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Post by iw5000 on Mar 20, 2015 10:17:19 GMT -5
Nexus, Summoning Pits and Devil's Lair are the three shortest Xbox strikes. Also have the three lowest 'quit rates' amongst strikes.
All three of those strikes have sections you can run through and/or bypass. Basically, they are two encounter strikes. People like that.
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Post by TheHawkNY on Mar 20, 2015 10:50:46 GMT -5
Nexus, Summoning Pits and Devil's Lair are the three shortest Xbox strikes. Also have the three lowest 'quit rates' amongst strikes. All three of those strikes have sections you can run through and/or bypass. Basically, they are two encounter strikes. People like that. Every single Strike has sections you can run through and/or bypass. In fact, all of the Xbox Strikes prior to Omnigul are two encounter Strikes. They are all the same formula: stuff you can run past; 3 waves of enemies; stuff you can run past; boss encounter. And yes, like I said, it's clear that quit rates are tied heavily to rewards.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Mar 20, 2015 11:45:50 GMT -5
I dunno.
First of all, I agree with your sentiment, but if anything, I run another raid if my rewards on the last one were crap.
If I drop a raid, it is because 1) it's a repeat and I don't want to do it again... 2) someone has invited me to do something else, or 3) others have dropped and I don't want to solo it or 4) I've gotten the bounty and that the reason why I wanted to do the raid
The stats are interesting though.....
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 20, 2015 12:26:33 GMT -5
The only time I do the story Strikes is when I am doing an exotic bounty. I would do them if there was a reasonable chance to farm Motes of Light though and they are usually a less tedious way to farm Glimmer too. Also, the target bounties for the Strike bosses are faulty although this is not new. You need to have damaged the boss enough/within the last 30 seconds for it to trigger, and if it doesn't it also appears to stop Glimmer items being dropped from said boss when this is not done. Had a few surprises on the Nexus and thought I was imagining it.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Mar 20, 2015 14:47:08 GMT -5
Oh... as for everyone's favourite data miner, as per reddit:
English (Translation By /u/balderm ) Apparently he can't query for single items in Xur inventory anymore, whenever he tries the server just returns the same items from this week, all he can do now is predict the Exotic Engram and some of the items in the Upgrade Exotic list. He's not sure if this happens because Bungie is controlling Xur directly or because of the server side changes that have been implemented recently, but if this happens again next week, or the following, he'll most likely be unable to predict Xur anymore.
For the query result check the 2 images, one from 27th March and the other from 4th April, both have the same items except for the Engram and the Upgradable Exotics.
Regarding OP EDIT:
He won't say that Bungie system has changed, there's no need for gossip regarding that matter at the moment, but, if server-side things didn't change, Xur old schedule included MIDA Multi-tool and Obsidian Mind next week, Thunderlord the 8th of May but at this point he doesn't know if this prediction is correct anymore so take it with a grain of salt.
He also wonders when the Japanese website will be updated.
Because Bungie f%%kz yo couch!!!!!!
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 20, 2015 15:57:25 GMT -5
I really wish these stats were tracked separately for the strike playlist, weekly, and nightfall versions. Because I bet there are some significant variations. For that matter the weeklies and nightfalls will vary quite a bit based on the modifiers as well. I'm sure there were a LOT more drops on Omnigul arc burn than the weeks with full burn or solar. In fact I bet the full burn weeks have some of the lowest drops. They seem to be easier since you can pick all your best weapons even though nearly all the enemy attacks also do more damage.
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Post by TheHawkNY on Mar 20, 2015 16:14:19 GMT -5
I really wish these stats were tracked separately for the strike playlist, weekly, and nightfall versions. Because I bet there are some significant variations. For that matter the weeklies and nightfalls will vary quite a bit based on the modifiers as well. I'm sure there were a LOT more drops on Omnigul arc burn than the weeks with full burn or solar. In fact I bet the full burn weeks have some of the lowest drops. They seem to be easier since you can pick all your best weapons even though nearly all the enemy attacks also do more damage. The stats I posted? They were all Roc strikes, from a single day (3/16).
