probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 6, 2012 0:32:53 GMT -5
The MP44 should be in the Assault Rifle category. What rate of fire did you use for the manual action weapons (CoD4 and Black Ops)? For the bolt action rifles I used the rechamberTimes. For the shotguns I used the lesser of either their fireTimes or 0.096 (625 RPM). I used the numbers I found in Den's charts. Edit: MP44 is now an assault rifle.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 6, 2012 0:30:16 GMT -5
But then you could change the formula somehow to time to shoot again or something. Barrett is around 145rpm, not sure. If the M21 can recenter in 250 (don't know, only an example) it is much better. Just change it so the barrett isn't in the thousands Well, you're asking for something completely different now (not that I don't like the idea) but this isn't something this code is designed for. Maybe I'll do something like that while trying to get the GunKick numbers.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 6, 2012 0:15:59 GMT -5
You should cap the barrett. Nobody shoots it at 625rpm (unless they are noobs). You should make the semi autos the time it takes to recenter them. Then the recoil would be zero . I wanted to capture a realistic worst-case scenario with those weapons, but no one seemed to think 625 was an unreasonable cap (until now).
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 5, 2012 23:38:41 GMT -5
You have my permission... to die! Sorry, fixing... Edit: Fixed.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 5, 2012 23:31:28 GMT -5
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 5, 2012 19:19:18 GMT -5
I think I remember seeing your work. That was the little app that produced out recoil plots and had a feature to offset the original point of aim, right? It's unfortunate that we don't have those GunKick, numbers, I know . I don't foresee my work doing anything like that, though. By the way, I'm glad someone suggested using the CoD4 numbers as a "dry run". I found a bug in the program, where the code wasn't properly handling the switch between the two decay values. I'm patching it up right now. Expect the CoD4 results sometime tomorrow, if not sooner. That's not my work, hasn't released yet. Do you remember what's that tool's name or on which site? It was created by a fellow Bro. I'm sure it was introduced in a stickied thread but now that I want to find it I can't. Murphy's Law, eh? I think I fixed up the bug in the program, but I've been working on it on a different computer that doesn't have the CoD4 weaponlist I created to run the program on. So I may be able to, when I get home, run the program and have those results up within a couple of hours.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 4, 2012 9:58:16 GMT -5
The M16 and MP5 were buffed to 895 RPM and the PM9's recoil was reduced by 22%. Maybe keep the old measurements for comparison. Sure, I'll make a ninth draft with all the changes sometime tomorrow. About the CoD4 results: I've run into a bigger bug than I previously thought. Basically, the equations got so complicated that I had to start running a numerical method to try to calculate a value I need for the GunKick probability distributions. But for some reason, it sometimes takes 10-15 seconds to calculate this number (per weapon). I'm trying to figure out why this is happening, so I can't say when those results will be out.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Aug 2, 2012 12:44:39 GMT -5
I did some similar things before, and maybe considered some different things. 1. Player knows the average recoil value, and constantly move their crosshair by a reversed velocity. 2. I suppose reaction time is 0.3s, player will aim the gun at the point 0.3s before. But now I know my previous work will never be accurate because of gunkick. I think I remember seeing your work. That was the little app that produced out recoil plots and had a feature to offset the original point of aim, right? It's unfortunate that we don't have those GunKick, numbers, I know . I don't foresee my work doing anything like that, though. By the way, I'm glad someone suggested using the CoD4 numbers as a "dry run". I found a bug in the program, where the code wasn't properly handling the switch between the two decay values. I'm patching it up right now. Expect the CoD4 results sometime tomorrow, if not sooner.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 31, 2012 15:07:32 GMT -5
Fox just goes around banning people based on the techinicality of the CoC. Someone can be a blantly obvoius troll (like TSD), and Fox will do nothing. Yet he'll ban an internet superhero like trollhunterpro just because he technically did something against the CoC. Fox is a dick, end of story. Watch, someone's gonna make a username hating him, like someone did for TSD. (Example: TrialStarD1pdoo-doo) Someones gonna do something like: FoxHoundD1pdoo-doo I bet that somebody's going to do that. ;D I'll laugh. Those official CoD forums sound like a nasty, evil place .
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 31, 2012 14:23:38 GMT -5
Oh... you mean consoles don't have a Print Screen button? Kidding. Complete brain fart on my behalf.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 31, 2012 13:31:04 GMT -5
Why doesn't someone shoot a wall with every gun and kick/no kick and do it that way? Seems like that's the only way to get an accurate idea of recoil. /Not it! I planned on doing that but I have no means of screencapping. 1. Ctrl+Print Screen to take the screenie 2. Open Paint 3. Paste Have at it .
