i8
True Bro
Posts: 10,211
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Post by i8 on Sept 15, 2009 21:19:34 GMT -5
my bad i miss read something sorry
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qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
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Post by qupie on Sept 16, 2009 4:24:24 GMT -5
I played with the ak's yesterday, for starters because of this topic with the SMG, but indeed it really rocks... I've always played with the MP5 but AK-74u without attachment and with stopping power it really owns, even on xbox. it is darn easy to get 3 kills on one mag with it, as long as you dont try to correct for the vieuw kick (because there is almost no real recoil...) until I figured that out yesterday I didn't know why allot of peaple used the AK's. But now I really get it! In 5 games I had my AK 74 challenge for kills done, so that is 150 kills in 5 games (to 750 points per team...) it really rocks. With a sillencer and UAV jammer I still prefer the MP over anything though. Even against the statistics that the P90 should be better with silencer. I can figure out a few reasons. But other then that it is just the feeling I guess. 1 You shoot less bullets --> your opponent has less bullits to hear and see. (wich is important for panther) 2 I think the P90 makes a lot more noise, I only use my surround set (allthough that is of a VERY high quality, so verry precise) but when a P90 user sneaks up on us from behind and kills somebody. I know he is there! With a MP5 or asault rifle I dont hear them that well... (this might be the fire speed but I think it also makes a slightly different sound because I can tell for sure the guy is using a P90 if I hear the sillenced sound. ) I don't really see the plus of the P90, it just is a to much sprayer for me I guess.
edit: and the ammo thing is not really relevant I think, because the MP5 needs alot less ammo to kill... and has 120 bullets compared to the 150 of the P90. And you can grab allot of ammo of the ground wich the P90 won't. (allot of noobs or last standers use a m9, and also the mini uzi and other mp5 users ofcourse...) And I never use the deagle anyways.... I think it sucks...
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Post by chyros on Sept 16, 2009 11:10:43 GMT -5
FYI the sprint bug is PC only OK, but my point still stands. And PC's rule anyway ;p . and with a suppressor the MP5 loses a lot of its higher damage advantage due to the range reduction. This is true in theory, but even then, stealth classes are built on the principle that opponents will be less likely to spot you and that therefore you will be more able to close the distance. And then, it will be able to use its superior damage.
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Post by imrlybord7 on Sept 16, 2009 16:16:56 GMT -5
I engage enemies at medium range all the time when I'm being stealthy, and the P90 has a huge medium range advantage with a minor close range disadvantage.
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Post by robesh on Sept 17, 2009 22:26:22 GMT -5
FYI the sprint bug is PC only OK, but my point still stands. And PC's rule anyway ;p . and with a suppressor the MP5 loses a lot of its higher damage advantage due to the range reduction. This is true in theory, but even then, stealth classes are built on the principle that opponents will be less likely to spot you and that therefore you will be more able to close the distance. And then, it will be able to use its superior damage. With that logic, the Skorpion would be the best stealth SMG ever. But it isn't A good stealth SMG requires that you can effectively combat enemies at medium-long range, because if you're behind them, it won't really matter if you're doing 20 damage, you will kill them.
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Post by ssog on Sept 17, 2009 23:33:12 GMT -5
And I never use the deagle anyways.... I think it sucks... In Hardcore, it's essentially a second primary. I've actually made entire classes built around the DEagle (Sniper for the Ghillie, Bandolier, Sleight of Hand or UAV Jammer, Last Stand or Steady Aim). In Softcore, I agree that it kind of sucks (it's basically just a G3 with better hip-fire and a shorter clip), but it's the only way to travel if you're rolling with Last Stand. I'd really recommend trying out the "DEagle as a Primary" class in HC sometime, though. Like I said, it's essentially just a flashier, sexier G3 with the best hip-fire accuracy in the game and great ADS times. And, unlike with the G3, you can get Shotgun movement speeds or sniper ghillies without wasting perk 2 on Overkill.
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Post by robesh on Sept 18, 2009 0:11:50 GMT -5
The Desert Eagle is my favorite gun for hardcore.
My set-ups are usually
M21-Reg. Scope Deagle Smoke
Bandoleer UAV Jammer or sometimes SoH Steady Aim usually but sometimes LS is good (due to the invulnerability frame)
and P90- Suppressor (for non-ghillie maps) Deagle Smoke
Bandoleer UAV Jammer or SoH Steady Aim/last Stand
I think of the Deagle as the SMG version of the G3 in HC.
Like the AK-74u is to the AK-47. Essentially better at CQB (SMG quality) and not as good for long range (SMG quality).
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Post by imrlybord7 on Sept 18, 2009 0:48:48 GMT -5
The Skorpion would be the best SMG if it had a 30 round magazine. I don't think I would ever use a different gun.
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Post by chyros on Sept 18, 2009 5:26:14 GMT -5
OK, but my point still stands. And PC's rule anyway ;p . This is true in theory, but even then, stealth classes are built on the principle that opponents will be less likely to spot you and that therefore you will be more able to close the distance. And then, it will be able to use its superior damage. With that logic, the Skorpion would be the best stealth SMG ever. But it isn't A good stealth SMG requires that you can effectively combat enemies at medium-long range, because if you're behind them, it won't really matter if you're doing 20 damage, you will kill them. Strictly speaking, the Skorpion is one of the better SMGs for medium-range encounters because of its complete lack of recoil. Ammo management needed a bit, but still. You're right though, the Skorp isn't the best stealth SMG. But neither is the P90, IMO. Sure, it's not hit very hard by the silencer on it, and the MP5 is hit harder by it. But even then, when playing stealth, I prefer to sneak up to people as much as possible to get the biggest possible advantage over them; most damage & least chance of missing - IMO that's the very point of a stealth class; improving your chances of killing by using stealth to sneak up on them. I guess this boils down to preference - if you engage enemies quickly when using a stealth class, you might end up at a range at which the P90 is better.
