wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 20, 2015 2:20:07 GMT -5
wings: I would love to hear how you are doing LFG for trials (if it is in general a positive experience), as I would like to do that sometime. I care much less about drops and more about the experience. I'll see which maps are in rotation, what gear I have, and if they have changed the currency to purchase the buffs or not. I saw a 'pop-up' on the Companion App that called Passage Coins by a different name, so I am hoping it is just a mistake over name rather than yet another currency to deal with.
|
|
qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
|
Post by qupie on Oct 20, 2015 5:02:58 GMT -5
As you still get passage coins for the daily crucible, I think it is extremely far fetched and negative to think they changed it. But you never know for sure.
|
|
wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 20, 2015 6:16:18 GMT -5
As you still get passage coins for the daily crucible, I think it is extremely far fetched and negative to think they changed it. But you never know for sure. I still get Etheric Light from Variks each week despite it serving no purpose now.
|
|
qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
|
Post by qupie on Oct 20, 2015 7:19:05 GMT -5
You are talking about old content. VoG also still gives you radiant shards, which are also pretty useless. The daily crucible rewards have been introduced with 2.0. Therefore I hope the fact that they give passage coins, means you can still use them. But we will see, it doesn't guarantee anything. Always assuming the negative outcome, doesn't really give a positive vibe though...
|
|
hebbnh
True Bro
Cacodemon expert
Posts: 2,688
|
Post by hebbnh on Oct 23, 2015 14:04:44 GMT -5
Hard mode world first was completed in 1 hour, 17 minutes. There are a few mechanic changes (no spoilers here!), but I expected more. I think we can knock most of it out if we get a group going Sunday night.
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 23, 2015 14:10:13 GMT -5
Hard mode world first was completed in 1 hour, 17 minutes. There are a few mechanic changes (no spoilers here!), but I expected more. I think we can knock most of it out if we get a group going Sunday night. That's inspiring and a little bit disappointing at the same time. Overall good news because faster trumps more interesting with Halo 5 and BLOPS3 coming up. I will do some scouting on Sunday before our get together, through LFG.
|
|
malgato
True Bro
Farm ammo, then everyone wipe.
Posts: 1,195
|
Post by malgato on Oct 23, 2015 14:56:15 GMT -5
Hard mode world first was completed in 1 hour, 17 minutes. There are a few mechanic changes (no spoilers here!), but I expected more. I think we can knock most of it out if we get a group going Sunday night. That's inspiring and a little bit disappointing at the same time. Overall good news because faster trumps more interesting with Halo 5 and BLOPS3 coming up. I will do some scouting on Sunday before our get together, through LFG. Does anyone else feel like Witty is cheating on us with strangers?
|
|
hebbnh
True Bro
Cacodemon expert
Posts: 2,688
|
Post by hebbnh on Oct 23, 2015 15:24:36 GMT -5
"You can look at the menu as long as you eat at home." -- Somebody
|
|
|
Post by Pegasus Actual on Oct 23, 2015 15:47:53 GMT -5
Maybe I should cheat on Witty first, especially since I'm going to be late on Sunday.
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 23, 2015 16:07:32 GMT -5
Maybe I should cheat on Witty first, especially since I'm going to be late on Sunday. That's unacceptable!!!! How late?!
|
|
|
Post by Pegasus Actual on Oct 23, 2015 16:13:04 GMT -5
Don't know witty. But likely tennis followed by food. Probably not before 6pm.
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 23, 2015 16:16:27 GMT -5
|
|
hebbnh
True Bro
Cacodemon expert
Posts: 2,688
|
Post by hebbnh on Oct 23, 2015 18:25:16 GMT -5
Hard mode world first was completed in 1 hour, 17 minutes. There are a few mechanic changes (no spoilers here!), but I expected more. I think we can knock most of it out if we get a group going Sunday night. Sounds like Oryx is going to be impossible for us. 310+ is almost a requirement for that fight from what I'm seeing on Reddit. Enemies there are 320 recommended.