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Mar 20, 2015 16:58:23 GMT -5
Cool. NF and weekly would be messy... though interesting.
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wings
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Post by wings on Mar 21, 2015 2:48:01 GMT -5
I really wish these stats were tracked separately for the strike playlist, weekly, and nightfall versions. Because I bet there are some significant variations. For that matter the weeklies and nightfalls will vary quite a bit based on the modifiers as well. I'm sure there were a LOT more drops on Omnigul arc burn than the weeks with full burn or solar. In fact I bet the full burn weeks have some of the lowest drops. They seem to be easier since you can pick all your best weapons even though nearly all the enemy attacks also do more damage. Winter's Run with triple burn would probably have the lowest failure rate. Apart from Omnigul I suspect the Nexus with void burn might take the longest, just because even the cheese methods are a lot less safe than in other strikes. The safest one for me is the cave and that means barely any crit spots on Sekrion but safe revives and ammo synthesis usage is handy.
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Post by TheHawkNY on Apr 3, 2015 13:26:28 GMT -5
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Post by TheHawkNY on Apr 10, 2015 11:11:38 GMT -5
So let's talk about the ammo changes in Crucible. www.bungie.net/en/News/News?aid=12753The change to heavy ammo seems ridiculous to me. I haven't really noticed players not picking up packs, didn't think it was an issue at all. As for the timer...as it is currently, no matter where you are on the map, there's plenty of time to get to a heavy ammo crate, so long as you don't die, and even if you do, you can frequently make it. Seems like you'll just end up spending more time sitting there waiting for the crate to spawn. But also, it will be a lot easier for an enemy to come in and super your entire team while you wait for the crate to spawn. I know if I have my super charged, I'll be running straight for the enemy heavy from now on. As for the special ammo...it seems like now you might need coordination between teammates to get special ammo, similar to heavy, making playing with randoms even more annoying. This could make shotguns even more annoying. That enemy with Felwinter's Lie can now really spend his time lining up his shot, knowing it's less likely you'll be using a shotgun. Or everyone will just switch to Universal Remote. If it is successful, I'll be using my Last Word even more. It's pretty much unbeatable against any primaries in CQC.
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wittyscorpion
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Post by wittyscorpion on Apr 10, 2015 11:44:26 GMT -5
Until I can get a chance to play under the new ammo rules, I can't say for sure they are good or not. That said, my initial opinion is to favor these changes.
As it is probably pretty obvious by now, I want to see a) heavy ammo to become a lot more contentious, and b) special weapons to become less used compared to primary weapons.
The proposed changes are pushing the game flow into the direction that I want it to go:
1) Heavy ammo changes
Having the crate take longer to spawn means that every player has more time to make a run to the spot to fight for the ammo. This means more teammates to share the ammo your team control (which we all know by now the number of players that can get their hands on heavey ammo can be a very important factor to differentiate a good team from a bad one), and more time for your team to stage an organized attack (if you have solid coordination with your teammates) or impromptu one (if you want to be heroic and ruin your enemy's day) on the ammo in enemy territory.
This sounds good to me
2) Special ammo changes
In today's world, special ammo is practically unlimited. You can snipe / fusion / shotty all game long to your hearts content and never need to worry about running out of ammo. This is not good IMHO. I think that the primary weapon should be truly "primary" and special should be truly for "special" occasions.
As a result, the new change sounds good to me too.
