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Post by crashboyd148 on Nov 30, 2015 16:05:50 GMT -5
Here's my question I was doing the raid on hard mode with sisters I dyed my team finished off the sister I didn't get to respond until after the chest appeared my question is can I go back in do sisters again and still get the chest
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wittyscorpion
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 30, 2015 16:25:57 GMT -5
Here's my question I was doing the raid on hard mode with sisters I dyed my team finished off the sister I didn't get to respond until after the chest appeared my question is can I go back in do sisters again and still get the chest If you got kicked out of fireteam before the rewards, you should be able to. To be sure, check companion app to see if you have cleared the CP. If you are in-game, just load the raid solo and see whether you are at the beginning of Sisters or Oryx.
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qupie
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Post by qupie on Dec 1, 2015 11:00:36 GMT -5
Define "respond". If you re spawned after the sisters died, you still got the chest.
So if respond is "got kicked" than yes, you have to kill them again. As you didn't actually kill them.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Dec 1, 2015 18:27:43 GMT -5
I hate typing on my mobile device, but last night I pugged with some good guys and we were mostly 308-311's
Tried no knight, kept wiping from stupid shit... Went to the Kill your Ogre& knight strategy and only wiped due player fault (dying, not being coordinated enough, missed jumps, falling oiff platforms, all just player fuckups)
3 words for KF HM at Oryx: Don't. Fucking. Die.
Regardless of strategy, everyone has to be on the same page, know their role, and execute. No dead weight allowed. And it's fucking awesome. My drops were piss poor and I didn't give 2 craps. Total awesome feeling beating oryx on hard.
Know your role, execute your role, don't die. Communication is just as important as killing as is staying alive.
All I want to do is beat it again
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Dec 1, 2015 20:33:13 GMT -5
All I want to do is beat it again You'll go blind.
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wings
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Post by wings on Dec 1, 2015 20:48:50 GMT -5
3 words for KF HM at Oryx: Don't. Foxtroting. Die. Regardless of strategy, everyone has to be on the same page, know their role, and execute. No dead weight allowed. And it's Foxtroting awesome. My drops were piss poor and I didn't give 2 craps. Total awesome feeling beating oryx on hard. Know your role, execute your role, don't die. Communication is just as important as killing as is staying alive. All I want to do is beat it again Wait until Challenge Mode comes out for Oryx. If you're interested in the Challenge Modes, I'd suggest being a good runner because I'm pretty confident everyone will be required to perform a relic run during Oryx. I did the Warpriest Challenge earlier. I got two machine guns, two artifacts (the 310 has Int/Dis, the 320 has Dis/Str), and Worm Gods' Servant emblem.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Dec 1, 2015 21:11:42 GMT -5
3 words for KF HM at Oryx: Don't. Foxtroting. Die. Regardless of strategy, everyone has to be on the same page, know their role, and execute. No dead weight allowed. And it's Foxtroting awesome. My drops were piss poor and I didn't give 2 craps. Total awesome feeling beating oryx on hard. Know your role, execute your role, don't die. Communication is just as important as killing as is staying alive. All I want to do is beat it again Wait until Challenge Mode comes out for Oryx. If you're interested in the Challenge Modes, I'd suggest being a good runner because I'm pretty confident everyone will be required to perform a relic run during Oryx. I did the Warpriest Challenge earlier. I got two machine guns, two artifacts (the 310 has Int/Dis, the 320 has Dis/Str), and Worm Gods' Servant emblem. Question 1. Was all that from 1 run? 2. Do you have to kill him in 2 rounds? I know 2 people have to have the aura; can 3 have it (3 rounds with 3 different people?)
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Dec 1, 2015 21:12:40 GMT -5
All I want to do is beat it again You'll go blind. I'd be blinder than Stevie Wonder decades ago if that was true
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wings
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Post by wings on Dec 1, 2015 21:21:46 GMT -5
Wait until Challenge Mode comes out for Oryx. If you're interested in the Challenge Modes, I'd suggest being a good runner because I'm pretty confident everyone will be required to perform a relic run during Oryx. I did the Warpriest Challenge earlier. I got two machine guns, two artifacts (the 310 has Int/Dis, the 320 has Dis/Str), and Worm Gods' Servant emblem. Question 1. Was all that from 1 run? 2. Do you have to kill him in 2 rounds? I know 2 people have to have the aura; can 3 have it (3 rounds with 3 different people?) 1. That loot was from one run from the Warpriest specifically. 2. You can do it in three cycles. Should this happen you may need to shuffle players to grab the aura since two players from one area can take the aura after each other. You could have people placing themselves near the doors on the floor where the Hive come through to avoid accidentally claiming the aura.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Dec 1, 2015 21:28:50 GMT -5
