wittyscorpion
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Post by wittyscorpion on Oct 29, 2015 16:53:44 GMT -5
Besides the sniper rifle, which of the King's Fall weapons are actually worth keeping? My Warlock is 299 and I might infuse any dud weapons from the Raid if it gets me to 300 so I can get a chance for 310 Exotics in Nightfalls. It is universally agreed that the MG is the best pony, which I agree. I also heard the Hand Cannon is pretty solid, but I haven't got one yet. It is also universally agreed that the AutoR is horrible. I think its main problem is recoil pattern. People diverge on all other weapons, suggesting that they are all in the "meh" category. I personally like the following (in the descending order, PvE only): 1) Shotty 2) RL 3) ScoutR / SniperR However, there are better alternatives for weapons in 3): DO's Hung Jury > ScoutR, Black Spindle >> SniperR Did not play much with PulseR and FusionR, because ScoutR and Shotty can do the same job but better.
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wings
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Post by wings on Oct 29, 2015 19:05:24 GMT -5
I have the sniper rifle and I'll be keeping it. So it looks like the machine gun is the next gun I want to keep. The rest is infusion fodder.
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wittyscorpion
True Brorange
All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 1, 2015 15:45:43 GMT -5
A not widely known fact about Raid's shader:
you do NOT have to have a full set on a single class. You can combine the raid amor pieces from different classes on a single character and earn the shader!
Sadly I can't verify this myself because I don't have a normal raid boot and harrowed helmet / gauntlet.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 2, 2015 13:07:32 GMT -5
Ship jumping instruction tailored for orientation challenged folks like me, because at least I have a solid grasp of the clock face :
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tooros
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Post by tooros on Nov 3, 2015 6:26:19 GMT -5
One has raided. Got some toys. Nothing spectacular but new loot all the same. Jumping hell. The slope bit I found worse than the ships. Tried hard mode last night. Didn't get to priest in the hour we had but close. Reset today. Hopefully back in tonight. Really liked it. Loved the fact no one could really sit back.
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exxtrooper
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Post by exxtrooper on Nov 7, 2015 16:03:38 GMT -5
For the people who are having problems with hard mode (and excuse me if there has already been a mention of this strategy around here) there is the "No Knight Strategy". Essentially what you do is the people standing on the platform completely ignore the ogres, the two floaters (person on add duty, other person that has no platform) stay on the sisters platforms and "soften up" the ogres to low health, after the runner has grabbed the relic, everyone jumps on top of the platform to stagger oryx, then everyone shoots all the ogres down at the same time, jump down and trigger the ogres, then shoot oryx. Why is this a good strategy? Because of how the encounter is set up, no additional enemies will spawn before you kill ogres, this also prevents the light eater knights from being a problem as you can ignore them entirely. You also dont need to shoot oryx knight either to damage oryx (though watch out he might take someones corrupted orb). Also, after you stagger oryx, you actually have about 30 seconds to kill adds and ogres, the timer starts when the first person goes on a corrupted orb, for this reason its very important to have everyone run for the orbs at the same time. Crouching on the back of the platforms when ogres spawn keep you completely from being shot by anything, it is very important that the platform people dont shoot the ogres in order for the two floaters to agro them easily. Here's a more detailed guide explaining the strategy: www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/3q2p0f/easiest_by_far_hm_oryx_strategy/Here's a video of the strat in action from runner point of view:
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 7, 2015 17:33:22 GMT -5
Dumien: time for you to give the detailed counter points of why you dislike the "no knight" strategy so much
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Nov 9, 2015 17:37:20 GMT -5
wittyscorpion, you can't like that post and then says "lol I have no idea where to go I just have you guys lead me through"
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
Posts: 8,598
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 9, 2015 17:58:12 GMT -5
LOL. Like = "I appreciate the info provided" =/= "I'll absorb the info and be competent at it" Otherwise I would be the expert of everything by now, because I like to "like" things, excessively...
