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Post by -3055- on Nov 18, 2013 17:23:39 GMT -5
Depends. K7 sucks. I'd use mtar with silencer than k7 with grip and rapid fire.
It's all about preference. I find the extra silencer on the honey badger great as it allows a total of 3 attachments for free, but from a purely statistical standpoint the CZ-805 is better than it in most aspects, so if you don't care about silencers then there's no reason to use the honey badger over the CZ-805.
Also, from a purely range based point of view, the honey badger is on the worse side of the AR range dropoff spectrum. They obviously designed the honey badger with the built in silencer in mind.
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Post by sephloc on Nov 19, 2013 3:22:56 GMT -5
But but symthic.com/cod-ghosts-compare?Chain_SAW_vs_Ameli says the Chain Saw fires @ 857 rpm! Who do I believe?! My world is spinning out of control! (If I'm on a console is it worth putting rapid fire on the saw? Am I better off with armor piercing ammo? Extended mags?) |
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Post by aidsaidsaids on Nov 19, 2013 7:00:06 GMT -5
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 19, 2013 7:30:46 GMT -5
The symthic charts take RPM values from the game files which is 'more accurate' BUT you should know that on console you will NEVER achieve the RPMs that are listed there. The RPMs in mine/pwnsweets chart are rpms that you actually get while using the gun (assuming constant 60fps).
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Post by sephloc on Nov 19, 2013 10:44:29 GMT -5
Xbox 360.
Anyway I thought that on the console everything gets rounded to certain flat values (IIRC in this case it'd be 720 rather than 726).
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Post by -3055- on Nov 19, 2013 11:04:26 GMT -5
Speaking of which:
Corpse you really need to update bulldog rpm. It is definitely not 300. Symthic says 450 but I definitely think it's at least 550.
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Post by deston on Nov 19, 2013 11:42:16 GMT -5
Speaking of which: Corpse you really need to update bulldog rpm. It is definitely not 300. Symthic says 450 but I definitely think it's at least 550. It's not that much faster than the striker was, lol. |
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Post by -3055- on Nov 19, 2013 11:44:24 GMT -5
Personally it feels much faster than the mk14. So I don't think it's 450.
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 19, 2013 20:38:39 GMT -5
its difficult to get rpm values for the semi-auto guns but I may go back and do them using a different method if I get some time.
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 19, 2013 20:49:27 GMT -5
I tested both on PS3 and 360, I got the same results. Though, when you actually play the game online, the lower framerate will of course change the RPM  |
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Post by sephloc on Nov 20, 2013 1:28:48 GMT -5
So... so.. do I put rapid fire on my Chain Saw or not? <(@_@)>  . |
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qupie
True Bro
Posts: 12,400
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Post by qupie on Nov 20, 2013 5:22:19 GMT -5
I think the only way to find that out for sure is to make a distribution for both consoles, while shooting (and being shot at). Preferably online, on at least 3 different map (sizes), with full teams of 6 who just play a regular game. Only then you can get realistic frame rates. That distribution can then be used to create a ROF distribution, which can lead to a average ROF per gun per platform. Because in reality the frame rate which happens the most often is way more important than an average frame rate (or than the frame rate when playing offline with nothing happening in the map, aka these charts). If we know this, we can calculate which of the rapid fire attachments have the biggest effect.
Right now, the charts are the closest to reality, but need to be taken with a grain of salt. As the bison shows no increased ROF on the charts, although a few drops in frame rate might make this completely different.
Frame rates of 60 both give 900 RPM, but a frame rate of 55 give the normal bison 825 RPM, while the rapid fire one gets 1100!!! 47-55 frames per second all give the rapid fire equivalent at an increase of at least 200 RPM. That is why it is pretty important to test the frame rate/ROF in an actual online environment IMHO.
EDIT: when you look at the MTAR, you can see that rapid fire does absolutely NOTHING for it in the 48-54 frames per second range! So I think the conclusion that the MTAR benefits greatest and bizon the least from rapid fire is not quite right, as a frame rate of 54 is not that uncommon I think.