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 10, 2015 12:00:34 GMT -5
If it is successful, I'll be using my Last Word even more. It's pretty much unbeatable against any primaries in CQC. Yep. I don't understand the reason for the ammo changes. I might play it post-changes to see how it plays but it already looks like I will be favouring Hand Cannons more. I have a fair amount of Hand Cannons and I'm starting to use them more in the Crucible and I think these changes to special ammo are not going to change my mind. I have two The Last Words and one Thorn for exotics, in addition to The Chance, a Venation, and a Timur's Lash all with decent perks. I think a lot of the complaints about special ammo is because people go by the definition of 'special' to mean rare, which is only one synonym of the word. This is my take from my excessive browsing on Reddit anyway. However, you could consider shotguns, fusion rifles and sniper rifles to be special on grounds of their usual TTK compared to primaries anyway. However, a lot of the areas that have likely engagements in and around chokepoints and objectives means shorter ranged weapons are usually used. I usually like 'significant range' in my engagements but sometimes objective placement means I'm shoehorned into shorter ranges, e.g. I sometimes camp on the ramp on Firebase Delphi between A and B. Another issue in where shotguns may be given a 'serious advantage' is the nerf to their counter, sniper rifles with armour piercing rounds. Someone corner tactical loitering B on Twilight Gap? You can no longer snipe them through the metal grate. If you're waiting for your grenade and/or super to charge, that could be losing valuable time to secure that objective. You can try and melee them but you will be more vulnerable than before. For current gen users, the Invective and the Ice Breaker may come in handy when regenerating ammo. I'd advise against this on previous because menu lag is horrific. I quite liked being able to use primary, secondary, and heavy pretty often when the game out but then I've clocked a lot of hours on Borderlands and Gears of War so I guess that is why. If I'm going to be using a one weapon all the time, I might as well play Call of Duty. Good luck to all those wanting to do the Thorn bounty with their void shotguns and machine guns. I will expect a few more dead weights from players because of this bounty and few players are privileged enough to have a void primary. I've done several Invective bounties with different setups but I don't think I will do this for the Thorn now.
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 10, 2015 12:13:39 GMT -5
In today's world, special ammo is practically unlimited. You can snipe / fusion / shotty all game long to your hearts content and never need to worry about running out of ammo. This is not good IMHO. I think that the primary weapon should be truly "primary" and special should be truly for "special" occasions. Oh yeah, how often are you killed by fusion rifles? How do I check to see how often I'm killed by each weapon anyway? And if primary weapons should be truly primary then doesn't that mean the Universal Remote should get a major buff to its OHK range? Like anyone who wants the primaries to be 'truly primary' are going to want the Universal Remote to OHK them at 10m and beyond.
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Post by TheHawkNY on Apr 10, 2015 13:00:06 GMT -5
If I remember correctly, switching secondaries wipes all your ammo in Crucible, so you won't be able to regen with Ice Breaker/Invective and then switch.
You can't see how often you're killed by each weapon, but I can say that I am killed very infrequently by Fusion Rifles.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Apr 11, 2015 14:59:49 GMT -5
Before shotguns got so popular via fusion rifle nerf, (and simultaneous PvE buff to shotguns and Felwinter's Lie being sold) I was killed plenty by fusion rifles. I think they're underutilized right now. The nerf should really only affect them significantly at range, but I haven't used them. (I don't like using fusion rifles...)
While I will be sad about the heavy ammo decay I guess it does make sense. It's always been clear to me that the heavy ammo spawns were intended to create a brief period where the game changes and there's a chance to shake things up in a match. Personally I would habitually leave those bricks on the ground. But that's because I get really irritated when I manage to actually pick up the ammo for a change and then die and lose it all without even getting a chance. But I understand it and for the other changes I'll take the swap because maybe it will be easier for me to actually get the stuff.
Personally I never found the 10 whole seconds warning you get to be enough time. I pretty much always play pubs and there's usually some yahoo that will run up to the crate and open it in the first five or ten seconds after it spawns. If I can't drop everything I'm doing and make a direct BLine strait to it without encountering even a single enemy... then I won't get there in time 90% of the time. The only remedy is to watch the clock and hang in the area when heavy ammo is coming soon. I just keep forgetting to watch the clock. ;3 But at least doing so has helped me get it more. Most players probably still don't watch the clock though, and that warning is all they get.