On the topic of "No Knight" strategy: Dumien: I would like to hear your counter arguments of why you hate this strat with passion. After I played with a LFG team using it last night, it seems to me that this is an easier strat (or at least just as viable as the other strat). Granted: We did not successfully kill Oryx in the limited time we played, but at one point we got very very close (completed two "dimensions" and just need 1 more detonations before the final DPS check, when the Relic Runner missed a jump which caused the wipe). The formula: 0) At the opening, get adds into the middle and tether to produce orbs (same for both strats); 1) Defender Titan along with the free roamer (the one whose platform is directly under the relic) are responsible for Blessing + ToM Ogres to < 25% health, on top of the sister platform opposite to the Oryx; 2) Platformers to pop a couple of Sniper shots at the Ogre and immediately site down at the edge of platform (by doing this the Ogres won't kill them); 3) The Ogre controllers need to keep Ogres' attention from drifting away towards the relic runner; 4) After Relic runner gets the relic, platformers jump to the nearest Sister platform then to the platform where 2) is; 5) DPS check (from the sister platform); 6) Kill Ogres (from the sister platform); 7) Platformers detonate the bombs, while the relic runner and 1 remaining player DPS Oryx; 8) Run around; Rinse and repeat 1-8 until dimension time. The rest are just like NM. What are the main problems you see with this sequence, other than the requirements of at least 1 Titan?
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qupie
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Post by qupie on Nov 12, 2015 6:32:57 GMT -5
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Post by Pegasus Actual on Nov 12, 2015 7:54:17 GMT -5
Witty, shoot your ogre. And shoot your knight. And don't die.
The End.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 12, 2015 10:31:24 GMT -5
I believe that the top response in the reddit thread is the top reason for no-knight strat:
The LFG group I played with that almost killed Oryx, we started with "Knight" strat but after a couple of runs it became obvious that the group can't pull it off (can't even get through the first denotation). Switched to "no knight" and the runs can get much deeper, including the one that "almost" made it.
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qupie
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Post by qupie on Nov 12, 2015 11:13:01 GMT -5
Seems to be a skill --> RNG tradeoff to me.
You remove some skill/gear-check in favor of some high risk high reward.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 17, 2015 12:03:32 GMT -5
Dumien: I would like to hear your counter arguments of why you hate this strat with passion. After I played with a LFG team using it last night, it seems to me that this is an easier strat (or at least just as viable as the other strat). I did in my last post on this thread. Get good at being on platforms guys. Know, understand, and remember where you are supposed to be at what time. Don't rely on a strategy that can go wrong just because you had bad luck. I should also mention (on an unrelated note) that being Add cleaner as a warlock is pretty much my favorite job in ANY raid...beating out relic holder for VoG templar by a wide margin. I love love love sniping, solar grenading, and pulsing the first three ogres and then uppdering the final ogre. The self res also lets you slay the knights in their spawn which is pretty sweet imo. Also on the DPS phase I often find myself in odd places shooting Oryx in the tum-tum.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Nov 17, 2015 13:52:03 GMT -5
Holy crap, I got through my school's filter... gotta make this quick! Tl:DR: did the NM raid, am a 305/6er now... got the raid scout rifle, hand cannon, shot gun, and launcher, chest and warlock bond. HC sucked and infused it, kept the rest and power leveled it with bounties and motes and tele's... it was fun and I ran the middle and took care of ogres and the Vessel (1 shotted the bugger with my Raze Lighter) bradman... you will absolutely f%%king hate this raid. The jumping parts are bat$hit insane that make the disappearing platforms in the VoG look positively easy! But most importantly: I got the CF's I needed and thanks to a psnfriend TJ, I got my Touch of malice... a beast of a weapon that's well worth the grind
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 17, 2015 14:59:25 GMT -5
Dumien: I would like to hear your counter arguments of why you hate this strat with passion. After I played with a LFG team using it last night, it seems to me that this is an easier strat (or at least just as viable as the other strat). I did in my last post on this thread. Get good at being on platforms guys. Know, understand, and remember where you are supposed to be at what time. Don't rely on a strategy that can go wrong just because you had bad luck. I should also mention (on an unrelated note) that being Add cleaner as a warlock is pretty much my favorite job in ANY raid...beating out relic holder for VoG templar by a wide margin. I love love love sniping, solar grenading, and pulsing the first three ogres and then uppdering the final ogre. The self res also lets you slay the knights in their spawn which is pretty sweet imo. Also on the DPS phase I often find myself in odd places shooting Oryx in the tum-tum. The problem is: we can only get < 2 hours per week on Oryx HM at the best. Sometimes not at all. No knight strat would be able to give us a much more realistic shot to pull it off. I totally agree that "no knight" strat should not be the canonical way to get through Oryx, it is more of "training wheel" strat. Get too used to it can make a group to become "lazy". However, in this particular case I am not too worried. Once we get through Oryx 2-3 times and get our light level higher, we can easily switch back to the normal strat because it is not that different from what we were doing in NM.