1. That loot was from one run from the Warpriest specifically.. Hard mode, right?
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wings
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Post by wings on Dec 1, 2015 21:35:35 GMT -5
1. That loot was from one run from the Warpriest specifically.. Hard mode, right? Yes. It's the only way to get double loot drops.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Dec 2, 2015 7:33:01 GMT -5
Yes. It's the only way to get double loot drops. Omfg, so right.... 1 totems run and 2 WP chalenge took me from 307.75 to 311... I forget but at least 3 320 weapons, 2 316/7, 2 320 artifacts And wasn't that hard... At all. First time to get it down was a bit... 2nd/3rd alt runs were 15 minutes each
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wings
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Post by wings on Dec 2, 2015 9:49:58 GMT -5
Helped someone on my friends list try with Oryx NM and we got teleported before the rockets/running stage.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Dec 16, 2015 15:48:49 GMT -5
Dumien: I would like to hear your counter arguments of why you hate this strat with passion. After I played with a LFG team using it last night, it seems to me that this is an easier strat (or at least just as viable as the other strat). So this rant/guide was written originally in response to this, but I thought better of posting it. People should do what they want to do how they want to do it. I want you guys to win challenge mode so I'm just going to info everything I know/remember about the oryx into one post. I also updated with tidbits on the challenge mode fight. Enjoy. ************************************************************************* Look. I have a bit of time to write atm so I'll talk a bit about ideals. I'm going to preface this by saying "try whatever strategy you want." Just understand that it is better to learn something consistent and thus repeatable because in the long run you are going to save time. Time is the essence of it. I have no doubt that using one of these stats with enough time will get you a win. But enough about that tired argument. Let us highlight the random elements in each strat because that is entirely what I am concerned with. 1) With normal strat you have the randomness of platform order. I'm going to get a bit technical, but bear with me. You asked for this. We are going to call the platform closest to oryx's spawn on the left (from the perspective of entering the encounter) "L2" with the platform on the left closest to the entrance called "L1." We then reflect this to the right side as well with R2 and R1. With me? OK The element of randomness that is most dangerous and difficult to avoid is not the ogres OR the knights. It is the acolyte eyes and centurions that spawn. Let me qualify that. The ogres are entirely manageable with a number of configurations that I will detail later on. The knights are two headshots with a decent sniper. The are also easy picking for titan hammers and golden guns. A decently leveled sleeper will one shot headshot them. The real issue is the unattended centurions and acolytes. The time in which this is the most dangerous are precisely in platform patterns L2-L1-R1-R2 and R1-R2-L2-L1. Let us look at the first case. R2 platformer is floating. R1 is first ogre and when his ogre dies he has to down the knight... however, the centurions and acolytes spawn with it. It is almost impossible to deal with the entirety of that... though hammers really help (which is why my group positions a hammer titan at R1). This means that normally the adds will have alot of time to wreak havoc on your team because the add cleaner and float spend the next 10 or so seconds dealing with L1 and R1. Here, poor L2 is all alone. The most dangerous moment arrives when you have to deal with the final ogre. You only have three people to down it AND you might have acolyte eyes and centurions firing at you. The add spawning is also disjointed and potentially confusing since the time between ogre 1 at L2 and ogre 4 at R2 is quite long. The point is L2 is isolated from the rest of the team (thus drawing aggro) for a meaningful portion of the round. So take all that and replace that pattern with R1-R2-L2-L1. In this case R1 is in trouble. Being aware of and recognizing these situations are key to not dying. It is more than reasonable to seek help if you are struggling with this. 2) Platform order itself. We just talked about the dangerous patterns. The order is always counterclockwise, but oryx's first slam is random (L2 or R2). You can't really effectively shelter your lower light level or less experienced players. Or can you. Recently a strategy has developed that I really took a liking to. It is smart and efficient in that it simply minimizes the randomness in the "kill knights" strategy rather than taking a fundamentally different approach to the engagement. One might even say it is "strictly better" that the current strategy simply because it more accurately describes roles and controls the chaos just a little bit more. I'll describe said strat (you might have heard about it) The requirements are thus: 2 defender titans, 1 nighthawk gunslinger, 3 other classes. Ideally you want your gunslinger to be your runner. Let's talk roles. 1: Defender titan running weapons of light built with max INT. Exotic weapon is Touch of malice 2: Defender titan running blessing of light built with max INT. Exotic weapon is touch of malice 3: Gunslinger Hunter running nighthawk golden gun built with max INT. Exotic weapon is touch of malice. 4: Guardian with decent sniper 5: Guardian with decent sniper 6: Guardian with decent sniper 1 and 2 place bubbles simultaneously in the center (with duration perk) on Oryx slam. Fade in and out of the bubbles while tearing through ogres. When ogres are dead help with the final two knights. 