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 23, 2015 18:36:05 GMT -5
Hard mode world first was completed in 1 hour, 17 minutes. There are a few mechanic changes (no spoilers here!), but I expected more. I think we can knock most of it out if we get a group going Sunday night. Sounds like Oryx is going to be impossible for us. 310+ is almost a requirement for that fight from what I'm seeing on Reddit. Enemies there are 320 recommended. There is always a chance that we got loot along the way that can push us to 310+. If 1 character can't do it, then rotate through other characters on the first a few checkpoints that we can beat. Realistically speaking though: looks like we have a very small time window on Sunday anyway, not to mention that we may not even be able to find 6 players.
|
|
markopolo
True Bro
Once a LMG Camper, Then a Voidlock, Now a Lexington 25-8-366 Runner
Posts: 5,567
|
Post by markopolo on Oct 24, 2015 16:57:59 GMT -5
I'm torn I really like elemental primaries, but I can see hiw ut diversifies the tactics needed and not having 2 weapons glued to your hand 90% of the time. It realky makes the mission modifier matchgame op though But it jyst means we have to be more coordinated Edit: or take the 20 level hit and equip the Vex/Fatebringer/WoC
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 24, 2015 21:30:07 GMT -5
HM changes:
Looks pretty straight forward, gettin thru at least Daughters should be fairly doable without having to reach 310+.
We can do that 2-3 times to get enough drops to go over 310, then take care of Oryx.
|
|
|
Post by Curious Corndog on Oct 24, 2015 23:22:36 GMT -5
I had a friend offer me a spot in Golgoroth - Oryx in the hard mode.
From what I saw, Golg is easy-peasy. All they added was a debuff that forces people out and more orbs to the gaze-runner. Daughters is practically exactly the same. They just made timers start instantly. And Orxy was unkillable. We had 307+, with me being the lowest at 306, and the Ogres died too slow, the Extra sprinkle of mechanic they added got killed too slow, and the adds ran rampant. Oryx was even hard to stagger with 6 ToMs.
Definitely a 310+ fight. If we can kill Ogres and light eater Knights on time we can do it, but we'll see. Might be one of those ones we have to work towards.
I'll be on tomorrow for HM as well.
|
|
wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 25, 2015 13:04:10 GMT -5
Wouldn't that make The Psion Flayers' Nightfall with Match Game unbearable because kinetic damage gets a damage reduction against shields? I tried it solo and that's what I thought was happening and it was too obnoxious so I bailed. I'd rather play no burn pre-nerf Valus Ta'aurc in year 1. If correct then this also places a bigger emphasis on swapping weapons with different elements during combat due to ammo loss upon swapping weapons. A lot of people just use Hung Jury for their primaries now anyway. That and Fatebringer and Vision of Confluence would have been good guns without their elements. And for Nightfalls in year 1 arc burn was the most popular burn modifier with 29 shows (void is next with 20 shows and solar with 18) and every arc shielded enemy had critical hit spots unlike void (e.g Minotaurs). It would be nice if the HM weapons had something going for them considering the lack of elemental primaries but I haven't seen anything worth bothering for. I'll probably do Oryx on HM in anticipation of a year 2 MoT emblem.
|
|
markopolo
True Bro
Once a LMG Camper, Then a Voidlock, Now a Lexington 25-8-366 Runner
Posts: 5,567
|
Post by markopolo on Oct 26, 2015 7:18:54 GMT -5
Wouldn't that make The Psion Flayers' Nightfall with Match Game unbearable because kinetic damage gets a damage reduction against shields? I tried it solo and that's what I thought was happening and it was too obnoxious so I bailed. I'd rather play no burn pre-nerf Valus Ta'aurc in year 1. If correct then this also places a bigger emphasis on swapping weapons with different elements during combat due to ammo loss upon Either: 1) don't solo, or 2) coordinate your layout to include each weapon type by equipping a Y1 elemental primary.
|
|
wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 26, 2015 8:07:35 GMT -5
Wouldn't that make The Psion Flayers' Nightfall with Match Game unbearable because kinetic damage gets a damage reduction against shields? I tried it solo and that's what I thought was happening and it was too obnoxious so I bailed. I'd rather play no burn pre-nerf Valus Ta'aurc in year 1. If correct then this also places a bigger emphasis on swapping weapons with different elements during combat due to ammo loss upon Either: 1) don't solo, or 2) coordinate your layout to include each weapon type by equipping a Y1 elemental primary. I only solo'd to see how bad solo play is. I usually play in a three but I was bored and I remembered Bungie being asked about solo players in Nightfall as they got shafted with the health of AIs. Now there's no kick to orbit I guess matchmaking could be feasible for Nightfalls. I assumed I would take too much of a damage output reduction to use a year 1 weapon for Nightfalls but I'll try it again some time. I sometimes use the MIDA Multi-tool for the Daily Heroic. My Vision of Confluence may get used more often then.
|
|
qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
|
Post by qupie on Oct 26, 2015 10:00:21 GMT -5
The last nightfall didn't have match game...