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 17, 2015 15:05:41 GMT -5
"Canonical" has nothing to do with it. If you are at or above 311 the regular strategy is better. Hell, we did it with wings today (someone who had never tried it more than once) and he was BELOW 311. Too much can go wrong that you can't account for with the no knight. I already discussed this. Trust me...it can feel like an easy switch if you are a platformer. Try being the runner.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Nov 17, 2015 16:06:57 GMT -5
From my research.....
Noknight is good if you are being carried. Take me for example: when I do KFHM, the group will probably do it NKnight, because I and probably others, will be in the mid 300's with someone who knows what they are doing and in the mid 3teens doing the heavy lifting. Much like when you are the scrub that stands on the window ledge in crota's end, and your job is to 1) simply Gjallie Crota into kneeling and 2) don't die and trigger the oversoul, where as the hardest work comes from the swordbearer... in the KF, the runner who has to jump and death with all dem ogres is under a lot of pressure to get the job done, otherwise, wipe city
Knight is good if you all have an experienced crew who are relatively high light level (315ish) and are all experienced. You can get the job done quick because everyone is a higher light level and can dish out max damage with your ToMalice's to put down the ogre and knights quick.
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wittyscorpion
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All warfare is based on deception.
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Post by wittyscorpion on Nov 17, 2015 16:20:35 GMT -5
Anyway, at the very least learning both won't hurt. I guess we can leave it at that. Only after a player to have played both can he actually obtain an in-depth understanding of the pros and cons.
Regarding the runner problem in "no knight" strat: I was told in an LFG attempt that if done right the Orge killers on top of the sister platforms can keep Orges occupied so they don't harass the runner, and it did not sound difficult.
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Nov 17, 2015 17:13:02 GMT -5
Holy crap, I got through my school's filter... gotta make this quick! Tl:DR: did the NM raid, am a 305/6er now... got the raid scout rifle, hand cannon, shot gun, and launcher, chest and warlock bond. HC sucked and infused it, kept the rest and power leveled it with bounties and motes and tele's... it was fun and I ran the middle and took care of ogres and the Vessel (1 shotted the bugger with my Raze Lighter) bradman... you will absolutely f%%king hate this raid. The jumping parts are bat$hit insane that make the disappearing platforms in the VoG look positively easy! But most importantly: I got the CF's I needed and thanks to a psnfriend TJ, I got my Touch of malice... a beast of a weapon that's well worth the grind Pretty sure I won't be raiding this time around.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Nov 17, 2015 17:24:06 GMT -5
Holy crap, I got through my school's filter... gotta make this quick! Tl:DR: did the NM raid, am a 305/6er now... got the raid scout rifle, hand cannon, shot gun, and launcher, chest and warlock bond. HC sucked and infused it, kept the rest and power leveled it with bounties and motes and tele's... it was fun and I ran the middle and took care of ogres and the Vessel (1 shotted the bugger with my Raze Lighter) bradman... you will absolutely f%%king hate this raid. The jumping parts are bat$hit insane that make the disappearing platforms in the VoG look positively easy! But most importantly: I got the CF's I needed and thanks to a psnfriend TJ, I got my Touch of malice... a beast of a weapon that's well worth the grind Pretty sure I won't be raiding this time around. No, we'll watch, laugh, mock, teabag, and desecrate your corpse. And someone will show you how to do it. You just can't get frustrated. and if you do then you'll just stay dead and the rest will go on and you'll be pilled through. All you'll miss is an exotic drop chest. It's a great raid, you can't miss out on it... We just need to get you closer to 300
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Dumien
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Post by Dumien on Nov 17, 2015 17:26:13 GMT -5
Yes I recommend learning both anyways as the no knight strat is fantastically useful when you lose a player or two in the latter parts of the oryx fight. It lets you salvage an otherwise unwinnable situation.