3 grabs relic. Steals aura. Runs to center (overlapping titan bubble). Golden Guns the Vessel. DPSs Oryx for the rest of the round. 4 always takes the platform oryx slams on. 5 always takes the platform diagonal from oryx's slam 6 always takes the platform diagonal from the relic. Ahaha. See how this is better? You get to tech two people to kill the ogres as fast as possible. You can stuff your lower light level or less experienced player at 6 since they will almost always get the most assistance (trust me here). The only downside here is that the platformers need to do more than the normal ammount of mental processing at every round. IMO The reason alot of people aren't doing this strategy is because the majority of people are platformers that don't want to get out of their comfort zone. 3) Oryx's "You run away now" attack I see this phase as a real punishment for not getting all four detonations two times in a row. Fighting the shade is easy peasy compared to the nonsensical deaths I have witnessed and been a part of at this phase of the encounter. You can die to lips. You can die to knights super fast for no reason. Sometimes the explosion just ends you for no reason. The randomness in this phase cannot be avoided but it can be mitigated by running smart half circles around platforms. L2 and R1 seem the easiest to stuff two people at. Also you can just have a perfect run and only have to see this phase once. Challenge mode actually completely eliminates this phase which is why many of my peers tell me they are going to kill Oryx this way from now on. Fighting the shade almost always refills your ammo/super and gets you chances for exotic engrams (if you are into that sort of thing). Now... let's get to the randomness in the "don't kill knights" strat Ogres are like...really really good at changing aggro. Yeah you can stun lock them. Yeah you can hide from them. However even the best groups still wipe with this strategy because sometimes you run it PERFECTLY and it doesn't work. This is exactly why it isn't a "cheese." It isn't a guaruntee and challenge mode is proof that it isn't a rewarding strategy to learn. Now you have kids complaining on reddit that their way doesn't work for oryx challenge mode. Note that this was a strategy directly adapted from an early duo strategy. You want to know what that strategy didn't do? It didn't grab the relic. Ever. That was never part of the plan. People just tacked it on so it would work for 6 man. The runner has to fly down from the relic platform with 4 ogres alive and PRAY that none of them are currently aggroed. Oh Well... I'm done with that rant. Now the challenge mode guide. Kill ogres where they stand. The 2 floater strategy I mentioned above is ideal. Sleeper or Touch double bubble will work. I like one guy on sleeper one guy on touch personally. Sleeper just has way too much versitility throughout the fight and if you spec your titan with ruin wings or arma you should have more than enough ammo to put down anything you need to put down. Platformers have it easier than normal. The run to blight phase is eliminated until the 4th round. This is another reason the strategy is appealing to run as a non-challenge mode strat. It ends up being safer for platformers. On the last round if someone dies it isn't AS big a deal than if they died in the 2nd or 3rd round with another strategy; the rest of the team will most likely have enough DPS to finish the job. Runner's job is the same. On the last round put those adds down super fast. Waste all that heavy. Make sure you are super safe. Win. Just tips in general. Throwing stickys on the shade really helps freshly teleported people see where he is. If you need to pop heavy before a run, put on Y1 raid boots for more heavy ammo. Pop heavy then switch to your Y2 boots. You will have more heavy than normal. If you are super sneaky you can do this on the challenge mode strat while you are in the invincibility bubble and all the adds are dead. Pegasus can attest that I did this. Don't underestimate anti-taken weapons. I use yasmin as my sniper of choice for this fight. Its burst and ROF are fantastic here even if it sucks everywhere else. If your runner can run with nighthawk/gunslinger they should. It one shots the vessel and completely eliminates a pressure point. Alternatively they can use raze lighter for a nice 3 shot. Don't be afraid to run weapons of light. Blessing is good, but if you don't have the juice to down the ogres where they stand then what is the point? Defender Titans don't need to be floating to have bubbles in the center. Oh snap. This is one alot of people don't understand. If for whatever reason you have a defender titan with less than adequate gear OR you have a person who just has amazing gear for add cleaning, then you can have the defender titan pop a bubble 3-5 seconds before oryx slams and then run to his platform. The bubble is literally the only reason people insist on have defenders in the middle....soooo just put the bubble there. The defender doesn't NEED to be there. Warlocks are not useless. Solar grenades completely lock down an ogre and prevent them from moving. Alchemist Raiments let you throw LOTS of grenades. If you are sunsinger be hyper aware of someone complaining that they couldn't kill their knight. You might need to run out there, draw some aggro, and lay down some firey justice with a sword...you can always just res. If you are super duper confident you can "take one for the team" and let the shade slam you...then immediately self res. Nightstalkers shouldn't be dying. Smoke grenades let you run from danger point A to safe point B all fight long. High strength builds are more important than high int here if you are struggling with staying alive.