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Post by imrlybord7 on Sept 18, 2009 20:34:37 GMT -5
I just use the P90 for versatility. Even if the MP5 is better in CQC, the P90 is still one of the best CQC guns in the game. So you can either have a gun that is godly for CQC and slightly less than mediocre for everything else or you can have a gun that is good for CQC and medium range while being usable at fairly long ranges when targets are moving through the open.
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Post by robesh on Sept 19, 2009 12:38:18 GMT -5
With that logic, the Skorpion would be the best stealth SMG ever. But it isn't A good stealth SMG requires that you can effectively combat enemies at medium-long range, because if you're behind them, it won't really matter if you're doing 20 damage, you will kill them. Strictly speaking, the Skorpion is one of the better SMGs for medium-range encounters because of its complete lack of recoil. Ammo management needed a bit, but still. You're right though, the Skorp isn't the best stealth SMG. But neither is the P90, IMO. Sure, it's not hit very hard by the silencer on it, and the MP5 is hit harder by it. But even then, when playing stealth, I prefer to sneak up to people as much as possible to get the biggest possible advantage over them; most damage & least chance of missing - IMO that's the very point of a stealth class; improving your chances of killing by using stealth to sneak up on them. I guess this boils down to preference - if you engage enemies quickly when using a stealth class, you might end up at a range at which the P90 is better. That's true: It all comes down to preference. Playing styles and skill is what determines your favorite weapon. For example, some people do better by sniping all the time. Their playing style is to snipe, so obviously they probably don't like to use the M14 or P90 as much as they like the M40 or the Barrett. In a way, there is no one good gun, but a group of good guns. Like in the Assault Rifle category, the M16, AK, and M4 are the best, but none is truly better than the other.
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Post by imrlybord7 on Sept 21, 2009 10:40:25 GMT -5
In a way, there is no one good gun, but a group of good guns. Like in the Assault Rifle category, the M16, AK, and M4 are the best, but none is truly better than the other. Obvious post is obvious.
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toysrme
True Bro
"Even at normal Health, there's no other choice than the Vector" Den Kirson
Posts: 1,339
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Post by toysrme on Oct 2, 2009 0:08:02 GMT -5
The rifle bullet feature doesn't help with groups as much as an LMG style mag ala the P90. If you are so good at aiming, toysrme, then why do you need the better penetration? Surely one of your caliber could just aim at their exposed parts. Wouldn't taking more bullets to kill require MORE accuracy? Sure it helps. If I run across three players at once there's a high probability that two are going to die at the same time. It's alot easier to break down killing 3 people into two steps than three steps. there's also alot less total bullets coming at you when two people fall dead at the same time VS trying to mow down 3. The big thing in the COD series when you console M/KB for the better players is taking down more people when given the opportunity, and the fact that most will show much higher aggression. When i tell you my accuracy is higher, it is. sitting still and on the move. Because you will find yourself playing on the move much more when you whore an SMG you REALLY want penitration compaired to low damage big clip P90. I WANT the chance to engage someone i saw in cover. 74u gives that chance, P90 does not. Yet you've never tried it have you? How well it works depends on many factors - not just playing skill. Aim-Assist is a deal breaker with the KB/M. If you're sitting still on a joystick its AMAZING and it + anti-lag give syou almost all your fine aiming ability. On the mouse it FIGHTS what you are doing. ESPECIALLY when multiple people cross the aim-assist's circle. it will ALWAYS rip towards the player<s> you are NOT currently aiming at. You can't cut it off in COD4 without ACTUALLY cheating & hacking your gamesave. You can cut it DOWN but NOT OFF in W@W. The only example auto-aim isn't a dealbreaker with M/KB is if you want to acogM40 whore. you drag across a player and the instant it slows down click->dead. beyond that IF you could cut it off, nearly everyone would. While you can bind to analog devices, most still use a keyboard for movement functions. While rediculous unbeatable in a very high movement rate game like UT3, its somewhat of a handicap in COD as you try to do more advanced manuvers to more advanced positions in some maps. So don't think it makes anyone a god. It wont double your KDR, or make anyone thats bad good. If you have a .25 KDR with a controller and plop down for an xim, gaming mouse, keyboard & surround sound headphones guess what? You're STILL GOING TO SUCK! LMAO! I'm going to get a M/KB for my Xbox. Honestly, I've always loved aiming with a mouse, but I hate to spend 5k on a gaming PC. I know it's cheating, but I'd like to see Microsoft catch me! > It's not cheating AFA Microsoft is concerned. You're using an officially licenced xbox controller. you can't do anything that's not allowed by that controller. Depending on the game it's iffy. COD works amazing. It's just about PC like and alot more configurable movement wise. Halo, Unreal Engine games, quake based games (not named COD) work between passably OK and great. COD shines with Halo on 360. Can't speak for PS3 titles, but they get about the same. ALOT less money to play on console tho. Get your sound & mouse/keyboard sorted out & youll likely be done spending money.
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qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
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Post by qupie on Oct 2, 2009 16:02:48 GMT -5
jep, but it is still an advantage... sure it wont make you from 0.25 to 2.0 but I can imagine it gets me from 2. to 3.0....
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Post by imrlybord7 on Oct 2, 2009 23:46:27 GMT -5
toys, you NEED to stop referring to wall penetration as Rifle Bullet.
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iKONIG
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Don't know what to put here, Just something random.
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Post by iKONIG on Oct 3, 2009 3:58:33 GMT -5
/eyes roll
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