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qupie
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Post by qupie on Nov 18, 2015 5:36:58 GMT -5
For most of the jumping, use your sword. It really gives you a nice extra movement option. It makes the Oryxdick part way way easier.
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tooros
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Post by tooros on Nov 18, 2015 12:03:44 GMT -5
Holy crap, I got through my school's filter... gotta make this quick! Tl:DR: did the NM raid, am a 305/6er now... got the raid scout rifle, hand cannon, shot gun, and launcher, chest and warlock bond. HC sucked and infused it, kept the rest and power leveled it with bounties and motes and tele's... it was fun and I ran the middle and took care of ogres and the Vessel (1 shotted the bugger with my Raze Lighter) bradman... you will absolutely f%%king hate this raid. The jumping parts are bat$hit insane that make the disappearing platforms in the VoG look positively easy! But most importantly: I got the CF's I needed and thanks to a psnfriend TJ, I got my Touch of malice... a beast of a weapon that's well worth the grind Pretty sure I won't be raiding this time around. Dude - dm has worse jumping skills than anyone. Ever. We've managed it twice now. You have to do it. I think it's better than the other two. You'll miss out. Come with us and YOU WILL NOT BE WORSE AT IT THAN dm - I promise!
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wings
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Post by wings on Nov 19, 2015 15:15:28 GMT -5
"Canonical" has nothing to do with it. If you are at or above 311 the regular strategy is better. Hell, we did it with wings today (someone who had never tried it more than once) and he was BELOW 311. Too much can go wrong that you can't account for with the no knight. I already discussed this. Trust me...it can feel like an easy switch if you are a platformer. Try being the runner. Actually it was my first time ever with HM Oryx even though I said it wasn't in the raid, so even better then. I was still recovering from two and a half hours sleep having Irn Bru for breakfast so I got it confused with the Daughters stage, since I took the same damage penalty anyway. And I have a question, can you only take damage from the Echo of Oryx if you're on the ground? Just when I got teleported I had no time to see where the Echo of Oryx was so I didn't want to jump into him even if I was in mid-air in case the melee damage has a spherical radius that can damage me.
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qupie
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Post by qupie on Nov 20, 2015 5:00:30 GMT -5
You can certainly take damage in the air. But it will never OHK you as far as I know.
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Nov 20, 2015 10:22:05 GMT -5
Pretty sure I won't be raiding this time around. Dude - dm has worse jumping skills than anyone. Ever. We've managed it twice now. You have to do it. I think it's better than the other two. You'll miss out. Come with us and YOU WILL NOT BE WORSE AT IT THAN dm - I promise! Clearly we must find out
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bradman
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Post by bradman on Nov 20, 2015 16:10:01 GMT -5
GUARDIAN DOWN
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wings
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Post by wings on Nov 21, 2015 14:27:31 GMT -5
Do the Warpriest and Golgoroth count as Hive or Taken?
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markopolo
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Post by markopolo on Nov 28, 2015 8:22:49 GMT -5
Done the Kf hm raid, didn't beat oryx though Very unforgiving, especially with pugs and unsalvagable when someone dies, except on the bombs. Didn't help that I was total shit last night... Just lucky Hawk didn't see this display of brainfarts and ineptitude Frustrating night but I'll get it And there'd better be a high ll boots waiting in the chest for me
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