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Dec 16, 2015 16:49:19 GMT -5
L2 and R2 seem pretty clean as far as getting an angle on your knight from pretty much anywhere on your platform. Where I've struggled is L1 and R1. Especially R1. It seems like I have to go to almost the point of falling off the back of the platform to get the slightest angle, at which point a bunch of adds will be hammering me. When I was getting my two clears with Dumien and the rest of the Make-A-Wish foundation R1 is where I had all of my close calls. Once 95% dead and just barely getting in the selfish blessing bubble after a pure luck sniper shot on the vessel, and another time just bailing and trying to down the light-eater in transition, and just barely finishing him as he was pouring BBQ sauce onto his blights. If I were running my Nightstalker I feel like my only chance would be to smoke bomb in the middle and hope I could line up my shot along the back before I decloak and get instagibbed. I think I only got L1 like once across those runs with you guys, but it seems like it's easier for L1 to get both knights than it is for R1 to get his. One time I think L1 got mine while I was on R1, but I nearly died as there was no call out, and it was impossible to tell if he had been killed, or if he was just obscured, so I was taking extra shots looking for him. There's so much shit in the way, when he spawns you seem to only see him if you strafe all the way to your left, but once he gets moving your angle will be on the other side. I can't emphasize enough how much I hate R1. Now, I haven't had the opportunity to test it, but I feel like L1 and R1 would be better served just swapping responsibilities. Ogre angles are trivial. A grenade or rocket behind your platform plus some happy strafing with a scout rifle seems like it would do the trick, and give you the opportunity to quickly down any eyes that spawn in at inopportune times, and just in general allow you to not have to soak up as much damage. You'd also have a much better angle on him to finish him off if you need to retreat towards the middle. Cross-sniping there just seems bad as you can't guarantee a particularly clear shot, and the shot you do get you are very likely to get some good old fashioned damage viewkick at the worst possible moment. Or maybe Dumien needs to just tell me I'm crazy here and link to a video where someone who knows what they're doing takes care of the R1 cross knight easily and consistently.
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malgato
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Post by malgato on Dec 16, 2015 19:29:25 GMT -5
TL;DR
;P
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Dec 17, 2015 4:07:17 GMT -5
Pegasus ActualI think you might be right...in which case the person with the most confidence/best gear between L1/R1 should be taking L1. You exposed a major gap in my knowledge since I never played on either of those two platforms. I often kill those knights myself without thinking about it.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Dec 18, 2015 10:22:21 GMT -5
If anyone still hasn't figured out exactly what they should be doing and when, there's this beautiful 6 POV vid that shows exactly what needs to be done:
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Dec 18, 2015 17:15:08 GMT -5
Also...we all suck. Definitely worth a watch. The amount of perfect timing and teamwork in this video is astounding. Also the final DPS check with 4 nighthawks is pretty.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Dec 19, 2015 9:24:00 GMT -5
They should have called it All Abilities Oryx Kill.