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 31, 2012 13:11:07 GMT -5
Why doesn't someone shoot a wall with every gun and kick/no kick and do it that way? Seems like that's the only way to get an accurate idea of recoil. /Not it! Nope. You're it. Get on it ya mug.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 31, 2012 11:30:45 GMT -5
♜ ♞ ♝ ♛ ♚ ♝ ♞ ♜ ♟ ♟ ♟ ♟ ♟ ♟ ♟ ♟ … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … … ♙ … … … … … … … … … … … ♙ ♙ ♙ ♙ … ♙ ♙ ♙ ♖ ♘ ♗ ♕ ♔ ♗ ♘ ♖ Your move. Since when does black move first?
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 30, 2012 11:08:51 GMT -5
Did you test this out with CoD4's gun numbers? No, not yet. But I suppose that is all I can do at this point, so I'll do it sometime this week.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 28, 2012 13:31:11 GMT -5
I've patched up the BO results in the eighth draft to include the sniper rifles. I also need to mention something about the code I modified to accommodate GunKick. In the "How does GunKick work " thread, we discovered that GunKick allows the irons to cross both the x and y axes during a single kick. As it turns out, this actually makes modelling the behavior of the gun more difficult, not less. This is because I would have to account for what is theoretically an infinite number of cross-axial jumps. Of course that can't happen in a finite amount of time (fireTime), but you can't know just from the fireTime alone how often that could happen. Also, it would ruin the linear relationship between the initial velocity (kick) of the gun and were it lands in a single kick. This would make the math just about gosh darn golly gee whiz impossible to deal with. So, I had to make a simplification: I assumed that the gun will stick to the axes just like it does with ViewKick. This assumption is only a problem if the decay values are very low, the acceleration (recentering) very high and the kick values very big. But I think we would all notice our guns swinging back and forth while firing them if it were a significant problem. I'll know if I can get away with this simplification if/when I get the GunKick numbers and plug 'em into the super-duper recoil chart generator. eLantern: Thanks for the nod. I think I said before that it was just as well that this wasn't stickied due to it being an unfinished work. But if it really is worthy of a sticky I would take it now, just for the fact that more people would see it and, perhaps, be willing to help me get the GunKick numbers from either Mark, Stuart, or whomever is able to help.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 27, 2012 22:02:53 GMT -5
You rage you lose class: Model + Kick M230 GLM Scavenger Assassin Sitrep I've got a better one: M16A4 + Kick/ACOG Deagle + Tac. Knife (yeah, I ADS my Deag) Frag Concussion Sleight of Hand Quickdraw Marksman Yeah, I'm certified.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 27, 2012 11:48:43 GMT -5
This is the best thread I've seen in a long time. Awesome work probaddie and I sure hope you can come upon the GunKick numbers... just reading everything in this thread is making me want to pop my MW3 back in and play. Thanks for the compliment. What can I say, I try . And it's done. My code can now take in GunKick variables and spit out statistics. I've done all the QA testing and it behaves exactly as it should. All I need is to get the GunKick numbers, input them into my weapon list -- this may take a while -- and punch out the ninth draft.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 27, 2012 9:02:54 GMT -5
I noticed you forgot the Black Ops sniper rifles. Also, will you add a CoD4 chart? Would be interesting to compare. Thank you for all your work on this! I know there are people who frequent these forums with strings to pull. And I've tried getting on Twitter to catch Mark Rubin but he is, understandably, very busy these days. But there got to be some way to get those numbers! So XboxAhoy didn't answer? Did you try to reach him on Twitter? No, I never tried getting through to him on Twitter. He doesn't seem to use it all that much, except to announce a new video. Not sure how I missed the BO sniper rifles. I might patch that up later today. A CoD4 chart would be nice, since we know the (obviously negligible) GunKick values for that game. I'd be a good test for the code anyway.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 27, 2012 0:37:43 GMT -5
So just to remind everyone that this is still an ongoing project, I'm dropping in to give an update.
I'm still working on incorporating GunKick into my code. I think the hardest part is done and I'm now trying to debug what I've got. (Specifically, I'm trying to figure out why GunKick contributes to recoil even when I set all the Kick values to 0... hmm...). I can't really say how long the debugging will take, but I can't see it taking longer than a couple of days, by which time I will need the GunKick numbers.
I know there are people who frequent these forums with strings to pull. And I've tried getting on Twitter to catch Mark Rubin but he is, understandably, very busy these days. But there got to be some way to get those numbers!
