BlOps chart, JA2 1.13 style

[Ishbane]

Corrected Python+ACOG range, added G11 scope centerspeed and Masterkey.

Edit: Off to bed, past midnight (CET)

[anonic]

So I now have a perverse love relationship with the M16 IR, it seems surprisingly good. Luckily not many people run Ghost Pro. Anyone who hasn't tried it should try it out, haha.

[deadbeat]

I dont think im grasping your center speed stats so Im going to ask this:

Say im using the spectre with only iron sights. my center speed is 1300 correct? so If I use the red dot AND the grip I get 1800 right? I dont feel that makes any sense because i was testing them ingame and they are both just as random making the same large circles of recoil. Basically if your stats are true(which they are) im going to say its worthless to even bother. Because if I cant notice the benefit of them side by side then whats the point? Whats the point of even using the grip and the red dot? Might as well put it towads a a bigger mag or silencer.

[bm01]

Nov 18, 2010 9:38:49 GMT -5 deadbeat said:

Say im using the spectre with only iron sights. my center speed is 1300 correct?

No, 1700.

[deadbeat]

then why is there red text as 1300? what does that represent? its the same color as the iron sights.

[mrboo2501]

Nov 18, 2010 10:00:07 GMT -5 deadbeat said:

then why is there red text as 1300? what does that represent? its the same color as the iron sights.

The icon highlighted in red is the ACOG Attachment.

[Ishbane]

Update

• Added akimbo reload times
  
• Added ext. mag sizes
  
• Added missing ACOG ADS (NB: WA2000)
  
• Added Skorpion akimbo damage and range
  
• Added Stakeout w/ grip RPM
  
• Added HS10 akimbo range

I went through all files, only thing left worth adding is FOV_{and those icons still missing}

Nov 18, 2010 9:38:49 GMT -5 deadbeat said:

I dont think im grasping your center speed stats so Im going to ask this:

Say im using the spectre with only iron sights. my center speed is 1300 correct? so If I use the red dot AND the grip I get 1800 right? I dont feel that makes any sense because i was testing them ingame and they are both just as random making the same large circles of recoil. Basically if your stats are true(which they are) im going to say its worthless to even bother. Because if I cant notice the benefit of them side by side then whats the point? Whats the point of even using the grip and the red dot? Might as well put it towads a a bigger mag or silencer.

Original: 1700
w/ ACOG: 1300
w/ grip+ACOG: 1550
w/ grip: 1800

RDS and Reflex don't do doo-dee-doo. The Reflex blurs slightly more, that's about it.

[deadbeat]

okay wow nevermind. I thought the acog icon was irong sights(kind of looked like the mp5 drum sights). herp de derp for me.

[noclass]

Excellent post and updates! Nice work dude.

[muffintopx5]

Loving the chart bro. How about ADS with thermal? Is it the same as ACOG for the ARs?

[Ishbane]

Nov 18, 2010 13:12:51 GMT -5 muffintopx5 said:

Loving the chart bro. How about ADS with thermal? Is it the same as ACOG for the ARs?

Look at the very bottom. It's 0.4 secs for all guns.

[aequinox]

Now find a place to add in reload times of extended mags and dual mags .

[whoknows10]

FOV when ADS, assuming they didn't change anything:
Pistol- 65 degrees of vision (1x zoom)
SMG/Shotgun- 55 degrees (1.2x)
AR/LMG- 50 degrees (1.3x)
ACOG/Vzoom L- 30 degrees (2.15x)
WA2000- 20 degrees (3.25x)-interesting...
Sniper- 15 degrees (4.3x)
Variable Zoom H-10 degrees (6.5x)
Variable Zoom M is the same magnification of the original scope of its sniper

also update rapid fire's new RPM

Now all we need is a killstreak chart...

[Ishbane]

Nov 18, 2010 20:41:13 GMT -5 aequinox said:

Now find a place to add in reload times of extended mags and dual mags .

Adding dual mags now, ext. mags never influence reload times

Nov 19, 2010 3:40:47 GMT -5 whoknows10 said:

also update rapid fire's new RPM

Now all we need is a killstreak chart...

Will add rf RPMs, since i'm a gun nut i don't care about the killstraks.

And to those who wondered: If you exceed the M14's or FAL's RPM of 625 it is meant to jam.

^{IT'S NOT A BUG. IT'S A FEATURE.}

[aequinox]

I'd suggest the ACOG scope pixel art be changed to a thicker scope with a crosshair centring to a circle (diamond in pixels, 1 px between circle and crosshair) so that people don't continue confusing it with iron sights.