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Dec 20, 2015 6:46:14 GMT -5
Honestly the six man video kind of sucks. First of all. They put in the effort for the lame Star Wars intro and talk about it being the ultimate guide. Then it pops up. 6 tiny screens. No sound. Crummy annotations. Anyway, if you want to see a struggle snipe, watch upper right starting at 7:30. He got nothing but the shoulder, and by the time the light-eater started running he was getting hammered and had to go. Giving up on his knight was definitely the right call at that point, but I think he should have cloaked for the trip back to up his survival odds. He should have waited on the sniper shot a bit longer, it's very hard to be patient there, but the shoulder shot Foxtrots you on that platform. You need to get him in the head. Actually he should have used his cloak bomb and patience in concert. He would have been able to get a headshot in easily then. Since that was the platform I was complaining about above, I will mention that my biggest problem with it before is I didn't think he would go to the left. It seemed like I'd hit him in the shoulder or something, and he'd go to my right and become very difficult to pick up in the pillars. Upper left and bottom right help take him out eventually. Not annotated of course. The no sound thing is ridiculous. Put your communications on there, jesus. And maybe sound mixed in at low volume from one of the players. And shit, the layout is garbage. Don't do 3 columns of 2, do 2 columns of 3, and crop a little bit off the sides of each screens, and squish them horizontally a little so they fill up the screen. Anyway, enough about that. wings sounded like he was disappointed that I wasn't planning on posting about our raid experience. I mean it wasn't all things considered super interesting. Once Dumien got in and switched to 4th light-eater murderer mode we mostly had it, but just never got over the hump. Some bad luck here and there and some bad deaths. Titan guy in the middle probably could have been better about refreshing his bubble buffs. He died quite a bit there. My biggest fail was getting chopped twice by the shade... god, was that during the third shade too? Anyway the team definitely wasn't strong enough to handle a round down a man unfortunately, there were a couple of opportunities to do it. I'm trying to figure out in hindsight how I could have saved the situation. I turned tail and ran. Randomly unleashing my triple jump begging for a blessing bubble on and hoping I would survive what the shade gave me. I can't remember if my smoke grenade was up. Would that have gotten the shade off of me? I honestly have no clue. But it's good thing to know in case of emergency. One thing that could have saved me had I had a clearer head would be getting my Doom of Chelchis Life Support to proc. I can't recall for sure but I think there were some thrall in there. I should have shot them. Dumien mentioned Dark Soulsing him at some point which I think involved jumping over his head to avoid the shot. I don't know if that was warlock specific. Maybe I should have gone for an over the head jump. I don't know. I didn't really get the wings relic running as far as grabbing the thing, then going to the middle and hanging out till he got close. To me it makes more sense to just go get him right away and get that invincibility. Seems like that would have saved a death or two from disappearing bubbles and people having no protection, not to mention being able to pick off the vessel earlier. He seemed to always survive to the DPS check, and I think the ensuing chaos cost at least a couple of DPS gets. I know if you go out to get him you might get blasted and killed with some bad luck, but I still think it's better odds. Plus I'm pretty sure that's how @theb22 rolls, and thebb22 is the finest and most refined of all the Hebb brothers #teamtara. Overall I really didn't think they were bad runs for the most part. Definitely better than what the pure DenBros LFG thread raids are delivering on this fight overall. Fighting the shade was kind of a close call in the wings group. In ours getting the shade was the exception, not the rule. I got tons of valuable learning in from the handful of relic runs I tried, and all the platform reps, so I'm grateful for that. Aside from my armchair platform snipering of the guy from the lame ass 6-man video which hebbnh, the coarse, unrefined rapscallion of a Hebb that he is, posted... ok, so if you bail on your platform, the final platform where the dunky ball hangs out doesn't disappear right? Or maybe it does but the dunky ball itself stays. Or maybe there's just enough lag time to where I wasn't messing up the entire run going when I went. Especially when you're on platform 3... sometimes you just have to bail. Towards the end I stopped waiting for the callout to get down and would peek at wings and go as soon as he was in the air to the last platform. That actually buys a lot of time and made the difference between life and death on a couple of occasions. Also crouching. Crouch crouch crouch crouch. I'm assuming that your lower radar signature when crouching has something to do with getting less aggro or something? It seemed to make waiting for my sniper shots a lot more bearable. My opinion of difficulty level of platforms: R1>L1>L2>R2. Doing R2 when assigned platform 1 was by far my favorite place to be. It's just fantastic. I shoot at my ogre with my Doom of Chelchis. Since he's