If anybody with a capture card could find the frame rate distribution, I am willing to do the other calculations. I don't have a capture card sadly. (Just take 3 recent games you captured, and make a histogram of all the frame rates while you are firing your weapon (preferably only when shot at))
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Post by deston on Nov 20, 2013 8:27:57 GMT -5
I think the only way to find that out for sure is to make a distribution for both consoles, while shooting (and being shot at). Preferably online, on at least 3 different map (sizes), with full teams of 6 who just play a regular game. Only then you can get realistic frame rates. That distribution can then be used to create a ROF distribution, which can lead to a average ROF per gun per platform. Because in reality the frame rate which happens the most often is way more important than an average frame rate (or than the frame rate when playing offline with nothing happening in the map, aka these charts). If we know this, we can calculate which of the rapid fire attachments have the biggest effect. Right now, the charts are the closest to reality, but need to be taken with a grain of salt. As the bison shows no increased ROF on the charts, although a few drops in frame rate might make this completely different. Frame rates of 60 both give 900 RPM, but a frame rate of 55 give the normal bison 825 RPM, while the rapid fire one gets 1100!!! 47-55 frames per second all give the rapid fire equivalent at an increase of at least 200 RPM. That is why it is pretty important to test the frame rate/ROF in an actual online environment IMHO. EDIT: when you look at the MTAR, you can see that rapid fire does absolutely NOTHING for it in the 48-54 frames per second range! So I think the conclusion that the MTAR benefits greatest and bizon the least from rapid fire is not quite right, as a frame rate of 54 is not that uncommon I think. If anybody with a capture card could find the frame rate distribution, I am willing to do the other calculations. I don't have a capture card sadly. (Just take 3 recent games you captured, and make a histogram of all the frame rates while you are firing your weapon (preferably only when shot at)) I don't think you can measure framerates with the more prevalent capture devices. They're designed to just capture a steady 30 fps. |
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Usagi
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Grin and Barrett
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Post by Usagi on Nov 20, 2013 10:37:39 GMT -5
So... so.. do I put rapid fire on my Chain Saw or not? I recommend using Big Ammo instead of Rapid Fire. ChainSAW runs out of ammo too fast as it is, and the reload is brutal even with Sleight of Hand. Big Ammo+Silencer. |
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Post by -3055- on Nov 20, 2013 10:45:53 GMT -5
naw bro muzzle brake and rapid fire.
no one puts a silencer on a chainsaw
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hyperion
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Post by hyperion on Nov 20, 2013 12:44:03 GMT -5
no one puts a silencer on a chainsaw  |
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wings
True Bro
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Post by wings on Nov 20, 2013 14:06:55 GMT -5
So... so.. do I put rapid fire on my Chain Saw or not? <(@_@)> . No. |
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Post by LeGitBeeSting on Nov 20, 2013 15:01:47 GMT -5
Rapid fire master attachment as I would use SoH + Scav anyways.
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Post by -3055- on Nov 20, 2013 15:21:46 GMT -5
Maybe it's because I was bred through S&D but I never in my life used Slight of Hand.
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Post by -3055- on Nov 20, 2013 18:45:37 GMT -5
Yeah, pretty much. And the only times I used soh over steady aim in BO was when I was AK-74u rushing.
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Post by ElysMustache on Nov 21, 2013 0:03:16 GMT -5
I don't think you can measure framerates with the more prevalent capture devices. They're designed to just capture a steady 30 fps. Depends on what you buy. I have a Blackmagic Intensity Pro, and it captures 720p at 60 fps. Frames displayed is not necessarily equal to frames processed by the game, however. Meaning, it might just display the same frame twice or something. |
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adw1983
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Post by adw1983 on Nov 21, 2013 1:16:06 GMT -5
its difficult to get rpm values for the semi-auto guns but I may go back and do them using a different method if I get some time. Capture footage and measure the minimum number of frames between shots? I mean: It's either ~600 RPM, 529 RPM (...) |
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 21, 2013 3:29:56 GMT -5
If anybody with a capture card could find the frame rate distribution, I am willing to do the other calculations. I don't have a capture card sadly. (Just take 3 recent games you captured, and make a histogram of all the frame rates while you are firing your weapon (preferably only when shot at)) I have a capture card available and have written a script to calculate framerates but unfortunately the results are only accurate if you can record losslessly...which I cant do I've used this script in the past and it worked perfectly, I later found out that Digital Foundry wrote a script very similar to mine in order to calculate framerates for games. So yes it can be done but it does require lossless capture otherwise MPEG related macro-blocking will throw off the results. |
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 21, 2013 3:38:41 GMT -5
its difficult to get rpm values for the semi-auto guns but I may go back and do them using a different method if I get some time. Capture footage and measure the minimum number of frames between shots? I mean: It's either ~600 RPM, 529 RPM (...) Yeah thats how I did it last time. I think buffering shots over a full mag and calculating it that way gives you a more realistic rpm though. Of course, I would take multiple samples for each gun and then take the largest recorded rpm. |
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Post by ElysMustache on Nov 23, 2013 23:36:34 GMT -5
I have a capture card available and have written a script to calculate framerates but unfortunately the results are only accurate if you can record losslessly...which I cant do I can capture lossless. Are you limited by your HDD speed? You might be able to capture to a ramdisk, which is what I did before I got my SSD. |
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 24, 2013 6:02:32 GMT -5
No, HDD speed is not the issue. My card doesn't have the option to record lossless |
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Post by kriegor on Nov 24, 2013 22:45:52 GMT -5
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Post by corpsecreate on Nov 24, 2013 22:57:03 GMT -5
This has been answered many times. The spreadsheet is data collected from within the game by actually counting frames and measuring manually. The data on the symthic charts are taken from the game files but do NOT represent the actual RPMs you will achieve when playing the game. The RPM you get is dependent on the framerate of the game.
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Post by kriegor on Nov 24, 2013 23:03:13 GMT -5
Roger. But what about flash suppressor? I only find mixed input on this. Some say it reduces vertical recoil?
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Post by kriegor on Nov 24, 2013 23:31:17 GMT -5
Hmm.. would you be so kind to ask him about this and if he doesnt sure, take an educated guess based on the info he could gather? Because I am really not sure, but need to know. Its for making a custom ruleset in competetive PC gaming.
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