They didn't really say what the despawn conditions were did they? Will it despawn if we die, or on a timer, or what? hmm...
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 11, 2015 16:38:32 GMT -5
If I remember correctly, switching secondaries wipes all your ammo in Crucible, so you won't be able to regen with Ice Breaker/Invective and then switch. I wonder if this has made players use shotguns a bit more than they otherwise would because you lose all secondary ammo upon switching special weapons. I usually decide which secondary to use when I see which map it is but there are rare occasions when I could do with swapping to a different special, usually when the lead is improbably unassailable so I like to goof around for funsies, and I'd rather not be penalised for it. So if I really want to use a sniper rifle I should probably use a Hand Cannon as a primary. And if I use a shotgun as a special then may be use the Red Death. So much weapon variety there...
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Post by iw5000 on Apr 13, 2015 8:26:55 GMT -5
www.bungie.net/en/News/News?aid=12753.[/quote]I found this quote interesting from the link "Or, as Mr. Fruit put it earlier this week: Shotgun violence runs rampant in the Crucible. Can you ease his mind with some details?" That comment made me laugh. Why? Last week, a few people on this board were trying to tell me shotguns aren't prevalent in the Crucible.
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Post by iw5000 on Apr 13, 2015 8:32:58 GMT -5
In today's world, special ammo is practically unlimited. You can snipe / fusion / shotty all game long to your hearts content and never need to worry about running out of ammo. This is not good IMHO. I think that the primary weapon should be truly "primary" and special should be truly for "special" occasions. As a result, the new change sounds good to me too. Just a thought here Witty. Bungie never seems to make drastic changes to these things. If they do nerf special ammo drop rates and supplies, how much we talking? 20%? That might seem excessive there, but in line. But if so, what does that really do if I am using my FelWinterLie? Let's say I have 8 shots to use. Now I have 5. So what? What makes the shotguns so good in the Crucible is the fact you don't need much ammo. One shit kills. If anything, this in theory makes shotguns even more valuable. I think to make this work, to tone down the shotgun-fest that is Crucible, they are going to REALLY need to slow down the ammo. By more than 10-20%.
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 13, 2015 10:53:27 GMT -5
Or they could have, you know, made maps that have longer sight lines so that it's less CQC focused. All that is going to happen is I am going to see primaries being used in ranges too short for their ideal usage. And Hand Cannons are going to be better than they already are now too.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Apr 13, 2015 10:57:41 GMT -5
There are some, but the bigger maps don't run in the Control playlist. They probably didn't want to spread out the CP's too much. I like the change of pace on those, but playing TDM on huge maps can be dull. Gets hard to find people unless you know the hotspots. Although you can actually snipe.
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Post by iw5000 on Apr 13, 2015 10:57:57 GMT -5
Or they could have, you know, made maps that have longer sight lines so that it's less CQC focused. All that is going to happen is I am going to see primaries being used in ranges too short for their ideal usage. And Hand Cannons are going to be better than they already are now too. They can't fix maps at this point. Or least seem unwilling, although they did make one slight change to one PvP map on the C spawn. All in all, they seem be perfectly happy with very unbalanced Control mode maps.
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Apr 13, 2015 11:12:40 GMT -5
Yeah they seem quite reluctant to change it. I'd be more annoyed by it except flipping the spawns isn't too terribly hard. It just becomes a battle not only for B but for which ever spawn has the biggest advantage. I've had a lot of fun fighting over C on Blind Watch, even though it does give the team that spawns on that side an unfair advantage.