ogre 1, plat 2 guy on L2 is contributing along with both ogre cleaners. He completely melts. The light-eater doesn't spawn right away, so I get to empty the rest of my Chelchis into ogre 2. Then two easy sniper shots to kill my light eater. At this point L2's knight still isn't spawned in. I reload my Black Spindle. Even if I use all three shots though, the stupid cocoon timer will not elapse, so I usually end up switching back and go straight into the reload animation. I guess I can be more patient since there's a cocoon sound now and can just switch when I hear that. But I can just dump Chelchis shots into the L1's knight and he'll be dead before he manages five steps. L1 guy can completely botch his shots (which honestly he did a few times despite it also being a super easy shot). As for platform jobs in general, I don't know. I think 2 is easiest overall. You will never be on a side by yourself. You're not 3, so you will have a decent amount of time to down your knight and get out of there safely. BTW looking back on this thread I realize I'm echoing a point Dumien made, but hey you read a wall of text and not everything sinks in. Getting the reps helps. 1 is even easier in many cases, for a similar reason. But when you're 1 and on your own where you feel responsible for light-eater 4 as well can be pretty rough. I can handle it fine on that R2 side for the most part, but if it's L1. That's tough. I'll just say it's good to have Post running around in Sunsinger "Witness Me" mode for that knight #4. Actually that's kind of a point of confusion for me. In general who is actually responsible for #4? #1/#3 I guess? Who calls it out if it goes wrong? What do the ogre cleaners typically look for right as ogre four goes down? In general I thought callouts were a little lacking on that attempt. I never knew how other people were doing on their knights if I didn't have eyes on it myself. I never knew when someone got the vessel down unless it was me or Post. One last thing I'll mention is that I had severely underrated the raid LMG. I'd rather snipe the shade, but if you struggle with finding him quickly and then ADSing with a sniper rifle it's pretty decent easy damage. I'd snipe when he was outside, and LMG during the charge phase. Whenever I did that, the shade didn't get all that close to doxology. I think it's also the ideal weapon for cutting down a light-eater from the middle if you failed on your platform. Touch of malice kicks too much, and it's too hard to see your target. Between that and the murdering yourself while trying to use a bubble that is about to burst... I just didn't love it. LMG you can cut him down without worrying about going for precision shots, and you can just cut through a couple of adds if they get in the way. I have not been using this thing enough. In conclusion, raiding with more than one British-accented person makes you feel like you're in the Beatles. tags for wittyscorpion and malgato. Hey witty, if you don't have time to read, then you don't have time to raid
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Dec 20, 2015 15:15:15 GMT -5
He has the same "weakness" as Crota. His attack has no hitbox directly above him.If you somehow get hit while in the air you usually get launched back and away. Therefore the best possible strategy is to have a warlock try to jump over him as soon as he charges in. If you succeed you get more time to DPS since he spends less him in the circle chasing people. If you fail you have self res AND you still get more time to DPS him.
One of the major inconsistencies that group had was failing to kill the thrall or just being slow in killing trash mobs in general. I think that was probably because they were fatigued after trying for so long. Killing all the thrall (and you can camp the spawns btw...I have no idea why people were hanging out in the middle shooting from afar) will let you DPS the shade more.
The other problem was that you had a 310 titan on DPS duty. I blame myself. I noticed this too late. He honestly should have switched with the guy that dropped the bubble and ran to his platform. We definitely needed more damage and I definitely needed to use more sniper ammo than usual. This would have almost completely eliminated any ogre slaying issues AND we would have been able to win on the 4th round when we were down a man. Plus...he kept dying while on the edge of the blessing bubble because acolyte eyes/centurion blasts kept wrecking him. Oh well. My bad.
I have no idea who would tell the relic runner to "wait" but they are just wrong. You get that relic as fast as possible. You should be able to rip the aura from the knight AS he spawns. Grabbing it early means so much to platform 3 and 4. Also being able to slay Mr. Vessel with a sword or nighthawk is a big plus since he ends up attracting alot of attention from people that could otherwise be doing more meaningful things with their time. And believe me...I'm not understating the relic runner's job. They have the job that is most heavily tied to failure; If they fail it results in a wipe. Tough stuff.
All that said...you guys did really good at knight slaying and killing the vessel when I was an orb. Getting in "the reps" as Pegasus said does actually matter here. The only reason I can run around willy nilly during the fight is because I've played it enough that I know when everything is happening. Eventually you get an inner clock that just tells you where you need to be because X event happened.