Also, if you switch the snub nose icon's position with the full auto icon's position then you have more room to either draw rapid fire or just rename full auto to rapid fire.

[eLantern]

Does anybody know if the RATE OF FIRE is capped for consoles?

[Corax]

Yes. Semi-automatics are capped to counter modded controllers. They did this to COD4 as well on a late patch a few months before MW2 came out.

[eLantern]

Actually what I'm referring to is similar to what was done in WaW to the fully automatic weapons which had high rates of fire to begin with and then when you paired them with rapid fire they couldn't fully take advantage of the 1.33x multiplier because they were capped at a specific overall Fire Rate (I forget what that was, probably 1200 rpm). Now, this was only for the console versions of the game, so I'm just wondering if this holds true for BO and if rapid fire is still the same constant 1.33x multiplier as it has always been or if it varies between weapons in this game?

[Ishbane]

0.05 ms between shots (1200 RPM) for all guns except FAL and M14.
You'd have to push the fire button that fast though (read: hold down that rapid fire button), normal fire is unrestrained.

[battleaxerx]

Wow, DMs on the commando don't speed up reload much? Unless you cancel after the add time? That's kinda weak...

I gotta say this chart looks delicious. I like it mucho.

Question:

What attachments "can't be used with warlord"?
Just the following:
grenade launcher
flamethrower
masterkey
dual wield

Or rapid fire also?

Edit: Would you consider putting the 3.25x for variable zoom of G11 and wazoo in pink to show they are different from the others?

[RageHulkSmash]

Chart says MPL can't take ext mags but there's an ext mag value for it listed.

Chart is very helpful btw.

[Ishbane]

Nov 23, 2010 3:29:23 GMT -5 RageHulkSmash said:

Chart says MPL can't take ext mags but there's an ext mag value for it listed.

And it even reduces the mag size.

[acidsnow]

Woah cool beans, I haven't checked this thread out since day one - it's still improving, NICE! The only misprint I see looks to be that the MPL with extended mags goes from 32 to 30 bullets.

[aequinox]

Nearly the only thing that bothers my OCD now is that the Python ACOG is a different colour (same colour as the Silencer/Suppressor) than the other ACOG scopes.Damage drop off is also the suppressor colour. I figure if they were both the ACOG colour it would reduce confusion and not bother me as much . Personal preference, though.

[Ishbane]

Update:

• Added missing gun icons (sniper rifles, handguns)
  
• Added unique sights/scopes (swarovski, SUSAT, russian, low power scope)
  
• Recolored Python ACOG and WA2000 default zoom
  
• Removed MPL ext. mags value
  
• Added attachment legend

Only thing left (afaic) is an easy explanation of the stats, preferably by MORE PIXEL ART

[mrboo2501]

Nov 23, 2010 12:19:40 GMT -5 Ishbane said:

Update:

• Added missing gun icons (sniper rifles, handguns)
  
• Added unique sights/scopes (swarovski, SUSAT, russian, low power scope)
  
• Recolored Python ACOG and WA2000 default zoom
  
• Removed MPL ext. mags value
  
• Added attachment legend

Only thing left (afaic) is an easy explanation of the stats, preferably by MORE PIXEL ART

<3 Much thanks for all the work put in - everything looks gorgeous. <3

[Ishbane]

I'm currently working on a graphical representation of each gun's recoil for easy comparison.

Although i've been aware of the fact, that i ignored center speed and symmetric/asymmetric recoil force, i had something like this in mind originally:



Now, after i've read Den's understanding of the different value's functional interaction, things got a wee bit more complicated.
I spent hours last night trying to compose a formula capable of calculating the effective recoil after n shots for given force, center speed and firerate, to no avail.

It should look somewhat like this when It's done, but i'd hate to add values more or less made up:



I know that i'm missing variables, I'd appreciate some advice, Den.

[skittls]

That would be awesome. I love the chart as is, but I'm still having trouble interpreting the recoil numbers. Can't wait to see the next update.

[keeko]

[Den this chart is very useful. would you consider replacing yours and giving a small credit to this chart... its still basicaly yours but his makes it easier to read.

[battleaxerx]

denkirson.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=2179

We can see the behavior of scorpion recoil... It doesn't seem like the numbers are behaving quite like you are portraying (at least not in that smaller pic)

Its recoil is pretty much a horizontal line... the 30-20 recoil numbers are nearly canceled out.

Am I mistaken? Either way, your chart is attractive and having a visual representation of recoil would be neat! But I agree, if they aren't at least around 93% accurate, it might be best to forgo them.

Edit: also, I would consider a slightly more orange hue as it would stick out a bit better IMO and not interfere with the foreground much.