I did three of them within 90 minutes with LFG. Sorry but it was not hard at all. And I personally prefer balancing based on fireteams over balancing based on solo play. This game is suposed to be played with a fireteam after all. Especially the end game content.
Match game will be fine, you have your subclass, your secondairy and your heavy, that is already three damage types right there. And in every strike except flayers there is only two different elemental shields. I really don't see the problem.
|
|
wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 26, 2015 10:35:30 GMT -5
Weird, I must have been wearing a low armour piece somewhere. Easy enough since regular light level is still used.
However, I never said Nightfalls were hard, just bad. There is nothing hard when dealing with enemies that involve little to no mechanics where bosses are just epic bullet sponges.
Nightfalls are not end-game content really. That's the Raid.
|
|
qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
|
Post by qupie on Oct 26, 2015 11:22:48 GMT -5
Sorry but I don't see how bullet sponges are harder/easier than mechanics. This is probably not a popular opinion, but personally I feel like the Oryx fight is on the edge of going in the wrong direction. Don't get me wrong, I liked it. But mechanics are nice and all, but there is really not much left of FPS skill requirements. The only place where you actually need to hit fast and hard is the Shade of Oryx part. And that is also more of a gear check then anything else. I hope the next fight is at least a little bit more about actually killing stuff as well. I think Atheon was more fun than Oryx personally.
Seems like we are entirely playing different games again. Which nightfall boss has been a bullet sponge since TTK?
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 26, 2015 11:24:03 GMT -5
7 weeks since TTK is released, and played Raid hard mode whole day yesterday with 5 different groups (4 from LFG). So good time for
A reflection:
1) The strikes are incrementally better than Y1: strikes having a few variants, the removal of cheese to force teamwork, the more interesting boss fights than Ice-break-to-the-head-a-zillion-times-while-staying-alive / I-have-a-Gjallarhorn-so-this-is-easy-mode, the strike specific loot, the 3ofCs mechanism, etc.
However, at the end of the day it is still the same fight being played for loot. Without loot there is very little incentive to play it again. I may be very well be biased because Halo:CE is my first FPS game, but to this day I can still play that game on Legendary with my wife and have a lot of fun out of it. None of the Destiny non-raid content is giving me that.
2) King's Fall is a great raid: it has strong puzzle solving components so first run is a great adventure, it demands strong teamwork to get through even after players learn the mechanics, and it is LFG friendly in that I can drop into almost any LFM groups that have decent cohesion and expect to mingle right in after a couple of wipes.
Like the raids before it, it probably has at most two-month active life for players who raid on a regular basis: 1 month for NM and 1 month for HM.
3) Trials of Osiris is good end game PvP content, but unfortunately only for a minority set of dedicated fans. I already talked about this at lengths before so I'll spare everybody from wall of text. It suffices to say that Halo 5 and BLOPS 3 are much more appealing to me, with better PvP infrastructure, SBMM, and visible ranking system.
After playing the heck out of this game in the past 7 weeks, I don't have a lot left (until November update which hopefully will bring some fresh content):
a) Need to kill Oryx on hard, from all 3 of my characters, at ease; b) Complete the Crucible quest line, but only after they make it less grindy; c) Beat the Imprecation challenge. The best I have done so far is 5 precision kills in a single game, still some ways to go; d) Get Solar exotic sword, Chaperone, and No Time To Explain (as well as The First Curse from c), when I get around to it;
In general, I think that I can put this game on "maintenance mode" (~= per week: 1 dedicated raid night with time bound activities sprinkled across different week days) at this juncture, which is great because we are now at the eve of Halo 5 launch and BLOPS 3 is coming next Friday, and also has "The Devision" I would like to experience beta in December.
|
|
qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
|
Post by qupie on Oct 26, 2015 11:30:11 GMT -5
About the strikes, it gets stale after a while, I agree. But I rarely reach that point. It probably helps that I am only able to play on weekends since Februari. The real bummer is that the older strikes are not in the playlists. Serious noob move from bungie there imho. The only result of that is that people got bored with the new strikes faster... real shame.