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 23, 2012 15:43:55 GMT -5
Overkill Pro allows you 2 proficiencies on your primary. So now you have a huge choice to make: drastically improve your weapon or remain stealthy. Overkill now becomes the "Stopping Power" replacement to keep Assassin from running rampant. Man, I can't imagine the fun I'd have with that. Imagine an L86 with Grip, Thermal and Kick! Or a Type with Kick, Stability and RF. Or... [mind melts into a liquefied goop]
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 16, 2012 0:44:18 GMT -5
The eighth draft has been patched to reflect corrections made possible by Marvel4 with respect to the CM901, SCAR-L and M60E4.
Oh, and I'll upload the latest version of my code tomorrow. (Does anyone actually look at the code? I really only upload it for transparency's sake, but I'm curious to know.)
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 22:52:57 GMT -5
Oh, also, that program cant be used to reflect anything accurate as he has the old X,Y displacement + velocity centerspeed vs X,Y Velocity + acceleration centerspeed At least I think thats what is wrong with it. No, his simulations always assumed (correctly) that the game used a velocity/acceleration model. But the game applies two different accelerations during deflection (the gun moving away from center in either axis) and re-centering (moving towards center): The magic formula view recovery = CS*FT/5 is still correct, but the gun does not follow a symmetric trajectory, as it would if it were under the effect of a single, constant acceleration. Edit: Wait, you were referring to psijaka's plots, right?
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 9:27:43 GMT -5
I think with the advent of recon, they're pretty gosh darn golly gee whiz balanced at this point. Yeah, I have no problem with them in this game either, though I never use them myself. It's one of the things that -- dare I say it? -- they got right with this iteration of the series.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 9:20:33 GMT -5
Yeah, those are wrong. The CM901's correct pitch is -60 and 65 (the picture in the guide is moved up). The SCAR-L has a minimum pitch of -5 (no mistake in the guide, I don't know why this is wrong in the spreadsheet). The M60's recoil in the guide is wrong. I tested it in-game and unlike the MG36, the recoil always goes up, like in CoD4 and Black Ops, so its minimum pitch must be 10, not -10. I guess you have the correct centerspeed for the handguns (750 for the USP, P99 and Desert Eagle and 1000 for the Five-seven). Alright, thanks again for your help. I'll just patch up those results using the correct numbers later today. You should be the official Den Kirson Editor-in-chief . How the hell did you pick up on the +/- 5 ViewKick error on the CM901 and SCAR-L from my results?! And yes, those match with my CenterSpeed values for the handguns.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 7:54:37 GMT -5
lol CM901. Foxtrotting hopeless. Did you use the correct values? Also, what values did you use for the SCAR-L and M60? CM901: 60 left/60 right/45 down/80 up, 1450 CS, 666 RPM SCAR-L: 25 left/ 50 right/10 down/ 40 up, 1100 CS, 750 RPM M60: 80 left/80 right/ 10 down/60 up, 1500 CS, 600 RPM Those seem to match up with the spreadsheet. Do some of the results seem really off to you or is there some controversy as to the true numbers for those weapons?
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 2:01:58 GMT -5
The only thing the Enfield has over the Galil is its CenterSpeed with an Infrared Scope on (it maintains a 1500 CenterSpeed when equipped with it). The Enfield also has a faster ADS (0.2 seconds vs 0.25 seconds). Oh, and that. Missed that somehow...
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 1:21:01 GMT -5
I think they're in common_mp.ff. I think you're right. I think this is the telling line of garbled nonsense that validates your theory: Kidding . Damn encryption...
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 1:18:45 GMT -5
Those recoil charts make the Enfield seem like a top tier weapon: low recoil, fast ads time, and good damage/ fire rate. I'm definitely going to try it out a lot more ( with my trusty cz75 extended mags obviously ) It's always been a good weapon -- the fact that its recoil is identical with the Galil's is not news to anyone here -- but its always been outclassed by the Galil for the fact that its damage is 35-25 compared to the Galil's 40-30. The only thing the Enfield has over the Galil is its CenterSpeed with an Infrared Scope on (it maintains a 1500 CenterSpeed when equipped with it). So, if you love the IR Scope, use Enfield. Otherwise, keep the Galil.
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 15, 2012 1:00:19 GMT -5
Really? Those files weren't changed when the game itself was updated (e.g. during the FAMAS nerf)? Unfortunately not. I'm currently testing some weapons to find more secrets like the multipliers on sniper rifles. Are you... really? What. The. Fucking. Hell. But where else does the game read the variables for each gun?!
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probaddie
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Post by probaddie on Jul 14, 2012 23:08:36 GMT -5
main\iw_00.iwd\weapons\mp Some values may be outdated, however. Really? Those files weren't changed when the game itself was updated (e.g. during the FAMAS nerf)?
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