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wings
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Post by wings on Dec 20, 2015 16:41:46 GMT -5
I'd have gone for the Vessel more often if I had supporting grenades, since our sole tether is for the Shade, directed at the adds surrounding the Vessel. I did this in a previous session but I got killed before planting the Aura. That session lasted about four hours so it seems people were tiring. I know I was and I had about an hour sleep before getting to work. I don't usually bail until the host wants to and I was surprised he stayed for as long as he did because he is one hour ahead of me. I know I need more practice at running so I can land as close to the Vessel as possible but I'm usually on a platform since I've basically mained the Titan since TTK and I usually survive there much longer. I guess I could have swapped to a Warlock.
Edit: Learned a slight variation to doing the Raid today - two Titan bubbles with Weapons and Blessing of Light on the floor between the two Daughter platforms using Touch of Malice to down the Ogres, 4th Knight and grab the Vessel's attention to stop him going to a blight. Think if I knew that yesterday, we might have had the challenge done.
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Dec 21, 2015 4:00:32 GMT -5
I don't know if I'm following your variation. If that's the variation, what was the original plan? I thought double bubble + ToM was pretty standard. There were bubbles there when Dumien was on ogres yes? I really don't like using ToM in that fight personally from the platforms. But maybe I should suck it up and infuse it. I don't know, I have an extra 320 Chelchis now, and a 320 Drystan that are in obvious need of feeding to something... but still not sure what. If shooting the vessel is the variation.. I guess that's good. Might explain why he tried the end-around on a platform on me that one time if nobody shot at him or got his attention. As for the tethers... granted I'm running a high intellect build but if I tether in front of the vessel I basically would always have it back in time for late in the shade fight. After finishing the struggles and getting my third character over the finish line with Dumien, thebb22 and company with static platforms I'm not sure I have a ton of fresh insight. When floating I absolutely depended on that invincibility bubble getting there so I can could pick off my knight. I to this moment really am not sure why it took us so long. We had an epic fail early on when we were done. That kind of drained everyone's spirits a bit. @theb22 got to learn a little about life on the ground as he was second string runner. Still not completely sure about knight #4 when he is door side. Or rather, not sure if I would be able to melt him from the invincibility aura. Venturing out there when there are a couple of acolyte eyes and friends = I dunno.
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wings
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Post by wings on Dec 21, 2015 6:24:17 GMT -5
Oh was that the strategy when Post joined? I was on a platform then so I've probably not remembered properly as usual. I only mentioned if there is basically one more extra Hunter than usual because I hardly see Warlocks in the Oryx fight. From what I've played, having two of each character on all parts of the Raid is good enough. Prior to the challenge mode, I've had people using bubbles on the Daughter's platform. Actually, it's best to save the tether for the Shade and just chuck grenades on the adds surrounding the Vessel. I've had players tactical loitering in the bubbles when I've ran the relic when they can pop in and out and deal damage. Even jumping out of the bubble and chucking grenades would be something. I noticed when I chucked a grenade on to the Vessel, even if he is 'immune', he will crouch/shield. Sometimes he legs it after a blight, sometimes he's oblivious to it.
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Dec 21, 2015 6:32:26 GMT -5
I think it was, not sure if it continued to be when he switched to knight-murderer Warlock, but I seem to remember someone on a platform being responsible for giving bubbles in the middle.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Dec 21, 2015 11:13:17 GMT -5
BTW Ice pretty much showed off the Nighthawk relic runner strat I was talking about. His intelligence wasn't high enough to get his super back every round, but he eliminated the Vessel from the equation almost every round...I mean it IS a one shot and the relic runner always has the be near the vessel...it makes sense for him to be the vessel slayer.
Croft always took care of knight 4 on door side with his sunsinger like I was doing the day before with wings' crew. That is why he died so often during that phase. If the knight was on Oryx side we would just wait for the aura and pick him off at range.