|
|
wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 26, 2015 14:05:01 GMT -5
Sorry but I don't see how bullet sponges are harder/easier than mechanics. This is probably not a popular opinion, but personally I feel like the Oryx fight is on the edge of going in the wrong direction. Don't get me wrong, I liked it. But mechanics are nice and all, but there is really not much left of FPS skill requirements. The only place where you actually need to hit fast and hard is the Shade of Oryx part. And that is also more of a gear check then anything else. I hope the next fight is at least a little bit more about actually killing stuff as well. I think Atheon was more fun than Oryx personally. Seems like we are entirely playing different games again. Which nightfall boss has been a bullet sponge since TTK? Oh I think VoG did better than KF regarding mechanics, lethality and health of enemy combatants, as well as shooter skills. Some of the supplicants in the KF raid might as well not be there given how lame they are at trying to take you out. If strikes ended up having some doses of mechanics whilst retaining the need for a high proficiency in shooter skills I'd be playing them more frequently. In terms of "endgame" content, most people thought Skolas was it during House of Wolves but I would probably say Qodron because of the combat demands required. For Nightfall, the Nexus could probably be my favourite if it wasn't so cramped. I guess Valus Tlu'urn seems to have too much health but I expect the Cabal to be epic bullet sponges. Should have made the Vex teleport the Dreadnaught into safety and let Valus Tlu'urn and Valus Mau'ual avenge Primus Ta'aun. Only strike during year 1 I hated for too much health was Omnigul. If year 1 strikes were added to the Weekly Heroic and Nightfalls, I'd be much more tempted to play them. I would be interested in playing The Nexus with some of the new perks, and who doesn't like Sepiks Prime? I do prefer the Atheon fight to Oryx although VoG has gear checks too with the Oracle stage of the Atheon fight.
|
|
wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
|
Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 27, 2015 20:07:56 GMT -5
Killed Oryx on hard mode already?
Congrats but you are not done yet:
|
|
Dumien
True Bro
Black Market Trader
No engrams. Only disappointment.
Posts: 3,292
|
Post by Dumien on Oct 28, 2015 9:31:42 GMT -5
Ok Guys...so I've played HM quite a bit...with 6-7 clears under my belt at this point. This was by far the easiest HM raid to date. I'm looking forward to the challenges. I'll just give you my best advice and warn you about some common misconceptions that bandwaggony places like reddit might hand you.
Light 111 is the magic number. At the oryx fight you want 4-6 people at that number. It obviously isn't required, but it makes the fight worlds easier.
War Priest's best strat is to fight in center and then right side. The middle rock only gives him hobgoblin homers...which is way better than the alternatives (captain blind balls on right and centurion seekers on left).If you need three rounds of DPS I recommend fighting again on the right side and going all in on that round. You should only need 2 rounds though.
Golgoroth is simple, but requires a lighter touch than normal mode. All fighting should now take place at the enterence area of the map. Ping down the adds from afar and then push up to clear the two hiding adepts. You can six orb it, but it is a bit more hectic with the unstable light debuff and the added cursed thrall spawns.
The single orb strat is superior this time around. It is safe and strong. Pick an orb. Down it and pull aggro every time. Make sure you clean up all the cursed thralls during the add clearing phase...since even a single orb will liter the middle with cursed thrall. If you have an extra nightstalker this is a perfect time for bloodbound to get your teamates all the orbs.
No Time to Explain is very good here as well which is pretty neat...competing with the likes of spindle/sleeper.
Daughters feel like the most drastic mechanics change out of all the fights...and yet I find it to be the simplest. Two rounding it works if you feel like you have a team of competent jumpers.
The longer this fight goes the more difficult it gets. It is better to just try for the simple 2 minute win. I have seen more groups fail by trying to 3/4 cycle because the most difficult thing is resetting and add clearing. Cutting it to two rounds eliminates that step.
The key is to do all your shooting of a daughter on the opposite daughter's middle step. After getting the relic have everyone convene on that middle step. Down her fast...saving some of your best stuff for the far more important round 2. It you did it right you should have enough time (10ish seconds) to clear out all the adds in the room. Reset quickly and you should have more than enough time to down daughter 2 with judicious use of ammo/supers.
