work put into it. A good to work a little to get the good stuff, it makes you feel better when you do get it. And if there is something you REALLY want there are permanent unlock tokens. I think the unlock system was best in mw3. Why is there the assumption that it is the best stuff? Ideally there is nothing that is best, and we should be shooting for the ideals here.
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Post by brutalonslaught on Apr 26, 2013 16:38:36 GMT -5
'Best' is relative. The FAL is the 'best' gun if you have moderate hand eye coordination but most people on call of duty dont and require a full auto.
Target Finder is the 'best' attachment for most people because they are blind/disabled but for anyone with a modicum of ability and eyes it's a massive hindrance.
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adw1983
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Post by adw1983 on Apr 26, 2013 20:50:50 GMT -5
Oh my god.
DO NOT record KD in ANY WAY in objective games. NOT ANY WAY.
I just had a game of 10 captures and 15 defends in Domination -- and several teammates have 0 captures because they're too afraid of going less than 3:1
The constant quitting would cease relatively IMMEDIATELY if KD wasn't the "end be all" for what people consider to be skill. Random people would actually do the objectives instead of tactical loitering, because winning the game would be more important than having a high lifetime kills number.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Apr 26, 2013 21:32:04 GMT -5
Oh my god. DO NOT record KD in ANY WAY in objective games. NOT ANY WAY. I just had a game of 10 captures and 15 defends in Domination -- and several teammates have 0 captures because they're too afraid of going less than 3:1 The constant quitting would cease relatively IMMEDIATELY if KD wasn't the "end be all" for what people consider to be skill. Random people would actually do the objectives instead of tactical loitering, because winning the game would be more important than having a high lifetime kills number. So... don't record deaths and/or kills?
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