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 13, 2015 11:23:54 GMT -5
Or they could have, you know, made maps that have longer sight lines so that it's less CQC focused. All that is going to happen is I am going to see primaries being used in ranges too short for their ideal usage. And Hand Cannons are going to be better than they already are now too. They can't fix maps at this point. Or least seem unwilling, although they did make one slight change to one PvP map on the C spawn. All in all, they seem be perfectly happy with very unbalanced Control mode maps. Can't or won't? They may not be able to modify existing maps but they can add extra maps so that people use shotguns less without needing to look at special ammo that much. Yes, that will cost money but then other developers have given out substantial DLC for free, e.g. Epic Games with Unreal Tournament 3. Even the larger regular maps on Control appear to be on the slightly cramped when I think of the maps in COD4.
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Post by iw5000 on Apr 13, 2015 11:27:35 GMT -5
They modified the C spawn on that one Mars PvP map. Changed some windows. So they can definitely tweak some elements of the maps, moving zones around here and there, adjusting sightlines. But they don't do it.
I think all the Destiny control maps are tight. Right now, it's a shotgun lovers delight. All the control maps are mostly ridiculously easy to navigate and stay completely out of long sightlines. And if you get into a longer hall, area, you can simply nudge people out of the way with grenades, while you move in to kill. Which is why people who are sniping, are mostly useless. It's garbage playing imho, at least in Control. I know some people on here think that's good (Hawk's theory), but I would rather a person go 5-15 and cap 8 flags, than go 3-7 sniping in the corner of the map, just wasting space. Yes, he is dying more and maybe feeding them some kills...BUT... this person is also reducing MY time on the flags, allowing me to be less vunerable. That is the part Hawk misses. And here's the thing, if you have a 2-1 control on flags...it doesn't matter if that person dies an extra 5 to 8 times...the flag advantage neutralizes it. Do the math.
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 13, 2015 11:32:56 GMT -5
There are some, but the bigger maps don't run in the Control playlist. They probably didn't want to spread out the CP's too much. I like the change of pace on those, but playing TDM on huge maps can be dull. Gets hard to find people unless you know the hotspots. Although you can actually snipe. So they are pretty much not helping the situation with the shotgun use. I'd rather have a slightly dull map from time to time than having to put up with grenade spam on B on Firebase Delphi after 5 seconds of the match starting. What is this, Bungie's own take on Shipment or something? Couldn't they make some of the larger maps just 9v9 and have them in Control?
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mannon
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Post by mannon on Apr 13, 2015 11:51:02 GMT -5
For that matter just because you have a big map doesn't mean you have to have spread out CP's. Just look at Red Dead Redemption. All the matches were in locations on the big world map. They probably did have some out of bounds zones slapped around them, but for the most part you could get out and around quite a lot if you wanted to. But the spawns were tighter than the available play area so it kept the pace up. Hell even MW2 in TDM would prefer to spawn you fairly close to enemies most of the time to keep the pace up, so even something like Derail wouldn't be a complete snoozefest despite the size. (Lots of people still hated it... but that's beside the point.)
I think Bungie probably erred on the side of limiting snipers and wound up creating shotgun playgrounds. They may have also underestimated player mobility. On the other hand it really sounds to me like they always intended shotguns and snipers to be slightly OP compared to primaries but balanced more by ammo. It just didn't work out that way. I don't think we're ever going to see primaries and specials really balanced (performance-wise), because that's not the intent of specials.
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wings
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Post by wings on Apr 13, 2015 12:22:05 GMT -5
For that matter just because you have a big map doesn't mean you have to have spread out CP's. I'm assuming Bungie's had enough experience in making competitive multiplayer maps by now not to make maps that have too much dead space. If they made the maps have longer sight lines we might see players using a scout rifle more often.
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Post by TheHawkNY on Apr 13, 2015 12:24:08 GMT -5
Or maybe they just took the feedback from Alpha and Beta that people hated the big maps.
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Post by iw5000 on Apr 13, 2015 12:40:32 GMT -5
Well, again, the problem with Shotties is this. Even if you reduce ammo to say only five bullets...nothing changes for me. When I go blazing into the enemy areas, 2 to 3 bullets is typically all I need. One shot kills. I will be more than happy to get 2 to 3 kills, then die. Rinse and repeat.
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