For Oryx many people will tell you to do the safe strategy of killing the ogres after DPSing Oryx. The gist is basically to have your add clearer and floater jump between deathsinger platforms and slightly damage each ogre instead of killing them. The platform steppers simply avoid the ogres and jump to deathsinger platform opposite of Oryx. The relic runner will also convene there. At this point you have the vessel running all around the ground area with no light to eat because the ogres aren't dead. Everyone waits for oryx to open up and then you DPS him down as a team. When he staggers you quickly finish all 4 ogres and have four people jump directly to the blighted light. The relic guy and add clearer jump down to the middle with relic guy constantly damaging oryx to keep his tummy open. When everything detonates have everyone run to the aura to survive. Presto. Rinse and Repeat.
This is basically an upgraded version of the Two-man strategy for normal mode oryx. I actually think this strategy has merit, but only if your lack of light level inclines you to do so...and there is another reason...but I will get to that later. Reddit loves this strat...let's look at the pros and cons.
Pros: Eliminates post-Ogre add clearing. This includes light eater knights AND acolye/centurion spawns since they are both triggered by ogre deaths. Eliminates stress and light requirements on the three platform steppers since the ogres are not downed where the are spawned. Eliminates the need for a titan bubble in the center area. Eliminates tomb ship problems since it can only shoot below itself and the deathsinger platforms are above it. Eliminates the need to kill the vessel of oryx
Wow that is alot... what could possibly be bad about the strat?
Cons: Increased stress on the relic runner. His time table is moved up a few seconds because the ogres get free reign over the middle of the map. Increased stress on add clearer and floater. Most ogre damage will be coming from add clearer. Upgraded sleeper, good light level, and a good sniper are requisite. Also you need to get lucky with ammo drops. The Ogres get free reign. While the platform steppers can hide, the runner cannot. Sometimes the ogres will aggro and just kill the runner.
That last bit is why I am not a fan of this strat. No matter how good you get at the strat you will still sometimes just lose a run to something you can't control. However, I feel like it has very real application as it is a far better 4-5 man strategy than the original method. This means you can use it as a backup strategy to SAVE a solid run if a player or two dies.
The other strategy is just an update version of the common normal mode strat.
Simply have the player whose platform has the relic above it be that round's "floater" tasked with assisting the add clearer in his/her duties. This is needed to down Ogres fast. Just give special attention to the ogres on the side with only three people (one plat stepper + add cleaner + floater) as opposed to the side that gets four (two plat steppers + add cleaner + floater). This means using sleeper shots + grenades + super. If your add clearer is a titan have them pop a weapons/blessing bubble when oryx first slams his fist.
Each platform stepper is tasked with killing the knight that spawns opposite of them (floater included). Relic runnner+add cleaner are tasked with slaying Vessel.
The DPS check is going to be more difficult until people learn how to control the chaos of the light eater knights. They are more of a distraction than anything...and force everyone to understand the timing of the spawns. Kill them early and you won't have a problem. Kill them late and you might have a problem at the Oryx DPS check because everyone isn't there to shoot the tummy. Remember it is better to lose an orb and 5 cycle him than it is to lose an entire run to a failed DPS check. It is best to have the relic runner call out Oryx's fist slam and give a countdown for shooting the tummy.
After DPSing oryx down just spend 5-7 seconds clearing adds...mainly acolytes/centurions. Get to your orbs and get back to the aura.
Let's talk Pros and Cons again
Pros: Nothing is really left to chance and the duties are more evenly balanced. If you die it is probably someone's fault. This means that getting better at the fight and getting a higher light level will lead to a higher success rate.
Cons: You have to deal with all the adds. You can lose to people who can't follow the directions of the relic runner when he says "Shoot the tummy!"
Lastly.... Sleeper Stimulant is amazing for this fight. It trivialized ogres. Defenders, sunsingers, and nightstalkers are all good too.
|
|
malgato
True Bro
Farm ammo, then everyone wipe.
Posts: 1,195
|
Post by malgato on Oct 29, 2015 10:02:08 GMT -5
|
|
wings
True Bro
Posts: 3,776
|
Post by wings on Oct 29, 2015 16:30:51 GMT -5
Besides the sniper rifle, which of the King's Fall weapons are actually worth keeping? My Warlock is 299 and I might infuse any dud weapons from the Raid if it gets me to 300 so I can get a chance for 310 Exotics in Nightfalls.
|
|