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Post by thebb22 on Dec 21, 2015 11:16:15 GMT -5
Last night was definitely a learning experience for me being on the ground for a change. I know I goofed a couple times, but I think I got the hang of it pretty quick. Most of it was just getting a feel for where things were spawning and what was going to be trying to kill me, etc. wings I will say when I was in the group with you and some of your other crew, there is no question that Snipemaster chick was running the relic too slow. I know I mentioned it a couple times and a couple other people did too. I didn't want to get rude about it or anything and wanted to see if she'd get any better/faster, but that didn't happen. That vessel should be getting dunked on pretty much right out of the ship. There were times the vessel was already in the middle and she had just jumped down from her last platform. That's why people were getting killed on their platforms. The running has to be done extremely quickly so people aren't stuck out there exposed to all the eyeballs and centurions.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Dec 21, 2015 11:34:37 GMT -5
Also we were doing the Blessing/Weapons bubble strat wings. Your 310 titan buddy was running ToM I just refuse to run Touch of Malice because it severely limits my utility and ability to handle unforeseen situations and being down a man. A round of 8 sleeper shots will down every ogre with only one person landing a single sniper high damage sniper crit. I use this to my advantage on the last two round usually. I can pop heavy once before the fight and by the time round 3 rolls around...after ogres I can pop heavy again to almost one man ogres. That is my ideal add clearing strat. The touch strategy is alright, but the reason I don't think it is ideal is because on patterns [L2->L1->R1->R2] and [R1->R2->L2->L1] the adds that spawn from the first ogre death get about 13 seconds to spawn/set up acolyte eyes/set up before the floaters roll around to that side again to handle ogre 4. This means that baring flawless lucky add handling from platform 1 (because it is on relic side...only one person is there) the add cleaners are going to get bombarded by centurion bombs and acolyte eyes. My solution to this problem is to charge strafe using the sleeper (charge inside the bubble to strafe outside and crit the ogre). Yesterday we didn't use a blessing bubble... This is by far the most dangerous part for me...and I recall saying a few times "I can't handle the knight yet I'm still at a sliver" or something. That said I can usually do it and I have enough confidence in myself to try. P.S. a bit issue with the fight is that the jobs are so far removed from each other. It is hard when multiple people are comfortable with the exact same job.
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hebbnh
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Post by hebbnh on Dec 21, 2015 12:42:10 GMT -5
Also we were doing the Blessing/Weapons bubble strat wings. Your 310 titan buddy was running ToM I just refuse to run Touch of Malice because it severely limits my utility and ability to handle unforeseen situations and being down a man. A round of 8 sleeper shots will down every ogre with only one person landing a single sniper high damage sniper crit. I use this to my advantage on the last two round usually. I can pop heavy once before the fight and by the time round 3 rolls around...after ogres I can pop heavy again to almost one man ogres. That is my ideal add clearing strat. The touch strategy is alright, but the reason I don't think it is ideal is because on patterns [L2->L1->R1->R2] and [R1->R2->L2->L1] the adds that spawn from the first ogre death get about 13 seconds to spawn/set up acolyte eyes/set up before the floaters roll around to that side again to handle ogre 4. This means that baring flawless lucky add handling from platform 1 (because it is on relic side...only one person is there) the add cleaners are going to get bombarded by centurion bombs and acolyte eyes. My solution to this problem is to charge strafe using the sleeper (charge inside the bubble to strafe outside and crit the ogre). Yesterday we didn't use a blessing bubble... This is by far the most dangerous part for me...and I recall saying a few times "I can't handle the knight yet I'm still at a sliver" or something. That said I can usually do it and I have enough confidence in myself to try. P.S. a bit issue with the fight is that the jobs are so far removed from each other. It is hard when multiple people are comfortable with the exact same job. I can say with high confidence that there isn't much luck involved in clearing a few adds on your own from platform 1, because I had to do exactly that multiple times during my 3 LFG clears -- I took the platform 1 assignment every run. It's two acolytes and possibly a centurion (seems like there's a centurion half the time, don't know what exactly triggers it). It's not really that much to handle. Ogre 1 melts immediately, the knight gets headshotted into oblivion almost immediately, then you have to kill a couple acolytes that die in two or three TOM shots in a ~10 second window. If there's a centurion, shoot his tracking balls and dodge a little bit. Use smoke grenades, bubble, or self-res to help if necessary, depending on your class. If you can't down the centurion on your own, just hold aggro until you can get to the middle and get your Blessing or invincibility aura and then melt him (and by this time you probably have 2 other people shooting him as well). The add cleaners shouldn't have any issues if the person assigned to platform 1 does their job even halfway competently (i.e. doesn't just kill the knight and then sit there doing nothing), and platform 1 is NOT a difficult assignment to do halfway competently.
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